Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
Clusterheadaches.com
 
Search box updated Dec 3, 2011... Search ch.com with Google!
  HomeHelpSearchLoginRegisterEvent CalendarBirthday List  
 





Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Send Topic Print
A new beginning of coping (Read 2263 times)
fun2drum
CH.com Junior
**
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 55
Marion NC
Gender: male
A new beginning of coping
Sep 2nd, 2012 at 2:53pm
 
Hello I'm Gary and I've already been introduced on the getting to know ya forum, so you can get a little of my history there if you want.  Now that I've had a chance to look around the forum it appears that what I've read so far is only the tip of the iceberg.  Now I know there really is a large number of people who understand, which is the most important thing I've found so far.  This thing has kept me from being my best in my family, work, and play.  Everything and everyone in my life has been negatively affected to some degree by my constant but varying pain.  I honestly don't think I would even enjoy being around me, though people still seem to.  I guess I'm just good at covering up and getting away from people when things get too bad to cover.  Anyway, I went almost all day yesterday with a level 2 pain and only reached 4's and 5's around 11am today.  That's the best I've done in months.  Is it because I've been doing D3/Fish/Calcium for a few days?  IDK.  I also learned here to guzzle Red Bull.  That seems to reverse a 4 or 5 back down to a 2 without pain killers.  That's a big development for me.  I hope I'm right and it's not just the Beast tricking me again into a false confidence.  I'm trying not to ramble but so much is going through my mind, and I'm back down to a 3 from what was on the threshold of 5 about 20 minutes ago.  I'm tired from the past few years - my energy level is spent.  Now, though, I do feel like all of you are giving me a renewed hope.  It's a new beginning, so to speak.  I thank you all for being here and I hope I can somehow contribute something back at some point.
Back to top
  

Gary
A drummer with a headache.
Western NC - USA
 
IP Logged
 
ttnolan
CH.com Veteran
***
Offline


beats me


Posts: 247
Scotts Valley, CA
Gender: male
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #1 - Sep 2nd, 2012 at 6:41pm
 
Hi Gary and welcome. I remember when I first found this site, it is pretty incredible to know you are finally not alone... life changing actually.
I know what you mean about the duck and cover thing, we get pretty good at hiding our misery... just easier that way.
Keep reading... knowledge is power against the beast.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
wimsey1
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 2457
MA
Gender: male
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #2 - Sep 3rd, 2012 at 7:22am
 
I hid the attacks for about 15 years, even from my wife. But I was selling her and my kids short. They can handle it, it was I who couldn't handle being seen. Those all day shadows are the worst. You need to attack them as vigorously as you do any full on attack. Otherwise, they will keep hanging on, and hanging on...talk to your doctor about them. Your preventative isn't working as it should. Blessings. lance
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
japanzaman
CH.com Veteran
***
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 210
Fukuoka, JAPAN
Gender: male
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #3 - Sep 3rd, 2012 at 10:20am
 
Glad to hear things are looking up. I also recommend the D3 course. Also, any PF day or near PF day is a good day. Enjoy every one of them.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
fun2drum
CH.com Junior
**
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 55
Marion NC
Gender: male
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #4 - Sep 3rd, 2012 at 11:16am
 
Thanks everyone for the encouragement.  japanzaman, to have a PF day would be a major victory for me.  I haven't had one in over 3 years.   I consider a day with a few hours at level 1 or with only one level 4 to 5 attack to be a very good day.  Today has been very good so far - level 2 all morning.  I feel fortunate that I don't wake up often with a high level, except for a few times a month.  The night used to be my enemy, but now I'm attacked mostly during the day.  wimsey, I'm going to try to give earlier attention to the shadows because I'm known to wait too long and the beast gets a bit out of control sometimes.
Back to top
  

Gary
A drummer with a headache.
Western NC - USA
 
IP Logged
 
metoo
CH.com Junior
**
Offline




Posts: 56
ann arbor mi usa
Gender: male
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #5 - Sep 3rd, 2012 at 12:37pm
 
Gary,

Welcome to the group.  I am reasonably new as a member, and I will tell you that these folks are online because that want to help fast-track you.  They've helped me beyond belief.  If I ever win the lotto, I'm gonna book a cruise ship with all the CH stuff required and take as many of you as can fit. 

Oh, and don't be concerned about rambling.  Trust me, these guys are used to it.  I've even done my share.

TJ
Back to top
  

#4 - Avoid annoying people who don't deserve it.
 
IP Logged
 
Brew
CH.com Sponsor
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline




Posts: 14163
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #6 - Sep 3rd, 2012 at 2:44pm
 
Please share with us how much vitamin D3 you're taking each day.
Back to top
  

"I have been asked if I have changed in these past 25 years. No, I am the same. Only more so."  --Ayn Rand
 
IP Logged
 
fun2drum
CH.com Junior
**
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 55
Marion NC
Gender: male
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #7 - Sep 3rd, 2012 at 4:18pm
 
Brew wrote on Sep 3rd, 2012 at 2:44pm:
Please share with us how much vitamin D3 you're taking each day.


D3 5000 IU 2/day. 

Back to top
  

Gary
A drummer with a headache.
Western NC - USA
 
IP Logged
 
Batch
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline


Control The Beast With
O2 & D3 You Must


Posts: 3708
Bremerton, WA
Gender: male
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #8 - Sep 3rd, 2012 at 6:15pm
 
Hey Gary,

A number of CH'ers who started the vitamin D3 regimen at 10,000 IU/day reported finding relief from their CH much faster by upping the vitamin D3 dose to 20,000 IU/day with a 50,000 IU loading dose once a week.

There's a new study out that indicates using the higher daily dose along with the weekly loading dose elevates serum 25(OH)D a lot faster and very safely.

Co-factors (Calcium, Magnesium, zinc, Vitamin K2, Vitamin A, Boron, all at RDA) both improve vitamin D bio-availability and improve building of bones.

Once you experience a favorable response with a significant reduction in the frequency and severity of your CH... including no more shadows...  you can throttle back to a maintenance dose of 10,000 IU/day vitamin D3.  Keep all the cofactors at the regular dose...

Discuss this regimen with your PCP and try to get the lab test for your 25(OH)D as soon as possible.  Knowing your serum concentration of this vitamin D3 metabolite takes a lot of the guessing out of when you'll have a favorable response.

Take care and please keep us posted.

V/R, Batch
Back to top
« Last Edit: Sep 3rd, 2012 at 6:24pm by Batch »  

You love lots of things if you live around them. But there isn't any woman and there isn't any horse, that’s as lovely as a great airplane. If it's a beautiful fighter, your heart will be ever there
pete_batcheller  
IP Logged
 
fun2drum
CH.com Junior
**
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 55
Marion NC
Gender: male
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #9 - Sep 3rd, 2012 at 6:54pm
 
Do you think I could get toxic at 20,000 IU/day of D3?   I was kinda concerned about building up to toxic even at 10,000 IU.
Back to top
  

Gary
A drummer with a headache.
Western NC - USA
 
IP Logged
 
Brew
CH.com Sponsor
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline




Posts: 14163
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #10 - Sep 3rd, 2012 at 9:09pm
 
Far, far from it.

The first month I started the D3 regimen, I was doing 20,000 iu per day with a loading dose of 50,000 iu once a week.

I've scaled it back to 10,000 iu per day the last couple of months, and the last time I had my serum level checked I was at 74 mg/mL.

It would take a lot more than that to reach toxic levels.
Back to top
  

"I have been asked if I have changed in these past 25 years. No, I am the same. Only more so."  --Ayn Rand
 
IP Logged
 
fun2drum
CH.com Junior
**
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 55
Marion NC
Gender: male
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #11 - Sep 4th, 2012 at 6:51am
 
Alright I'll give that a shot and I'm supposed to go have bloodwork done in about a week anyway, so I'll make sure to have them pay attention to that. 

So far I'm finding that Red Bulls seem to kill an attack slightly faster than a hydrocodone, with a longer benefit.  The downside is I'm using 3/day and am still having to use pain meds once or twice more, but I'm feeling a little better for a little longer as a whole the past couple of days.  I got a free oxygen tank (borrowed) yesterday evening but I still have to go buy a regulator and mask today if I have time after work.  If the oxygen works like I hope, then I'll buy my own tank.
Back to top
  

Gary
A drummer with a headache.
Western NC - USA
 
IP Logged
 
Guiseppi
CH.com Moderator
CH.com Alumnus
*****
Offline


San Diego to Florida 05-16-2011


Posts: 12063
SAN DIEGO, CALIFORNIA USA
Gender: male
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #12 - Sep 4th, 2012 at 3:27pm
 
I use the oxygen with the red bull. 02 beats it down the red bull keeps it at bay. I started the "batch" regimen during my last cycle. I have been pain free two years. So yeah.....I'm a batch believer.

Joe
Back to top
  

"Somebody had to say it" is usually a piss poor excuse to be mean.
 
IP Logged
 
fun2drum
CH.com Junior
**
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 55
Marion NC
Gender: male
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #13 - Sep 4th, 2012 at 6:22pm
 
Okay I wasn't expecting this:
Went to one supplier and they looked at me like I had three heads when I said I wanted a high flow (25L) regulator and non rebreather mask. 
Went to the second, an oxygen specialty store, and they told me I would need a prescription for such a mask and regulator, and that they would have to order the regulator if I was interested AND came back with a prescription.  A prescription?  For a plastic mask?  I just ordered one through Amazon and am about to pull the trigger on a regulator from them as well.  Will I need anything else, like extra fittings, etc, to get it to fit on a welding oxygen tank?  Will the mask and supplied hose fit directly on the regulator?  Please forgive the newbie questions - I'm a newbie.
Back to top
  

Gary
A drummer with a headache.
Western NC - USA
 
IP Logged
 
ttnolan
CH.com Veteran
***
Offline


beats me


Posts: 247
Scotts Valley, CA
Gender: male
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #14 - Sep 4th, 2012 at 7:36pm
 
The regulator must fit the tank. The 540 style is what you will find on welding and large medical tanks, the 870 fits only the small medical tanks. I would get a 540, and I hear Harbor Freight is a good place to get and fill welding tanks. Just tell them you already have everything for your "oxy-acetylene cutting torch" but need a big oxy tank because you do a lot of cutting. They probably won't even ask.
As for the mask, I suggest buying the "O2ptimask" sold on this website. Tank, regulator, and the mask should come with the tubing you need to connect it.
Let us know if you have any specific questions. we will answer.
Back to top
  
 
IP Logged
 
Skyhawk5
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline


I love YaBB 1G - SP1!


Posts: 1320
Ypsilanti, Mi. USA
Gender: male
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #15 - Sep 7th, 2012 at 1:36am
 
If you haven't yet read our "oxygen info" pls do. It's the basics for all ClusterHeads.

Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

Unfortunatly, most O2 suppliers will not sell regulators or masks without a prescription. And the standard medical protocol for O2 is a max of 15LPM, so they won't give you more. Only the best CH Doctors know of the higher flow.

Most of us that have a 25LPM and higher have bought our own, and this does NOT require a prescription. You can buy medical or welding regulators that work well for CH. Getting the proper equipment requires learning what that is...

Don
Back to top
  

Though I walk through the valley of the shadow of the Beast , I  have O2 so I fear him not.
Skyhawk5655  
IP Logged
 
Bob Johnson
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline


"Only the educated are
free." -Epictetus


Posts: 5965
Kennett Square, PA (USA)
Gender: male
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #16 - Sep 7th, 2012 at 6:28am
 
Gary, I can't give you a final answer about toxicity of Vit D for the medical literature suggests this is a question which has not not been resolved.

I offer this material, noting that it comes from the major federal sources of health research/information. When we confront such a dilemma of competing claims, we at the very learst, need to be cautious and discuss the choice with our docs.
====
Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register

(This section found at the end of this long article.)

Health Risks from Excessive Vitamin D

VITAMIN D TOXICITY CAN CAUSE NON-SPECIFIC SYMPTOMS SUCH AS ANOREXIA, WEIGHT LOSS, POLYURIA, AND HEART ARRHYTHMIAS. MORE SERIOUSLY, IT CAN ALSO RAISE BLOOD LEVELS OF CALCIUM WHICH LEADS TO VASCULAR AND TISSUE CALCIFICATION, WITH SUBSEQUENT DAMAGE TO THE HEART, BLOOD VESSELS, AND KIDNEYS [1]. The use of supplements of both calcium (1,000 mg/day) and vitamin D (400 IU) by postmenopausal women was associated with a 17% increase in the risk of kidney stones over 7 years in the Women's Health Initiative [65]. A serum 25(OH)D concentration consistently >500 nmol/L (>200 ng/mL) is considered to be potentially toxic [5].
Excessive sun exposure does not result in vitamin D toxicity because the sustained heat on the skin is thought to photodegrade previtamin D3 and vitamin D3 as it is formed [6]. In addition, thermal activation of previtamin D3 in the skin gives rise to various non-vitamin D forms that limit formation of vitamin D3 itself. Some vitamin D3 is also converted to nonactive forms [1]. Intakes of vitamin D from food that are high enough to cause toxicity are very unlikely. Toxicity is much more likely to occur from high intakes of dietary supplements containing vitamin D.
Long-term intakes above the UL increase the risk of adverse health effects [1] (Table 4). Most reports suggest a toxicity threshold for vitamin D of 10,000 to 40,000 IU/day and serum 25(OH)D levels of 500–600 nmol/L (200–240 ng/mL). While symptoms of toxicity are unlikely at daily intakes below 10,000 IU/day, the FNB pointed to emerging science from national survey data, observational studies, and clinical trials suggesting that even lower vitamin D intakes and serum 25(OH)D levels might have adverse health effects over time. THE FNB CONCLUDED THAT SERUM 25(OH)D LEVELS ABOVE APPROXIMATELY 125–150 NMOL/L (50–60 NG/ML) SHOULD BE AVOIDED, AS EVEN LOWER SERUM LEVELS (APPROXIMATELY 75–120 NMOL/L OR 30–48 NG/ML) ARE ASSOCIATED WITH INCREASES IN ALL-CAUSE MORTALITY, GREATER RISK OF CANCER AT SOME SITES LIKE THE PANCREAS, GREATER RISK OF CARDIOVASCULAR EVENTS, AND MORE FALLS AND FRACTURES AMONG THE ELDERLY. The FNB committee cited research which found that vitamin D intakes of 5,000 IU/day achieved serum 25(OH)D concentrations between 100–150 nmol/L (40–60 ng/mL), but no greater. Applying an uncertainty factor of 20% to this intake value gave a UL of 4,000 IU which the FNB applied to children aged 9 and older, with corresponding lower amounts for younger children.

Table 4: Tolerable Upper Intake Levels (ULs) for Vitamin D [1] Age Male Female Pregnancy Lactation  {see at citation source}


Back to top
  

Bob Johnson
 
IP Logged
 
fun2drum
CH.com Junior
**
Offline


I Love CH.com!


Posts: 55
Marion NC
Gender: male
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #17 - Sep 7th, 2012 at 1:33pm
 
Thanks Bob, for that D3 info.  I'm going to stay at 10,000 IU/day until I can talk to the doctor.  I just had bloodwork done today and a follow-up visit in a couple of weeks.  While I'm there I'll ask about that, as well as whether either Verapamil or Topamax would make sense for me as a preventive.    
Back to top
« Last Edit: Sep 7th, 2012 at 1:36pm by fun2drum »  

Gary
A drummer with a headache.
Western NC - USA
 
IP Logged
 
Bob Johnson
CH.com Alumnus
***
Offline


"Only the educated are
free." -Epictetus


Posts: 5965
Kennett Square, PA (USA)
Gender: male
Re: A new beginning of coping
Reply #18 - Sep 7th, 2012 at 3:02pm
 
A widely used protocol for Verap:

Headache. 2004 Nov;44(10):1013-8.   


Individualizing treatment with verapamil for cluster headache patients.

Blau JN, Engel HO.


    Background.-Verapamil is currently the best available prophylactic drug for patients experiencing cluster headaches (CHs). Published papers usually state 240 to 480 mg taken in three divided doses give good results, ranging from 50% to 80%; others mention higher doses-720, even 1200 mg per day. In clinical practice we found we needed to adapt dosage to individual's time of attacks, in particular giving higher doses before going to bed to suppress severe nocturnal episodes. A few only required 120 mg daily. We therefore evolved a scheme for steady and progressive drug increase until satisfactory control had been achieved. Objective.-To find the minimum dose of verapamil required to prevent episodic and chronic cluster headaches by supervising each individual and adjusting the dosage accordingly. Methods.-Consecutive patients with episodic or chronic CH (satisfying International Headache Society (IHS) criteria) were started on verapamil 40 mg in the morning, 80 mg early afternoon, and 80 mg before going to bed. Patients kept a diary of all attacks, recording times of onset, duration, and severity. They were advised, verbally and in writing, to add 40 mg verapamil on alternate days, depending on their attack timing: with nocturnal episodes the first increase was the evening dose and next the afternoon one; when attacks occurred on or soon after waking, we advised setting an alarm clock 2 hours before the usual waking time and then taking the medication. Patients were followed-up at weekly intervals until attacks were controlled. They were also reviewed when a cluster period had ended, and advised to continue on the same dose for a further 2 weeks before starting systematic reduction. Chronic cluster patients were reviewed as often as necessary. Results.-Seventy consecutive patients, 52 with episodic CH during cluster periods and 18 with chronic CH, were all treated with verapamil as above. Complete relief from headaches was obtained in 49 (94%) of 52 with episodic, and 10 (55%) of 18 with chronic CH; the majority needed 200 to 480 mg, but 9 in the episodic, and 3 in the chronic group, needed 520 to 960 mg for control. Ten, 2 in the episodic and 8 in the chronic group, with incomplete relief, required additional therapy-lithium, sumatriptan, or sodium valproate. One patient withdrew because verapamil made her too tired, another developed Stevens-Johnson syndrome, and the drug was withdrawn. Conclusions.-Providing the dosage for each individual is adequate, preventing CH with verapamil is highly effective, taken three (occasionally with higher doses, four) times a day. In the majority (94%) with episodic CH steady dose increase under supervision, totally suppressed attacks. However in the chronic variety only 55% were completely relieved, 69% men, but only 20% women. In both groups, for those with partial attack suppression, additional prophylactic drugs or acute treatment was necessary. (Headache 2004;44:1013-1018).

=======================================
SLOW-RELEASE VERAPAMIL

Dr. Sheftell applauded the protocol for verapamil used by Dr. Goadsby and colleagues, which entailed use of short-acting verapamil in increments of 80 mg. “This method was suggested by Lee Kudrow, MD, 20 years ago as an alternative to slow-release verapamil,” Dr. Sheftell noted.

“I would agree with using short-acting verapamil, rather than the sustained-release formulation, in cluster headache,” he said. “I prefer the short-acting formulation with regard to ability to titrate more accurately and safely. My clinical experience anecdotally demonstrates improved responses when patients are switched from sustained-release verapamil to short-acting verapamil.”

Dr. Goadsby agreed that his clinical experience was similar. “There are no well-controlled, placebo-controlled, dose-ranging studies to direct treatment. This is one of those areas where clinicians who treat cluster headache have to combine what modicum of evidence is available with their own clinical experience,” Dr. Sheftell commented.
====
And see the PDF file, below.
Back to top
  
Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register (96 KB | 16 )

Bob Johnson
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Send Topic Print

DISCLAIMER: All information contained on this web site is for informational purposes only.  It is in no way intended to be used as a replacement for professional medical treatment.   clusterheadaches.com makes no claims as to the scientific/clinical validity of the information on this site OR to that of the information linked to from this site.  All information taken from the internet should be discussed with a medical professional!