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Headache like a heart attack in your brain? (Read 1246 times)
Doc Leila
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Headache like a heart attack in your brain?
Jul 17th, 2012 at 3:17pm
 
After my second attack in3hours last night, I told my husband that my head feels like I'm having a heart attack in my brain. Does this make sense to anyone else?

I mean, we use oxygen for relief (a heart attack is due to oxygen supply being cut off to an area of muscle) we use magnesium or ergots or triptans (which all dilate vessels to improve blood supply) and the pain is the same crushing intense pain I've heard patient describe before.
Desperate to try and find a solution once and for all.... Please share any thoughts

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coach_bill
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Re: Headache like a heart attack in your brain?
Reply #1 - Jul 17th, 2012 at 8:16pm
 
Whats up Doc,

I never heard it described like that before, But ok. I can see some of the common ground there.

Since you mentioned ergots, Have you looked at Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Register yet? Read the ABOUT US link and see if there may be a connection.

Coach Bill
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« Last Edit: Jul 17th, 2012 at 8:17pm by coach_bill »  

boy i cant wait till it's my turn to give him a headache. paybacks a bitch
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Bob Johnson
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Re: Headache like a heart attack in your brain?
Reply #2 - Jul 17th, 2012 at 8:42pm
 
This medical talk says: Cluster is a disorder of the nervous system, not of blood vessels. They are triggered in the hypothalamus, a small section of the brain.
========================
Interesting to note that he is saying that the primary mode of action is NOT as a vasoconstrictor but on its effect on the central nervous system. Doesn't change our appreciation of this class of meds but suggests we need to change how we think about the nature of CH.
==============================
Handb Exp Pharmacol. 2007;(177):129-43.   


Serotonin receptor ligands: treatments of acute migraine and cluster headache.


Goadsby PJ.

Institute of Neurology, Queen Square, London WC1N 3BG, UK. peterg@ion.ucl.ac.uk

Fuelled by the development of the serotonin 5-HT(1B/1D) receptor agonists, the triptans, the last 15 years has seen an explosion of interest in the treatment of acute migraine and cluster headache. Sumatriptan was the first of these agonists, and it launched a wave of therapeutic advances. These medicines are effective and safe. Triptans were developed as cranial vasoconstrictors to mimic the desirable effects of serotonin, while avoiding its side-effects. IT HAS SUBSEQUENTLY BEEN SHOWN THAT THE TRIPTANS' MAJOR ACTION IS NEURONAL, WITH BOTH PERIPHERAL AND CENTRAL TRIGEMINAL INHIBITORY EFFECTS, AS WELL AS ACTIONS IN THE THALAMUS AND AT CENTRAL MODULATORY SITES, SUCH AS THE PERIAQUEDUCTAL GREY MATTER. Further refinements may be possible as the 5-HT(1D) and 5-HT(1F) receptor agonists are explored. Serotonin receptor pharmacology has contributed much to the better management of patients with primary headache disorders.

PMID: 17087122 [PubMed]
=================================================================
J Clin Neurosci. 2010 Mar 11.

What has functional neuroimaging done for primary headache ... and for the clinical neurologist?
Sprenger T, Goadsby PJ.

UCSF Headache Centre, Department of Neurology, University of California, 1701 Divisadero St, Suite 480, San Francisco, CA 94115, USA.

Our understanding of mechanisms involved in primary headache syndromes has been substantially advanced using functional neuroimaging.

THE DATA HAVE HELPED ESTABLISH THE NOW-PREVAILING VIEW OF PRIMARY HEADACHE SYNDROMES, SUCH AS MIGRAINE AND CLUSTER HEADACHE, AS BRAIN DISORDERS WITH NEUROVASCULAR MANIFESTATIONS, NOT AS DISORDERS OF BLOOD VESSELS.

PMID: 20227279 [PubMed]

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Bob Johnson
 
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Re: Headache like a heart attack in your brain?
Reply #3 - Jul 17th, 2012 at 11:20pm
 
In reality there is no similarity between heart atack and cluster headache. Heart attack is strongly analagous to stroke though,

A heart atack occurs when a clot forms in the coronary arteries that supply the heart with its needs for blood. When a clot forms in these arteries the blood supply to an area of heart muscle is cut off and it sends out a message (pain) that all is not well. Imagine you cut off the blood supply to your finger by wrapping a rubber band around it tightly - pain would occur and let you know something was wrong. A heart attack is a little like that - blood supply is cut off and pain and damage to an area of heart muscle occur.

A stroke is very similar to a heart attack in mechanism, but it is the brain that is affected rather than the heart. So a blood clot forms in a blood vessel in the brain and cuts off the blood supply to a particular area of the brain. We recognise this by altered brain functioning (confusion, altered conscious state, loss of cotrol of parts of the body, etc). (Note: there is a form of stroke that involves bleeding into the brain rather than clot formation, but lets not complicate things at this point)

None of this bears any resemblance to cluster headache. Although the mechanism for CH isn't well understood it is clear that it isn't blood clot formation in an artery in the brain (if it was we would be having a stoke).

With regards to oxygen, although it has been long used to treat heart attack and stroke it is now thought that it is not of benefit for these conditions. In fact there is mounting evidence that oxygen may actually cause harm when given to heart attack victims. But that is a whole new story...


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Doc Leila
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Re: Headache like a heart attack in your brain?
Reply #4 - Jul 18th, 2012 at 3:19pm
 
Was merely suggesting that the nature of the pain bears a resembelance to what i have seen with myocardial infarction patients. Am well aware that CH is not an ischaemic event. Strokes are after all painless.

Are we certain that the neurovascular change is as a result of the hypothalamus dysfunction, or could it be a case of chicken and egg?

Everytime i have another headache, i focus on some new nuance i might have missed before. This was just another desperate attempt at understanding a little more... Thank u for indulging me
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Re: Headache like a heart attack in your brain?
Reply #5 - Jul 18th, 2012 at 7:32pm
 
Hi Leila, apologies as it seems I may have misinterpreted the intention of your original post.

However I would also have to say I have never likened the pain of CH to that of myocardial infarction. I haven't had an an infarction myself, but have seen probably hundreds of people who have.
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Re: Headache like a heart attack in your brain?
Reply #6 - Jul 22nd, 2012 at 9:20pm
 
Thanks, Doc, for the thought.  I, too, have found it curious that the explanations for the disorder seem to be lacking.  Not surprisingly then, the emphasis is on abortive potions and procedures.  I have often used recovery time to think about the explanations that made the rounds about the movement of stars....and wonder if one of us is just going to snap our fingers and say "Hey, I think I've got something".  To that end, I continue to read many of your posts.  I know of few other conditions whose presentation is as consistent as it is with CH sufferers, even though there are consistent inconsistencies (is that possible?).  I know that in my own experience, I am unable to add any tactile input to the afferent flow of the involved facial areas without feeling as though I will, literally, explode.  Yet I am convinced that the problem is not preganglionic.  I like to hold the chicken/egg principle high in my algorithm.  Sleep well.

TJ
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