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Cluster Headache Help and Support >> Medications,  Treatments,  Therapies >> Depakote has anybody used
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Message started by Jerry_M on Aug 12th, 2012 at 3:03pm

Title: Depakote has anybody used
Post by Jerry_M on Aug 12th, 2012 at 3:03pm
my neruo started me on Depakote my last go around, he felt i was getting more coverage from this Depakote than from the verapamil i was also on. I belive i was taking 540 verapamil and 1000 Depakote
I have just started a new cycle last week (after an unbeleavable 2 1/2 months of shadows, I usally only have shadows for about 2 weeks before starting a cycle so this really threw me, I starting thinking maybe they were finally going away, oh well)
So anyway I have a meeting with my neuro this tuesday and I have never seen Depakote mentioned on the boards and wonderd if anybody had any information or personel experince with this drug.
I don't know if I had any success with it as I was already on verapamil before starting the depakote, I also remember that I uped the verapamil shortly after starting the depakote.
I have just started a double dose pak of pregnisone and have started a taper of both the verapamil and depakote because thats what i was doing last time but it struck me as very unsettling that I have never noticed depakote being mentioned here.
I look forward to hearing from you.

Title: Re: Depakote has anybody used
Post by Bob Johnson on Aug 12th, 2012 at 4:03pm
Your doc's approach is a bit at odds with our experience and that reported in much of the literature.

Print the PDF file, below, and use as a discussion tool with your doc. It's the latest evaluation of effectivness of the major meds for Cluster.

Rather than tapering off Verap, I'd present the following to him for consideration.
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Headache. 2004 Nov;44(10):1013-8.   


Individualizing treatment with verapamil for cluster headache patients.

Blau JN, Engel HO.


    Background.-Verapamil is currently the best available prophylactic drug for patients experiencing cluster headaches (CHs). Published papers usually state 240 to 480 mg taken in three divided doses give good results, ranging from 50% to 80%; others mention higher doses-720, even 1200 mg per day. In clinical practice we found we needed to adapt dosage to individual's time of attacks, in particular giving higher doses before going to bed to suppress severe nocturnal episodes. A few only required 120 mg daily. We therefore evolved a scheme for steady and progressive drug increase until satisfactory control had been achieved. Objective.-To find the minimum dose of verapamil required to prevent episodic and chronic cluster headaches by supervising each individual and adjusting the dosage accordingly. Methods.-Consecutive patients with episodic or chronic CH (satisfying International Headache Society (IHS) criteria) were started on verapamil 40 mg in the morning, 80 mg early afternoon, and 80 mg before going to bed. Patients kept a diary of all attacks, recording times of onset, duration, and severity. They were advised, verbally and in writing, to add 40 mg verapamil on alternate days, depending on their attack timing: with nocturnal episodes the first increase was the evening dose and next the afternoon one; when attacks occurred on or soon after waking, we advised setting an alarm clock 2 hours before the usual waking time and then taking the medication. Patients were followed-up at weekly intervals until attacks were controlled. They were also reviewed when a cluster period had ended, and advised to continue on the same dose for a further 2 weeks before starting systematic reduction. Chronic cluster patients were reviewed as often as necessary. Results.-Seventy consecutive patients, 52 with episodic CH during cluster periods and 18 with chronic CH, were all treated with verapamil as above. Complete relief from headaches was obtained in 49 (94%) of 52 with episodic, and 10 (55%) of 18 with chronic CH; the majority needed 200 to 480 mg, but 9 in the episodic, and 3 in the chronic group, needed 520 to 960 mg for control. Ten, 2 in the episodic and 8 in the chronic group, with incomplete relief, required additional therapy-lithium, sumatriptan, or sodium valproate. One patient withdrew because verapamil made her too tired, another developed Stevens-Johnson syndrome, and the drug was withdrawn. Conclusions.-Providing the dosage for each individual is adequate, preventing CH with verapamil is highly effective, taken three (occasionally with higher doses, four) times a day. In the majority (94%) with episodic CH steady dose increase under supervision, totally suppressed attacks. However in the chronic variety only 55% were completely relieved, 69% men, but only 20% women. In both groups, for those with partial attack suppression, additional prophylactic drugs or acute treatment was necessary. (Headache 2004;44:1013-1018).

=======================================
SLOW-RELEASE VERAPAMIL

Dr. Sheftell applauded the protocol for verapamil used by Dr. Goadsby and colleagues, which entailed use of short-acting verapamil in increments of 80 mg. “This method was suggested by Lee Kudrow, MD, 20 years ago as an alternative to slow-release verapamil,” Dr. Sheftell noted.

“I would agree with using short-acting verapamil, rather than the sustained-release formulation, in cluster headache,” he said. “I prefer the short-acting formulation with regard to ability to titrate more accurately and safely. My clinical experience anecdotally demonstrates improved responses when patients are switched from sustained-release verapamil to short-acting verapamil.”

Dr. Goadsby agreed that his clinical experience was similar. “There are no well-controlled, placebo-controlled, dose-ranging studies to direct treatment. This is one of those areas where clinicians who treat cluster headache have to combine what modicum of evidence is available with their own clinical experience,” Dr. Sheftell commented.
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These high doses of Verap are common and effective for Cluster folks. Often scares the docs until they gain experience with this approach but it's a widely used protocol.

Other will relate their experience with Dep. Good bit of rejection in our membership because of the side effects and modest benefit.
http://www.clusterheadaches.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?action=downloadfile;file=THERAPIES-_Headache_2011.pdf (96 KB | 16 )

Title: Re: Depakote has anybody used
Post by Jerry_M on Aug 12th, 2012 at 10:27pm
thanks for the reply, i feel at least a little better seeing it mentioned, but i think he better have some real good reasons for putting me on a third level drug with of course its own side effects. thanks again

Title: Re: Depakote has anybody used
Post by AppleNutClusters on Aug 13th, 2012 at 7:10am
Jerry_M,

I have experience taking both Depakote (250 mg daily) and verapamil (up to 480 mg daily, if I recall). I didn't try them together -- that is, my old neuro first had me try the Depakote which did nothing for my cluster headaches or migraines. Then after I stopped that, my GP put me on the verapamil. The verap was reducing my CH pain levels by about 50% and starting to look like I might have a PF day, but I happened to swell up severely, had palpitations, so had to stop. I would still go back and use the verap if my doc would let me.

Title: Re: Depakote has anybody used
Post by aprildawn on Aug 13th, 2012 at 3:18pm
My neuro started me on depakote many years ago when i was just getting cluster migraines. it worked just fine. as things got worse, she added verapimal. i still take both (120 verpamil & 500 depakote) but with Batch's regimen, this cycle was the mildness that i have had in years.

Title: Re: Depakote has anybody used
Post by snookarosis on Aug 14th, 2012 at 7:43pm
took depakote when it was "the new thing" and right after my first proper daignosis (full headache work-up for three days in the hospital). No help whatsoever, not to mention, that I had to go and get levels checked and all that stuff. Wound up on Nortryptilene and finally got away from that and just went with imitrex injections. I will say this though. If recall properly, the depakote may have helped with the devastating depression that I always get. You guys get that as a matter of routine?

Title: Re: Depakote has anybody used
Post by AppleNutClusters on Aug 14th, 2012 at 9:59pm
I don't have depression along with my cluster headaches, so I didn't notice much effect on my mood from Depakote. Aside from its original anti-seizure use, it's now most often used as a mood stabilizer. Mainly for bipolar folks, but also for those with depression.

Occasionally the side effects work to your advantage, instead of against you. Always a bonus!  [smiley=thumbup.gif] If they happened to throw amitriptyline or notriptyline your way, that should also have helped with depression, if not clusters.

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