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        New Message Board Archives >> Medications, Treatments, Therapies 2005 >> The Zu and Prednisone?
        
(Message started by: cjc68 on Jul 20^th, 2005, 4:20am)

Title: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by cjc68 on Jul 20^th, 2005, 4:20am

During my last 20 years of CH's I have almost always had any meds that I wanted available to me. Of course Imitrex inj. are my choice. Now I live in a new area of the country and my med. availability is no longer there! (lack of health insurance). I do have access to Kudzu and prednisone. My question to evryone is... Has anyone ever had any positve or negative effects taking these two toghther?

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by nani on Jul 20^th, 2005, 10:03am

Hi cjc, I'm not aware of anyone who has tried both. Are you already on Pred? If so, you may want to wait to try kudzu. If you aren't, you may not need it. Have you read all the kudzu info? Do that first. Kudzu works well by itself, if it's going to work at all. Of course, it would be best to discuss this with your dr. Why not give kudzu a try by itself? Pred works best when you use it while getting a prevent in your system, but kudzu can show results within a day or two. good luck and pain free wishes, nani
Let us know how it goes...

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by cjc68 on Jul 23^rd, 2005, 1:02am

Hello Nani!, Chris here (cjc68), When this cycle hit I just grabbed for what ever I had left form my last cycle (very stupid of me but I think we have all done that at one time or another) which was about 4-5 days of pred, and about 4-5 days of bellspas or bellergal s as we know it(antispasmodial) same as phenobarbitol. I started my ramp up on the pred and took the bellspas as an abort. this worked and kept me to only 1-2 hits per night at a kip 4-5 until I ran out. So after running out I was eager to try the zu! I had also at this time heard about red bull! I started taking the zu 150 mgs 3 times a day and using the Red bull as an abort with a medium responce. I also would take 1-2 mgs of melitonin at bed time. Did this for about a week now but Iam having a increase of hits plus an increase in kip. I have now been able to more pred plus some indocin(trash). So in asenal at this time I have pred, zu, melitonin and red bull or at least this is what Iam willing to take, I got rid of the indocin. I just started the pred again, still taking the zu and red bull or sobe adrenalin at onset. I have done this fo r 1 day with so so results, I do have some phenobarbitol on the way but will another day or so! I am very tired exhausted and confused. Unfortunaltly I am my on doc for this cycle. Not sure what to take at this time and I need to be very cautious! and I now that more is not always better with CH. Everyone tells me to do research but honestly by the time I research just one of these meds shadows will hit and then every thing goes out the window and push myself away from the computer! I know I cant take all of these....just looking for the best combo? any suggestions? I know that we are not Docs but I am just looking for suggestions and past experiences.
On another note.....everyone here is awsome! a true family!

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by cjc68 on Jul 23^rd, 2005, 7:59am

Just a follow up! WOW! I know this very early in this poor mans campaigne to get excited about but.... I finally got my pred last night (by some kind of miracle a Doc heard about my situation and called in a script to my closest drug store), took my first dose of pred last night at about 10 pm, already been taking the zu and melitonin....for about a week with a good responce(medium level kip hits at about 3 per day with mild shadows in between) well I took my pred, Zu and melitonin before bed at 1am. Slept like a baby for 6 hours(felt like 20) waking with no shadows, no hits, no depression ...the whole 9 yards. After 20 years of taking just about everything I think I may have found a great combo.....1st PFN in 20 years of cycles, I litterally woke with tears of joy in my eyes! I will keep a daily post here to report progress!

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by nani on Jul 23^rd, 2005, 12:31pm

Hi Chris. I'm glad you're getting a break! I am still concerned about your not being medically supervised, however, since this is all so new. So, proceed with caution ... keep us posted. pain free wishes, nani

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by cjc68 on Jul 23^rd, 2005, 10:12pm

Just an Update!
PFN last night! Today has also been PF with a shadow so mild I had to stop and look for it, not even sure I could really call it a shadow!What a nice break at last! I have even been brave enough to throw some of my triggers at it. I am going to stay on my med schedule for the next day and will give a report tomorrow morning.

Med schedule is as follows: (all doses have been taken with food.

9am: 20 mgs of pred, 150 mgs of kudzu.

4pm: 150mgs of kudzu.

11pm: 20mgs of pred., 150 mgs of kudzu, 3mgs of melatonin.

side effects thus far: bowls are just slightly more active than normal!

also including water X 3, and should I have a hit I will use
red bull at onset with a hot shower hitting my temple and affectied side of the head untill it peaks and then turn water to cold when CH is subsiding. But I still have not had to use an abortive at this time. What a great day! I feel human again! I will see what tomorrow brings and report on it!

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by nani on Jul 23^rd, 2005, 10:20pm

Hey Chris... sounds like your getting somewhere. :) You're episodic, right? If you are, you may want to avoid triggers until the last of any signs are long gone. Also, with your Pred...taper off with professional advice. I'm not sure how it's done, but I'm pretty sure it's very specific. PF wishes and hugs, nani

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by cjc68 on Jul 24^th, 2005, 12:45pm

yup, I am episodic. Just makes me appreciate what a chronic must go through. plus gives me the insperation and positive attitude needed to get through a cycle. My last remision period was about 41/2 years the longest I ever had. You are an inspiration to me and everyone here Nani. Thank You for being here for all of us!
Chris

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by cjc68 on Jul 24^th, 2005, 12:50pm

Follow Up!
I did have a one hit last night about 45 minutes after going to bed. Used my abortive method plus took half dose of pred and kudzu. hit was a kip4 and took about 30 minutes to drain. I did manage to get 7 hours sleep last night but woke very drained, exhausted and mild depression but I after my coffee I am feeling better!
Chris

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by nani on Jul 24^th, 2005, 9:53pm

I hope you have another PF night, Chris. hugs, nani

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by cjc68 on Jul 26^th, 2005, 2:29am

Follow up!
Same report as the the night before, at least it has been consistant. I might need to tweek my meds a little.
My goal is to be back to work by he end of this week. I still however am waking up with some lightheadedness and a med hangover and some minor shadows throught the day! Still trying to take it easy throught the day to keep my stress and blood preasure levels low to keep my attacks to a min. I am opening windows in the am and keepin it dark at night as well as satying indoors and out of the heat! Eating light in the eve. and staying away from known food triggers. I am eatting raw jalapenos...lol to numb those receptors (not sure if this really works but it worth a try). Not sure if this thread is helping anyone else but me but at least it gives me a place to vent where I know I am understood. Thanks Clusterheadaches dot com for this oportunity to do so!Thanks to all and many PFDN to all!
Chris

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by nani on Jul 26^th, 2005, 10:02am

on 07/26/05 at 02:29:58, cjc68 wrote:

Not sure if this thread is helping anyone

Everytime we share our experiences, we help someone, Chris. I'm glad you're still hanging in and seeing results. Keep us posted on the pred taper, too, OK? Now, I want you to stick around when your cycle is over. You can offer support, information and understanding to others. That's what it's all about...paying it forward. :)
Talk to you soon, sweetie. hugs, nani

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by cjc68 on Jul 26^th, 2005, 11:29am

I do intend in doing just that Nani....I am also seriously thinking about making it to one of the conventions or meet and greet's, I am sure I would really like that plus I am sure it would be educationally benificial for me. Thanks for all your help Nani! Your the best! Many hugs to ya!
Chris

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by cjc68 on Jul 26^th, 2005, 11:41am

UPDATE
I have tweeked my meds and maintained a PFN last night....no hits...yea!....lol I did sleep less and not as deep but again no hits! 1 hour after wakeing I have developed a shadow but very minor.....med change as follows

I increased my pred by 10 mg, and have decreased the zu by about 30 % and the melatonin by 1mg.

PFDN to all!
Chris

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by nani on Jul 26^th, 2005, 11:42am

on 07/26/05 at 11:29:47, cjc68 wrote:

I am also seriously thinking about making it to one of the conventions or meet and greet's,

Well, at the very least, you must "meet & greet" me next time you visit family. Hirvimaki is in Albq, too. He's always up to a visit. If you want to get together in Durango sometime this fall... (see Meetings Board) fly into ABQ and we'll drive out together. :) hugs, nani

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by nani on Jul 26^th, 2005, 11:44am

Hey Chris...I just saw your meds update. Question: Since pred is meant to be temporary and tapered off, why decrease kudzu first? Just wondering....

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by cjc68 on Jul 26^th, 2005, 12:24pm

well on the pred when my cycle started I only had enough for a few days(at 20 mgs per day) and ran out, I went about 4-5 days without but had started the zu. After getting more pred. 41/2 days ago I had to start the pred ramp up again! I also realized that I was taking a brand of zu (Natures Plus) which is more concentrated than the natures way!What I thought was 600 mgs was actually closer to 1000mgs. I will peak my pred. run in a day or two and then start my taper! I was also drinking too much water I think, so I cut back a little. Realized I was flushing my system too much and flushing away the pred and zu that was useful to me! With the little bit of medic training in the Navy I had forgot that lots of water is not always good for you in certian cases!

PS. on the meet and greet in the four corners, I would love that! I will keep in touch and let you know for sure Sweetie! Thanks Nani!
Chris

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by cjc68 on Jul 27^th, 2005, 3:15pm

UPDATE!
I have been keeping my med intake consistant and have only had 1 K3 hit per night for the last two nights, still some minor shadows throught the day but not bad at all! Both hits were aborted with a Red Bull and only took about 10 minutes to do so! I will start my pred taper in a day or so!
PFND to all !
Chris

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by cjc68 on Jul 27^th, 2005, 3:50pm

Tonight I will be pushing the limits! I have agreed to work a night shift tonight (11-7) plus a an extra few hours. I have been working so hard to get my sleeping hours regulated. My fear is that I will trash the progress that I have acheived in the last couple of weeks! Anyone have any suggestions?
Thanks Chris

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by nani on Jul 28^th, 2005, 12:11am

No suggestions. (OK, one... don't push your limits while in cycle. LOL.) I hope you have a good and PF night, Chris. Let us know. hugs, nani

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by cjc68 on Jul 28^th, 2005, 5:00am

Well I think I have made it throught the night! I have been here at work since 3pm it is now almost 5am, by the time I get out of here it will have been 141/2 hours, I have now been awake for almost 24 hours. I have had a few minor rebounds or maybe you could call them a k2 or k3....lol I have been a little blunt with a few of the customers...lol but I think I did real well with my frustration and angers!...lol I wont give the details but I think I did good to keep my blood presure to a min. When I tried to explain to the customers why my eye was almost swollen shut, they said "oh you have a migrane" but they soon learned just by seeing the expresion on my face that it was much more than that....they did step back a few paces....lol But I again I did real good and kept my temper!....just wish another clusterhead was present to see it...lol they would have appreciated it....lol only 30 more minutes and I can go home and let this rebound fully develope so I can get it over with and get to bed!
on a special note I would like to thank Nani who has been ther for me through this cycle. This is the first cycle that I have had without a special and understanding friend close by! Nani, you have been that person for me this time around! Your the best Sweetie! Thanks for being you!
Chris

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by nani on Jul 29^th, 2005, 1:15am

Your welcome, Chris. We're all here for you.
How did things go today?
hugs, nani

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by cjc68 on Jul 31^st, 2005, 3:31am

UPDATE: I am still doing my pred. taper, last two nights I have had 2 k4 hits per night, a little tired at this point! 2 - 3 hours sleep per night( I think my long night at the work the other day through me off a little and I feel like that is the cause for hits I have had since!) When I had my second hit tonight I broke down and took some phenobarbitol (small dosage) with a red bull and I aborted in about 5 minutes. I did not take the half dose of pred or Zu during the second hit tonight, just the red bull and phenobarb! Seemed to work really fast! WOW! I may be able to get some sleep tonight!
PFDN to All !
Chris

Title: Re: The Zu and Prednisone?
Post by cjc68 on Aug 4^th, 2005, 2:26am

Update, I havent done an update for a few days...sorry everyone! I am almost done with my pred taper (1 day left) still taking the zu! unfortunatly my hits are increasing in kip level and in #'s, starting to loose it at times and I have been forced to go back to work full time or loose my job, because of the nature of my job I work both graveyard and night shifts so I am sure that the vaired sleeping hours are also affecting my progress that I had with the Zu. At the present I am financally, mentally and physically drained. Getting an average of 2 hours sleep per day! I guess the red bull is whats keeping me going! I am doing my best to stay positive however! but it is just an act...lol I guess.
I wish I could just give up but the pain wont let me!....lol I am still keeping up my hopes that the zu will do for me what it has done for others.
Take Care Everyone! PFDN wishes to you all!
Chris
ps. please forgive the spelling errors , I can see in double vision...lol