Clusterheadaches.com Message Board


    
      
        Clusterheadaches.com Message Board
        (http://www.clusterheadaches.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi)
      

        New Message Board Archives >> Medications, Treatments, Therapies 2005 >> fresh research - Goadsby
        
(Message started by: floridian on May 16^th, 2005, 12:28pm)

Title: fresh research - Goadsby
Post by floridian on May 16^th, 2005, 12:28pm

Interesting overview of some new and promising strategies for treating CH - CGRP inhibitors have been discussed a bit here before, as have most of the others (glutamate inhibitors, nitric oxide inhibitors).

Glutamate receptor antagonists - that rings the Taurine bell - ie, Red Bull. (" The taurine effect most likely was due to GABA(B) receptor-mediated inhibition of presynaptic glutamate release." pubmed ID 15026133; "Taurine prevents the neurotoxicity of beta-amyloid and glutamate receptor agonists." pubmed ID 15003996 etc etc).

Nitric oxide synthase inhibitors - green tea!! (Green tea polyphenol (-)-epigallocatechin gallate attenuates neuronal NADPH-d/n Nitric Oxide Synthase expression ... Pubmed ID 14746923, etc)

Quote:

Curr Opin Neurol. 2005 Jun;18(3):283-8.
New targets in the acute treatment of headache.

Goadsby PJ.

Headache Group, Institute of Neurology and The National Hospital for Neurology and Neurosurgery, London, UK.

PURPOSE OF REVIEW: The aim of this article is to review recently identified targets for the acute treatment of primary headache disorders. RECENT FINDINGS: Calcitonin gene-related peptide (CGRP) receptor blockade has been shown to be an effective acute anti-migraine strategy and is a non-vasoconstrictor in terms of the mechanism of action. It is likely that direct blockade of CGRP release by inhibition of trigeminal nerves would be similarly effective in both migraine and cluster headache. Options for acute treatment based on preclinical work and initial clinical studies include: serotonin 5HT1F and 5HT1D receptor agonists, glutamate excitatory amino acid receptor antagonists, nitric oxide synthase inhibitors and adenosine A1 receptor agonists. Proof of principle studies with octreotide, a somatostatin receptor agonist, demonstrated it to be better than placebo in the acute treatment of cluster headache but not in the acute management of migraine. SUMMARY: The prospect of a non-vasoconstrictor acute migraine therapy offers a real opportunity to patients, and perhaps more importantly, provides a therapeutic rationale to plant migraine and cluster headache firmly in the brain as neurological problems.

http://www.med-owl.com/clusterheadaches/tiki-index.php?page=Red%20Bull
http://www.med-owl.com/clusterheadaches/tiki-index.php?page=Green%20Tea

Jujuboside may also be of interest from the glutamate side.

Title: Re: fresh research - Goadsby
Post by ozzy on May 16^th, 2005, 3:11pm

on 05/16/05 at 12:28:31, floridian wrote:

Glutamate receptor antagonists - that rings the Taurine bell - ie, Red Bull. (" The taurine effect most likely was due to GABA(B) receptor-mediated inhibition of presynaptic glutamate release." pubmed ID 15026133; "Taurine prevents the neurotoxicity of beta-amyloid and glutamate receptor agonists." pubmed ID 15003996 etc etc).

Help me understand something, the whole glutamate thing. The Whey Protein Powder supplement I use contains 3870 mg of Glutamine per serving. Two questions. What is essentially the difference between Glutamine and Glutamate (one is the precursor of the other?) and two taking that much per serving 3 or 4 servings a day, shouldn't that affect me negatively for CH? Because it doesn't.

BTW, I'm one of those that reacts favorably from Redbull.

Ozzy

Title: Re: fresh research - Goadsby
Post by floridian on May 16^th, 2005, 4:29pm

I believe there are several conversions that occur, and they are mostly reversible.

aspartate <=> glutamate
asparagine <=> glutamate
glutamate <=> glutamine
glutamate => GABA

Glutamate will trigger the NMDA/glutamate nerves, which carry pain and discomfort. Glutamine itself does not, but it can be converted to glutamate or NMDA.

Don't know about the dietary influence, other than some people reporting that MSG is a trigger.

Title: Re: fresh research - Goadsby
Post by floridian on May 16^th, 2005, 8:41pm

Here's a fresh taurine abstract .... definitely sounds like something that could be of benefit to clusterheads. Blocks the glutamate induced membrane depolarization via inhibiting the release of calcium. And it needs magnesium to work.

Quote:

Brain Res. 2005 Mar 21;1038(2):123-31.

Mode of action of taurine as a neuroprotector.

Wu H, Jin Y, Wei J, Jin H, Sha D, Wu JY.

Department of Biomedical Science, Florida Atlantic University, Boca Raton, FL 33431, USA.

Previously, it has been shown that taurine exerts its protective function against glutamate-induced neuronal excitotoxicity through its action in reducing glutamate-induced elevation of intracellular free calcium, [Ca2+]i. Here, we report the mechanism underlying the effect of taurine in reducing [Ca2+]i. We found that taurine inhibited glutamate-induced calcium influx through L-, P/Q-, N-type voltage-gated calcium channels (VGCCs) and NMDA receptor calcium channel. Surprisingly, taurine had no effect on calcium influx through NMDA receptor calcium channel when cultured neurons were treated with NMDA in Mg2+-free medium. Since taurine was found to prevent glutamate-induced membrane depolarization, we propose that taurine protects neurons against glutamate excitotoxicity by preventing glutamate-induced membrane depolarization, probably through its effect in opening of chloride channels and, therefore, preventing the glutamate-induced increase in calcium influx and other downstream events.

Title: Re: fresh research - Goadsby
Post by Flash on May 17^th, 2005, 4:40am

There are some question marks over the safety of taurine.

Title: Re: fresh research - Goadsby
Post by floridian on May 17^th, 2005, 7:49am

on 05/17/05 at 04:40:15, Flash wrote:

There are some question marks over the safety of taurine.

??

I've heard that drinking several Red Bulls while drinking alcohol might have some negative side effects - some pubs no longer server drinks that combine RB with alcohol. It might also interact with calcium channel blockers. But most of the medical literature considers taurine to be relatively safe. Am I missing something?

Title: Re: fresh research - Goadsby
Post by ozzy on May 17^th, 2005, 11:19am

I'm still looking into Taurine safety, but found the following very interesting:

Quote:

Taurine treatment protects against chronic nicotine-induced oxidative changes.

Sener G, Ozer Sehirli A, Ipci Y, Cetinel S, Cikler E, Gedik N, Alican I.

Department of Pharmacology, School of Pharmacy, Marmara University, Istanbul, Turkey. gokselsener@hotmail.com

Experiments have shown that chronic nicotine administration caused oxidative damage in various organs by increasing lipid peroxidation products and decreasing the activity of endogenous antioxidants. The aim of this study was to investigate the effects of taurine treatment on nicotine-induced oxidative changes in rat thoracic aorta and heart and to explore the possible mechanisms of action. Male Wistar albino rats (200-250 g) were injected with nicotine hydrogen bitartrate (0.6 mg/kg; i.p.) or saline for 21 days. Taurine was administered (50 mg/kg; i.p.) alone or along with nicotine injections. After decapitation, the thoracic aorta and heart tissues were excised. The aorta was used for in vitro contractility studies or stored along with the heart samples for the measurement of malondialdehyde (MDA) and glutathione (GSH) levels, myeloperoxidase (MPO) activity and collagen content. Tissue samples were also examined histologically. Serum samples were stored for the measurement of MDA, GSH and lactate dehydrogenase (LDH) activity. Chronic nicotine treatment impaired both the contraction and relaxation responses of the aortic rings to phenylephrine and acetylcholine, respectively. It increased lipid peroxidation, MPO levels and tissue collagen content of both aorta and heart samples. Taurine supplementation to nicotine-treated animals reversed the contractile dysfunction and restored the endogenous GSH levels and decreased high lipid peroxidation and MPO activities in both tissues. These data suggest that taurine supplementation effectively attenuates the oxidative damage because of chronic nicotine administration possibly by its antioxidant effects.

PMID: 15810895 [PubMed - in process]

Helps with the nicotine damage to cardiovascular system...

Ozzy

Title: Re: fresh research - Goadsby
Post by Flash on May 20^th, 2005, 12:53pm

on 05/16/05 at 12:28:31, floridian wrote:

Nitric oxide synthase inhibitors - green tea!! (Green tea polyphenol (-)-epigallocatechin gallate attenuates neuronal NADPH-d/n Nitric Oxide Synthase expression ... Pubmed ID 14746923, etc)

http://www.med-owl.com/clusterheadaches/tiki-index.php?page=Green%20Tea

Green tea! LMAO! I just love to say "I told you so!!!"

Been advocating this for about 2 years. I personally find it more effective than O2 for aborting individual hits.

Title: Re: fresh research - Goadsby
Post by Bob P on May 20^th, 2005, 1:00pm

But what about them blood vessels Falsh. They're still dilating. How can there be no headache if the vessels are still dialting???????? :o

Title: Re: fresh research - Goadsby
Post by Flash on May 20^th, 2005, 2:23pm

on 05/20/05 at 13:00:44, Bob P wrote:

But what about them blood vessels Falsh. They're still dilating. How can there be no headache if the vessels are still dialting???????? :o

I have no idea what you are talking about. I don't speak troll.

Title: Re: fresh research - Goadsby
Post by jefferator on May 20^th, 2005, 4:17pm

Been drinking green tea as first line remedy for years too Flash....I find that if I and just entering a cycle, before they REAL hard in the temple..I can abort, but once hard in a cycle, it wont knock it out...I will tell you this which has been unbelievably effective, and in alot of cases fully aborted before having to go to o2, is that while I am boiling the tea water (just in a pot, not a tea kettle), I stick my face above the pot (high enough to avoid steam burn) and breathe in the steam, both thru nose and mouth and turn my head to the side so it hits my temple (like tiger balm) and do that for 2-5 minutes and then drink the tea...by the time Im drinking the tea, half the time I have no more headache, and other times that + the tea knocks it out...then again, when fully in the cycle, I have had to then breathe the magic gas.