Clusterheadaches.com Message Board


    
      
        Clusterheadaches.com Message Board
        (http://www.clusterheadaches.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi)
      

        New Message Board Archives >> Medications, Treatments, Therapies 2004 >> Prednisone (no taper!)
        
(Message started by: IndianaJohn on Aug 18^th, 2004, 7:52pm)

Title: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by IndianaJohn on Aug 18^th, 2004, 7:52pm

Just got my script for pred this afternoon. 60 mg/day NO TAPER! called the pharmacy and they said new studies showed that a constant dose was better than tapering cuz by the time your dosage is low the preds stops working (huh?). Anyway got 60 mg/day for 7 days.

Does this sound strange to any one else?

The pharmacy said that this is the more common method now. They also said that the side effects from doing this without tapering would be some muscle cramps. The script was for 21 20mg pills so I can work out a taper program if necessary.

Need some opinions

Thanks,

John

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by Kris_in_SJ on Aug 18^th, 2004, 8:16pm

Wow John!

OK - as a former RN - here is my opinion ...

Yes, by the time the dosage is low, the Pred is usually stopping its magic. This is very good for those of us who are on preventatives like Verapamil, since it takes a week or so for them to work.

See what I'm saying? Preventative kicks in ... no more need for Prednisone ... doesn't matter or not if magic is still working.

I'll happily bow to those more experienced, but I DO NOT believe it is a good idea to abruptly stop taking Prednisone. All by itself, it's hard on your body, but stopping it suddenly is even harder.

My guess is that if the Pred works, 7 days from now you'll not only be dealing with that, but the beast will be hitting you as well. If your GP is totally forsaking you, see if you can't get taper that will take you through to your appointment on the 31st.

Hugs,

Kris

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by eyes_afire on Aug 18^th, 2004, 8:28pm

Maybe I'm out-of-line here, but...
I think your pharmacy is nuts.

http://ibscrohns.about.com/cs/prednisone/a/prednisonefaq.htm

http://www.rxlist.com/cgi/generic/pred_pi.htm

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=15980

http://www.druginfonet.com/index.php?pageID=faq/faqpredn.htm

There is some info on the internet where some docs don't taper the prednison if it's to be taken for less than 2 weeks. What I don't understand is... why chance it?

Whatever you do, follow your docs advice... not mine and not the pharmacy. If my doc said no taper, I'd be seriously questioning him.

--- Steve

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by Lizzie2 on Aug 18^th, 2004, 8:32pm

Yeah I'm no doc, not a pharmacist, and not even a full fledged nurse for a few more months, but I still think it's nuts too. Maybe this is some kind of new-fangled idea? In my nursing drug book, it's pretty adamant about not stopping suddenly. And that may be if you are taking it for longer term, but still, like Steve said...why risk it??? After what Dave E is going through and all the scary things that Pred can effect...there is no way I'd be going for the no taper route!!!

I'd recommend asking more questions??

Good luck!
Lizzie :)

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by Prense on Aug 18^th, 2004, 8:48pm

on 08/18/04 at 19:52:14, IndianaJohn wrote:

Need some opinions

I aint scared... I'll give advice. DON'T DO IT!!!

Chris ;;D

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by ex_pat_asia on Aug 18^th, 2004, 10:44pm

on 08/18/04 at 19:52:14, IndianaJohn wrote:

Does this sound strange to any one else?

John, there are posts I've read where some patients have been placed on long term predinisone protocols. The ones described mention a constant dose. The weaning at some later date is adddressed separately.

I think the amount used by clusterheads is typically regarded as low. It is possible that your Dr. presribed it this way to simplify the instructions and make it easier to remember how and when to take what pills. They are always doing things like that.

Still, a no taper approach doens't sound right to me.

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by Ueli on Aug 18^th, 2004, 11:35pm

Prednisone shuts down the adrenalin production and takes over its function. The usual taper is intended to give the body a chance to restore its own adrenalin production again. After long prednisone use the taper is an absolute must, otherwise you're in big troubles, as our prez Dave Edmond.

I don't know if after one week a taper is needed.

Some years ago, the Italians pioneered a mega dose of prednisone, given in a 2 day hospital stay. The idea was that this shock therapy had a better chance to break a cycle and no taper was needed. However, it's a long time since I heard anything about this.

The cardinal question is: How long does the prednisone take to shut down the body's adrenalin production? That's the point you should investigate further.

PFNADs
Ueli [smiley=smokin.gif]

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by TxBasslady on Aug 19^th, 2004, 2:07am

John,

I was on a Prednisone taper.....it ended my cycle. I went 196 days totally PF.

This was my taper:
20 mg. 3 times a day for 3 days
20 mg. 2 times a day for 5 days
20 mg. 1 time a day for 2 days
10 mg. 1 time a day for 5 days

When my doc gave me this rx, it said "take as directed", but yet there were no taper instructions. I called the pharmacy for taper inst. and they said there were at least 100 ways to taper. Called my doc, and got the above inst. and he was very apologetic for not giving me taper inst.

Now, I know you are having a rough time right now. But I would be very cautious about taking Prednisone without a taper. Just my opinion. It can be a very dangerous medication.

It has been known to affect the immune system. You could end up w/more problems than CH.

However, I am not a doctor....and certainly hold no claims to being an expert on Prednisone or a taper.

I took it for the 15 days, on a taper, and it stopped my cycle on the 1st day I took it. I did have some side effects, but not until the day after I took the last pill, which was 10 mg. I had a bit of a panic attack or anxiety attack, whichever. It only lasted a few hours, and a couple of great folks here, helped me thru that episode.

Be careful......I know you need some relief right now, but don't bring on any more unnecessary pain. You might need to read the info on Dave Emond. Of course his doc had him on a much higher dosage, with no taper.
We're all different.....what works for one, does not necessarily work for another.

Lots of PF vibes to you,

Jean

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by pubgirl on Aug 19^th, 2004, 2:26am

John
The only thing I can add to this from personal experience is that even quite high dose prednisone if given only for a few days isn't tapered, but anything more than a few days ALWAYS is taperered over here.

This is not from Ch experience but for asthma attacks. They hit hard with high doses for 3 days, then stop.
All UK Ch'ers who have had lower doses of prednisone that I know of have tapered after a couple of weeks.

Wendy

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by don on Aug 19^th, 2004, 7:28am

Unless you are on a theraputic dosage of a preventative this protocol makes no sense at all.

Most sufferers report a CH relapse after a taper if they are not on a preventative. Even starting a preventative at the same time will not give you enough time for the preventative to take hold in only 7 days.

This protocol is precribed for other conditions without taper and is appropriate. But for clusters? I doubt it.

My concern wouldn't be with the lack of a taper so much as the usefulness of it all in the first place. If your going to do it, do it right. Taper+preventative.

Long time prednisone advocate and sometimes fat man.

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by IndianaJohn on Aug 19^th, 2004, 8:03am

I'm on 480mg of verap but it's obviously not working.

This is supposed to get me by until the 31st for my neuro appointment.

Also just to give some relief.

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by don on Aug 19^th, 2004, 10:06am

How long on the verapamil? If it's 10 days or more then then the prednisone protocol might work for you. I wouldn't be to concerned about the lack of a taper.

You might feel a little unsteady for a couple of days after the prednisone but if it breaks the cycle it would be worth it to me.

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by thomas on Aug 19^th, 2004, 11:54am

on 08/18/04 at 19:52:14, IndianaJohn wrote:

Need some opinions

Start hanging out at the nearest all you can eat place and buy a heavy bag.

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by don on Aug 19^th, 2004, 12:01pm

I put Papa Ginos over the top for the second fiscal quarter.

Shouldn't I be getting some dividends or something?

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by thomas on Aug 19^th, 2004, 12:21pm

on 08/19/04 at 12:01:08, don wrote:

I put Papa Ginos over the top for the second fiscal quarter.

Shouldn't I be getting some dividends or something?

Yeah, they're called pounds baby, pounds. ;;D

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by IndianaJohn on Aug 19^th, 2004, 8:00pm

I've been on the verap for this whole cycle, 12 -13 weeks now at 480mg/day.

And yes, the passing minivans ARE starting to look rather tasty.

Wondering if don has a point...If it kicks this cycle then it might be worth it. BUT, if it doesn't work then I'm probably gonna get the crap kicked outta me.
Found out that this is something their doing in only Fort Wayne, and surrounding counties. Not sure if I like being part of this little experiment.

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by don on Aug 19^th, 2004, 8:18pm

If your not comfortable with it then dont do it. Tell your Doc and request a tapered dosage regimen.

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by IndianaJohn on Aug 19^th, 2004, 8:38pm

you're right don. I am uncomfortable with this...

Taperville here I come.

Everyone, once again my thanks

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by don on Aug 19^th, 2004, 9:17pm

No problem. The taper should work well for you.

Do you have a large meat freezer at home?

And send all family pets away for the duration.

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by vietvet2tours on Aug 24^th, 2004, 10:46am

my freakin vet tapers my dog.If its good enough for my dog it should be good enough for us.

Title: Re: Prednisone (no taper!)
Post by Major_Headcase on Aug 24^th, 2004, 1:07pm

IndianaJohn,

I just finished a similar Prednisone treatment for a swollen vertabra disk in my neck - 7 days at 60mg/day with no taper ... I've also used Pred to break my last two cycles and used a looooonnnnngggg taper period. I also freaked when my doc (also my CH doc) said that the "no taper" regimen was recommended lately. "Okay, you're the doc ..." But when I finished the 7 days, my nerve pain came back abruptly - not as much as when I first started but definitely more than the last two days on Prednisone. I wished later (like today) that I had some extra Pred around so I could do both, ie a 7 day blast at 60mg/day and a slow tapering down the following week. -John