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Title: Pepper Pills-- Post by Giovanni on Feb 12th, 2004, 9:15am Recently Floridian had stated that he used capsaicin pills while in cycle to help diminish the pain levels experienced by cluster headaches. I thought this subject should be discussed here for possible trial/use by some of us that may benefit from its use. I purchased a bottle recently (cheap) just to have on hand and have no first hand experience with using it in conjunction with these headaches as I am not in cycle now. I do, however, have chronic lower back pain for a number of years. I have basically learned to live with it, but sometimes the back pain level increases to a high level which makes functioning almost impossible. Anyway, I had taken three of these pills over the course of one day and the back pain totally disappeared. I know there’s a HUGH difference in back pain to these monster headaches, but even if these pills would decrease the headaches a few kip levels it would be worth it. Another area of concern is that capsaicin is a vascular dilator instead of constrictor. Perhaps, Floridian can answer this question? Enclosed is some information that I found on the internet concerning P-substance. Also, a search should be done on capsaicin to see if it is contraindicated for a particular medical condition (i.e. ulcers, etc.). Capsaicin first stimulates and then blocks small-diameter pain nerve fibers by depleting them of a nerve transmission factor known as substance P. Substance P is considered to be the principal factor in pain impulses coming from the periphery of the body. Substance P has been shown to activate inflammatory promoters in joint osteoarthritis and rheumatoid arthritis. Cayenne pepper’s benefit stems from reducing the presence of substance P. The most commonly treated conditions of peripheral pain are post--herpetic neuralgia (shingles), trigeminal neuralgia (also known as tic douloureux), post-mastectomy pain, dialetic neuropathy pain, cluster headaches, arthritis, and psoriasis. http://www.zooscape.com/cgi-bin/maitred/GreenCanyon/questw10000092/critiquec100031 John |
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Title: Re: Pepper Pills-- Post by floridian on Feb 12th, 2004, 11:39am John, good questions - has me rethinking some of what is "known" about CH. How much of the pain is caused by vasodialation? We know that Nitric Oxide goes way up when an attack hits. We know that NO opens blood vessels (its a prime ERF, or endothelial relaxing factor). But NO is also directly inflammitory on nerves. I've posted about the blood vessels pinching the trigeminal nerve (yesterday or the day before, in fact) - but do we know that is happening?? Is it more a question of inflammation (NO, histamine, etc) plus nerve disfunction (serotonin, substance P, NMDA-glutamate, etc)?? Or does the blood vessel really pinch on the nerve?? Dunno. If blood vessel expansion is a major part of cluster pain, why only at that one spot? Is the NO only produced there, or is that spot more sensitive? Some reports of pepper causing blistering of mucous membranes - mostly from pepper spray. Pepper is not contradicted for ulcers - in fact, it has traditionally been valued for treating ulcers. I was skeptical of this at first (thinking maybe its killing the pain without healing the ulcer), but there is some evidence that pepper inhibits H. pylori bacteria that causes many ulcers. High doses for extended periods might affect the kidneys. It also reduces the sensitivity of nerve cells, and can cause a decrease in the number of certain nerve cells. So I don't take it often, or for too long. For back problems, I would use it occasionally for pain relief, but it probably isn't curing you - just easing the pain. Exercise, good posture, and the traditional things are more likely to bring about persistent improvement - glucosamine is a good supplement for injured collagen and ligament. From the physicians desk reference: Quote:
The long term damage warnings sound serious (and I think they need to said), but similar warnings apply to aspirin, acetominophen, naproxen, and other pain meds. They can do a number on the stomach, the liver, thin the blood, and affect other organs. I have never heard of life threatening hypothermia associated with capsaicin, but in very large doses (or very susceptible persons) I could see where it might happen. Chili does cool the body when the burn wears off. As a side note, a Chinese herbologist I talked to said most headaches were caused by imbalances that redirect heat up into the head. He wasn't familiar with clusters, but from a certain perspective, that seemed to be an accurate description of the symptoms. And I don't really understand Chinese medicine yet. The PDR also notes that Cayenne is used to treat some of the same conditions it can cause - " as a remedy for stomachaches, cramps, gas, indigestion, loss of appetite, ... " The American Association of Poison Control Centers lists cayenne pepper as number 11 on the list of the top 20 plants reported in poisoning incidents. Here is their description: Quote:
A kid chewing on a pepper that they picked is going to be pretty self-limiting. Won't take them long to spit it out and run crying to mom or dad. Call 911, determine it really was cayenne, comfort the kid and parents and tell them it will wear off. But purposefully taking capsules has the potential to deliver a greater dose. Didn't see much on PubMed about capsaicin poisoning - one case in 2001 where an 8 month old infant probably died from the parents administering chili powder - caused diarrhea and vomiting. |
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