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Title: Light Therapy Post by das on Apr 10th, 2003, 5:32pm Ok. I had to post a follow up to my "Cycles of Light" topic since no one replied. Has anyone thought about or heard about cycles of light affecting CH or light therapy for treatment of CH??? Do you get yours in spring or fall?? If you do, you may want to consider this: Are the days getting longer or shorter around the time your cycles begin??? Any input would be appreciated. Thx. DAS |
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Title: Re: Light Therapy Post by Bob P on Apr 10th, 2003, 5:49pm Check the "cluster survey" link on the left and scroll down to the when do your cycles start question. You'll see about a quarter of clusterheads start in spring/fall the rest start in winter/summer or mostly randomly. |
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Title: Re: Light Therapy Post by BILLY on Apr 10th, 2003, 7:11pm Das, I will reply to this subject when I have time this weekend. I think I may know someone writing a paper on both "darkness" & "light" therapy as an adjunct for CH. I have read however that light boxes can be rented monthly saving the expense of having to purchase one. Gotta go for now, |
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Title: Re: Light Therapy Post by das on Apr 11th, 2003, 7:30am Bob, Spring and Fall have the biggest % aside from random, which I would take with a grain of salt. It is easy to think of attacks as random, if you do not try to attribute them to something. I started getting my last cycle in February.. not spring or fall.. Is that random? Perhaps not. In February, although only minimally, the days start getting longer . The amount of daylight is always changing. Perhaps some people are more sensitive and therefore get hit at what seem to be random times. Other are perhaps more sensitive to major changes such as in Spring and Fall. Think about Jet Lag.. Your brain and body get all messed up because time gets out of synch in a short time. CH could have some sort of similar impact. That is why there have been test using melatonin. Perhaps reseting your body clock could help the CH part of our brains deal better with changes in daylight. I have no way of knowing if this is at all possible, but by the same right, I believe neither do you. How can you nix a theory seemingly so easily??? What do we know for sure about CHs?? They hurt.. They're annoying.. That's about it.. Everything else can be quite different from person to person. Maybe there are underlying factors that will help us understand the apparent randomness of CH. |
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Title: Re: Light Therapy Post by BobG on Apr 11th, 2003, 2:13pm About your paragraph about......... Jet Lag-brain and body messed up because time gets out of synch-reseting your body clock-brains deal better with changes in daylight. I think none of that applies to cluster headaches. I work rotating shifts. I change to a different shift each week. I've been doing this for 30+ years. Sometimes I go to bed when the sun is shining and get up when it's dark. Other times I go to bed when the sun in shining and get up when the sun is still shining. Some times I go to bed when it's dark and get up when it's still dark. Other times I go to bed when it's dark and get up when the sun is shining. 90% of my attacks come on about an hour after falling asleep. It makes no difference if it's noon, midnight, 5am or 5pm. It also doesn't matter the season of the year. IMHO it is not day or night, spring or fall that brings on attacks. It has to do with relaxing and/or sleeping. Don't ever do either! ::) |
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Title: Re: Light Therapy Post by michaelc on Apr 11th, 2003, 3:34pm WE are all different though ... I think I see where das is going with this thread. My CH almost never happens at night or when i am sleeping. I have never been woken by a headache. Mine happen in the spring ALWAYS late feb/early march. Peak cluster times are 11am to 3:30 pm but if i sleep till 3pm, they will start 1hr after waking. so for me it's not about relaxation - its cyclic and seasonal. and these things das is bringing up are inter-related. The hypothalimus tries to regulate the body to adapt to natures cycles. In CH sufferers it gets out of whack and sends the wrong signals causing vascular headaches. It may be worth looking into the types of treatments used in other problems arising in the hypothalimus, such as SAD, sleeping disorders, etc. Sleep cycles are mediated in part by Melatonin, which is produced in the brain in response to LIGHT cycles. Melatonin, Serotonin and Psylocybin and ALL extrordinarily similar and ALL have effects on CH ..... so there may be something down this avenue ..... |
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Title: Re: Light Therapy Post by Bob P on Apr 11th, 2003, 4:42pm Quote:
Das, It's also very easy to attribute them to something erroneous when you're trying to find a reason. Quote:
I wouldn't take too much of that salt. This is a response from over 12,000 clusterheads. The largest survey of clusterheads ever, anywhere. I wouldn't be so quick to blow it off because it doesn't agree with your idea. Quote:
I was simply pointing out the stats. Not nixing it. In fact, I think you should persue it. Quote:
We know: They are strictly one sided. Effect men more than women. The hypothalamus is activated during an attack which is not seen in other headache sufferers. Clusterheads show no nightime melatonin spike like normal people do. Oh heck, we know a bunch, just read the OUCH Library. |
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Title: Re: Light Therapy Post by Mark C on Apr 11th, 2003, 5:21pm on 04/11/03 at 14:13:22, BobG wrote:
Me Too, I also have been workin split shift work for the last few years. Many changes in my sleep cycle. I am not sure if it has had any effect one way or the other regarding my CH. Maybe it has helped because I never sleep regular....then again, my last cycle was one of the worst in the last ten years. Then again I have worked all kinds of jobs through the years and have got hit every year anyway. Research points to the hypothalimus / CH link so there may be a correlation between the two and the SSRI Meds. I have done all the drugs..MJ included..only Triptans have helped me so far. PFDAN's Mark |
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Title: Re: Light Therapy Post by Jarvis on Apr 12th, 2003, 10:19am After several years of CH I pursued the light therapy as I too thought maybe this was an issue. I bought the lites to systematically bathe under, changed several of the fixtures in the home and office, Installed automatic timers to extend the daylight hours morning and night, and more. I went to great lengths to replicate a summer day. I found no benefits at all. My attacks continued. The cycles were not random but allways accured at varying times of the year. winter, spring, summer and fall. I feel that many methods including lite therapy are purely phscological and they may help for some issues but not CH. One thing I did discover through this is that regardless of the lite levels what was important for me is that my morning wake up times needed to stay the same or the attacks were worse than normal. I have stayed on the wakeup times since. Allways waking at the same time but I may return to sleep only a few minutes later. Rather than trying to fool the clock. It seems to be a better way to maintain my own clock. |
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Title: Re: Light Therapy Post by brain_cramps on Apr 12th, 2003, 2:29pm For what its worth... Circadian Abnormalities. Cluster attacks often follow the seasonal increase in warmth and light, beginning in summer and ending in th fall. Researchers have therefore focused attention on circadian rythms, and in particular small clusters of nerves in the hypothalamus that act like biologic clocks. The most important nervous cluster is the suprachiasmatic muclei (SCN), which appears to help coordinate the body's activities (sleep/wake) with the environment (dark/light). Some studies support the idea that some failure in this boilogic pacemaker may impair the pain control system and cause these terrible attacks. The hormone melatonin is also involved in the body's biologic rhythms. http://tinyurl.com/9e8b Its a 16 page .pdf describing CH and seems pretty informative. grant |
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