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        New Message Board Archives >> Medications, Treatments, Therapies 2003 >> Shroom update
        
(Message started by: Henk on Dec 14^th, 2002, 3:12am)

Title: Shroom update
Post by Henk on Dec 14^th, 2002, 3:12am

Hi folks,

It's a while ago since I updated here and there's still good news from my side! It's almost 1 year ago since I used *any* kind of medication. CH isn't gone completely, but it's no more than some mild shadows.

After six years of being chronic, CH moved *very* much to the background. It was hard to supress the devil at first. Took some shroom tea every 2 weeks for about 6 months. But then the beast went quiet, *very* quiet.

I can safely consume some alcohol ( 1 or 2 glasses of wine per week, wich seems a good 'test' for me as is was a big nono for a long time ) but much more important: going to sleep is no longer such a painfull experience :D

THANK YOU shroom pioneers!! And many thanks to mother nature for having shrooms :) To me they were a life saver. And THANK YOU ch.com, cause here is where I found out about shrooms

For the people who are afraid of "doing drugs": It was NO problem at all to leave my shroom stock alone once there was no more use in taking them! There was no craving at all for another trip. I found it easy to draw the line between medicinal and recreational use, even though I had big fun during some trips. And since I grew my own, there's a large stock at hand here *grin*
I'll leave it alone till the beast returns. My CH is doing very, very bad ( so I am fine! ) And my intuition tells me to keep this "steady as she goes" till there are signs that action is required.

Many greetings to all you clusterheads, I realy hope that more of you find some kind of solution to this horrible condition. I managed to survive 6 years with the beast, but surviving and having a life are different things!

Henk

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by domm on Dec 14^th, 2002, 10:18am

Henk - Really glad you found some success ;D
hang tough
domm

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by eyes_afire on Dec 14^th, 2002, 11:10am

Wow Henk, that is great! I have got to ask you some questions so please bear with me. Does this mean that you currently are having shadows or other neurological symptoms but no CH pain attacks? How long has this been happening, for the entire past year? I'm sorry if I'm making you repeat yourself, I just want to make sure of what you're saying (because I need some kind of hope). It seems like there are now at least 3 of us who are experiencing this after the shrooms. I ask these questions because I really would like to know the true mechanism of how the psilocybin works, I'm wondering if maybe it also has an effect on on some neurochemical process other than 5HT receptors.

My story: I used to be episodic with 6 month cycles. My current cycle started in September 2001 (14 months ago). In May 2002 and June 2002 I tried to taper off of verapamil several times because that is when my cycle was expected to end. I could not taper off verapamil because every time the CH Beast would attack. By July 2002 I started to freek because the cycle was 10 months and I was very afraid of becoming chronic, so I decided that I needed to try the shrooms. In July 2002 I tapered off of verapamil and stopped taking any imitrex (I only used O2... let me tell you that was not an easy thing to do, I was still getting crushed with CH and verapamil was the primary thing restraining the CH beast). I started dosing mid-July 2002. I noticed that the psilocybin had a good effect in reducing the frequency and severity of CH attack for about a week. Basically it was more effective on a per-dose basis than anything else I've tried. After a week, I needed to redose. I dosed weekly until about mid-October 2002. I stopped dosing in mid-October because the CH pain attacks subsided. My last actual CH pain attack was about 6 weeks ago. But for some reason, the shadows and other neurological CH symptoms are still with me. Now, at certain times of the day I get all my typical CH neurological symptoms... except for the pain. My current symptoms include pressure behind eye, extreme left nasal congestion, burning eye, watery eye, red eye, itchy eye, and occasional short sharp shooting pains behind eye.

I don't really know why my pain cycle subsided. It could be that was just the way the cycle was going to go, but maybe the psilocybin is having some sort of lasting effect that is preventing me from experiencing the CH pain. I don't know.

Yes, I agree with you, psilocybin does not cause dependence. It has been given an un-just reputation. In my opinion, alcohol is a more damaging drug and yet some people have no qualms about abusing it because of it's 'legal' status.

Thanks for the update, Henk

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by cathy on Dec 14^th, 2002, 7:22pm

I find this subject really interesting....I have tried them for recreational a long time ago.......wes hasn't but I think he's going to give it a go....let you know if we get hold of some, how he gets on....happy to hear that you're getting good results. :)

Cathy :)

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by rick on Dec 15^th, 2002, 3:46am

Henk-HELL YEAH!!!

Eyes- I'm still experiencing CH symptoms here and there, but I've only had one actual attack (Kip 4) in about three months now. I dosed the day after that and haven't had a full blown attack since. And I've been able to drink wine 8) 8) 8).

I'm happy about that one.

Peace-R

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by rick on Dec 15^th, 2002, 3:50am

Cathy-

http://www.lilshopofspores.com/

http://www.mycotopia.net/

Hope this helps!

R

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by firebrix on Dec 15^th, 2002, 5:56am

Greetings Henk!
This is good news indeed! Really happy to hear that the news is all good. Long may it continue!There's hope for Mopar yet!
firebrix

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by cathy on Dec 15^th, 2002, 6:14am

Thanks rick.....know what to get him for crimbo now...!!! ;D

Cathy

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by tommyD on Dec 15^th, 2002, 10:01am

Great news, Henk. It's good to hear that a chronic has made this work. It seems it's much more difficult for chronics to find long-term relief, but it's starting to look like the continued dosing will break the Beast.

And those funny little mushrooms do work My update: eleven months pain free. Took my first treatment (half gram of cubensis, trip level 1-1.5, done twice) while in cycle in July of '01 and got two months relief. Then the beast would return, I'd do the two doses five days apart and get another two months relief. (I am apparently an episodic with very long cycles.)

In January '02, took another half-gram but this time it was azurenscens, twice as potent as cubensis. Had a level 2.5-3 trip, more than I expected, but not unpleasent; followed that with a quarter-gram for the second dose and have been pain free since.

Almost. Every month or so, I would get a few days of warning signs -- mild to moderate shadows, the scalp tingle, a little tinnitus, maybe a "cluster zit"-- and I would start thinking about preparing for the Beast's return, only to have the signs fade away for another month.

Just this morning had a hint of a shadow and a brief tingle in the scalp, but not getting excited. If the signs last more than a week, or the beast does make a full-blown visit, I will prepare to dose again.

And I agree. Shrooms do not foster physical addiction or psychological cravings. I have not been tempted in the least to tap into my supply since January.

Eyes afire -- I noted you mentioned "itchy eye" as one of your "non-pain" symptoms. I get these weird attacks occasionally, usually out-of-cycle, that include all the usual symptoms -- nasal congestion and discharge, pupil constriction, lasts about an hour, etc. -- but instead of intense pain, an intense itchy feeling in the eye and the lacrimal (? tear duct) area. I've mentioned this on the board before, but no one ever said they also experienced this phenomenon.

I will issue my usual disclaimer: Shrooms are not for everyone; take care if you have emotional problems or psychological insecurity; research carefully, avoid street drugs. BUT... I read of prednisone, sansert and other drugs with the horrifying side effects, withdrawal problems; circulatory side effects with verapil; and the incredible expense of Imitrex, even when it works well. Then folks say they can't see themselves taking a psychedelic drug...they are afraid of the effects, afraid of the illegality, afraid of possible dependence and abuse.

I want to scream "TRY THE SHROOMS!" but I restrain myself.

It's up to each individual how they battle the Beast, and you shouldn't take hallucinogens if you fear them. But why fear them? Seems to me the indole ring hallucinogens (psilocin, psilocybin, LSD) are the best pharmocological treatment yet found.

Now stepping off soapbox,

-tommyD

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by domm on Dec 15^th, 2002, 12:28pm

tommyD - happy for ya, man. Your comments about taking 'shrooms versus other "legal" medicines make perfect sense to me. I'm one of the lucky episodics who have cycles only every 2 to 3 years. Conventional treatments, for me, are covered by insurance and more importantly - work. If they stop working - I will seek alternative methods of battling the beast.
PFDANs to ya and have a great holiday
domm

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by eyes_afire on Dec 15^th, 2002, 9:57pm

Well TommyD, now you know of someone here who does get that same intense itchy eye feeling that you get ;D. I also get a twitching eye (and today it has been twitching). I'm allergic to tree pollen, so I can say that the itchy eye feels very much like my tree pollen allergy, except I know it is not caused by tree pollen because it's only my left eye when in cycle and because the trees aren't pollenating now. So I'm guessing that the itchy eye is due to a histamine release, which is believed to occur during or before CH. I know that itchy eye and twitchy eye are not universal CH symptoms, but those symptoms are definately associated with my CH.

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by firebrix on Dec 15^th, 2002, 11:32pm

Thanx tommyD!
Really good to hear you're having success with the shrooms. To hear this is most encouraging! Thanx for bothering to share with us.
Long may your PFDAN continue.
PFDAN to you all
firebrix

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by Flash on Dec 17^th, 2002, 5:20am

Folks,

I have mentioned this phenomina (however dat spelt), of phantom attacks subsequent to aborting/preventing cycles with hallucinogens, many times in the past.

Sometimes I go a week here or there of waking up with a shadow in the morning, but it never comes to anything.

I also experienced itchy/teary/twitchy eye but don't relate this to the CH - who knows though?

Pinky was skeptical of the phantom attacks, but I notice that several people have reported them over the years. Sometimes it feels like your in an episode but only the pain is absent. It's like your body wants to have CH but is being prevented from doing so. The problem with this is that is is hard to relate phantom attacks to out current best guess theory. They don't seem to fit.

One other thing I have also mentioned in the past, might be worth repeating it in case anyone else experiences it - this will save them months of worry! For the past 2 years I have experienced twitching in virtually every muscle in my body at some time. Just like in the eye, but could be leg, buttock, arm, stomach... Apparently these are called muscle fascillations. They are also a symptom of MND/ALS. Now after 2 distressing years I'm convinced that I don't have MND/ALS. I should also point out that things often twitch for days on end, and that something twiches pretty much every day. Sorry I know thing sounds funny but I fuckin shat myself with worry for a long time.

The facillations were made worse the more I worried about them, and become almost unnoticable now that I don't worry about them, however they are still there.

There is a benign condition that also causes this but nobody knows why. I only mentioned because I too get the eye fascillations. In fact I got those first. Eye fascillations are common among motorcyclists, and often accompanied by tearing etc due to exposure to cold air. Since I ride a bike, and the attacks happened when riding in the cold I figured they were related to that.

I only mentioned this just in case anyone else starts twitching because i wouldn't want them to go through 2 years of worry like me.

Flash

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by ave on Dec 17^th, 2002, 8:17pm

Dearest Flash, you and Pink are my heroes in a way. Thanks again for the support at my first try.

Since I took my second batch of shrooms, I have been getting these "silent" or ghost attacks. Especially since late spring I get them 2/3 times a day. They don't wake me at night, but if I stay awake after 2.00 am I get them.
I have called it low level chronic, lol.
The beast is there and is touching all the points he used to torture. It just does not hurt. Good chance it was shrooms that gagged the beast.

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by pinksharkmark on Dec 27^th, 2002, 9:46pm

on 12/14/02 at 03:12:16, Henk wrote:

Thank you so much for your update, Henk. I always appreciate your way of covering all the important points without being too "wordy", and the information itself is fascinating.

As to the increasing number of reports we are getting regarding "shadows" and "painless CH" post-mushrooms, I disagree that it is necessary to abandon the "resetting the hypothalamus" theory of psilocybin action in order to explain it. It may be that for certain individuals, the psilocybin is insufficient to reset things to a completely "out-of-cycle" state... perhaps it is only partway reset.

Notice the symptoms described are usually those that many of us consider warning signs... it is as if there is a continuum of symptoms, starting first with a tingle or an itch, then progressing to reddened and teary eyes, stuffy nose, then finally escalating levels of pain. The pain is the LAST stage of the progression of symptoms. For whatever reason, those who have dosed with mushrooms experience only the first half of that continuum, and some even less than half. One could reasonably speculate that the brain of someone who has tried psilocybin says something like, "Okay, Beast... I will malfunction only up to THIS point, but no further!"

Again Henk, it was great to hear of your success. To go from a longterm chronic to a med-free person (an entire year, at that) with only occasional shadows is one hell of a success story.

I urge all who have tried this therapy to update us periodically, even if it is just to say that you are still pain free.

My turn: I have been painfree since my last dose of mushrooms about ten months ago, but I have had remissions as long as fourteen or fifteen months between cycles in the past even before I started using mushrooms. I do intend to do a "booster" dose one of these days soon... I just never seem to get around to it. I believe it is best to take periodic doses (maybe twice a year) while in remission rather than wait for the warning signs to manifest themselves, so do as I say rather than as I do (or don't)! Take your booster shot NOW!

pinky

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by JoeyT on Dec 29^th, 2002, 10:15am

Can someone tell me how I can get some 'shrooms' asap. It really sounds like something to investigate. I have read some of the info on shrooms but it sounds like a LONG and difficult process to grow them. I tried them many years ago in High School but at that time I didn't get CHs.

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by Mitch on Dec 29^th, 2002, 1:08pm

Hey Folks,

Great news Henk! I hope you get continued success.

It’s been about three months pain free for me now since my last dose. I do get twinges in my temple but they are very brief and they don't bother me like they did at first. I know that the beast will not break through so it’s no big deal.

Mitch

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by tommyD on Dec 30^th, 2002, 8:17am

Joey T -

No one here will sell you shrooms. I, and others, DO NOT recommend buying shrooms on the street. It is too risky. The shooms could be adulterated with other drugs, or they might be some other kind of mushroom - perhaps a toxic species (some mushrooms have psychoactive effects and toxic effects as well). Remember, you are dealing with a criminal element when you buy street drugs. Safety and ethics are not a street dealer's main concern.

Best idea is to grow your own, I'm afraid. Get started as soon as possible. And remember, shrooms work best if you are out of cycle, and if you have "de-toxed" from medications. Meanwhgile, do the research, check out the Clusterbusters FAQ and website, read the archives on past posts to this message board.

The FAQ:
http://home.attbi.com/~rwold350/

The Website:
www.geocities.com/clusterbusters2002/
(the website may be temporarily down - keep trying, it will be back)

This is not a treatment to try in haste. That's easy for me to say when I'm pain-free, but try and hang in there.

-tommyD

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by pinksharkmark on Dec 30^th, 2002, 8:56pm

on 12/29/02 at 10:15:32, JoeyT wrote:

I have read some of the info on shrooms but it sounds like a LONG and difficult process to grow them.

It may SOUND like a long and difficult process when you read some of the detailed grow guides, but believe me it is much easier to grow them than to read about growing them. The authors of those guides go to considerable trouble to describe everything as exactly as possible and to anticipate all potential difficulties, 99% of which never happen.

Stripped of all the details, this is what you need to do:

1) Prepare the mushroom "soil" and load it into glass jars with lids

2) Boil the filled jars in a big pot for an hour, let them cool to room temperature

3) Inject spore solution into the jars, place the jars in a dark spot, and wait around two to three weeks for the mushroom "roots" to fill the jars

4) Remove the "cakes" from the jars, place them in a sealed container with high humidity. Air out the container once or twice a day. Wait a week or two.

5) Harvest mushrooms. Wait a week or two for the next crop, harvest, etc. After three or four crops the "cakes" will be exhausted and can be discarded.

As for timing, if you do everything exactly as the guides say, and keep the temperatures at the ideal spot for each part of the growing cycle, it is not that unusual to harvest your first mushrooms in four weeks, although 5 to 7 weeks is more likely. Call it 6 weeks from the time you inject the spores.

pinky

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by rick on Dec 31^st, 2002, 2:29am

on 12/30/02 at 20:56:19, pinksharkmark wrote:

It may SOUND like a long and difficult process when you read some of the detailed grow guides, but believe me it is much easier to grow them than to read about growing them.

Amen. Growing them is as complex as a junior high science project, far less intimidating then it ever might appear to be.

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by Mastifflvr28 on Jan 1^st, 2003, 1:38am

Pinky,
You forgot the most important part.
You must sing to them as you fan, just not country.
Happy Farmin!!
Mast

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by talitha on Jan 2^nd, 2003, 7:11pm

Is it illegal to grow your own?

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by eyes_afire on Jan 2^nd, 2003, 7:26pm

According to the US federal government, psilocybin and psilocin are schedule I controlled substances. The government classifies substances as schedule I supposedly because they are considered highly addictive and have no medical use (apparently the government is wrong on both counts). Therefore it is a federal (USA) crime to be in possession of psilocybin and/or psilocin.
So the answer is: Yes, it is illegal.

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by Mr.Happy on Jan 2^nd, 2003, 8:29pm

Although I have No Problem straying from the straight and narrow every now and then, our beloved government has put a whole new light on the 'illegality" of Hallucinogens, per the link below:

http://www.ndsn.org/JAN93/LSD.html

With my luck, the "Spore Police" will show up 5 weeks into the project. I'd do better stealing $80 million and committing rape.
Yup. Makes sense to me........

Prime Crime Time,
RJ

http://drfeller.com/clustology/clchurch.jpg

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by Not4Hire on Jan 2^nd, 2003, 8:46pm

Ya rock RJ....

given the opportunity to steal $80 mill..... or kill the MOFO...

I think I'll go for PF...... ;D ;D ;D

(on the other hand,

....I got different fingers......)

up yers BrianY.....i LIKE dem ellipsis.......

...

8)

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by firebrix on Jan 3^rd, 2003, 4:37am

Yes talitha it is illegal....................

to sing country to your shrooms!!!!!

Possession of spore is legal, but growing/ using/ supplying the actual shroom is not legal. If you embark upon this therapy you must be a secret squirrel! Tell no-one and keep everything out of sight til you have sufficient for several months dosing. These babies dry up to NOTHING - or very little, so grow heaps more than you think you'll need. Just be a little careful.

All the best in your endeavours.
firebrix

Title: Re: Shroom update
Post by talitha on Jan 3^rd, 2003, 10:59am

all righty...my husband is totally freaked out now...first he has to deal with his wife changing into this pissed off, exhausted, desperate person (he's never seen me like this before) now he thinks I'm going to revert to my hippie days trippin' through the fields pickin' shrooms out of cow poop. Still, sounds like a better treatment than some of the anti-depressants (Paxil and Effector)
lots better than Prednisone and if it sends the beast packing it is soo worth it.