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        Cluster Headache Help and Support >> Medications, Treatments, Therapies >> Variation on the Water Treatment
        
(Message started by: K-MAN on Jan 25^th, 2008, 5:08pm)

Title: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by K-MAN on Jan 25^th, 2008, 5:08pm

After dealing with one of the toughest cluster cycles in recent memory, I am pleased to report a pain-free time for the past two days. This is especially noteworthy since I have been at the peak of the cycle and getting hit twice a day.

Everyone here is probably familiar with the "water treatment" listed on the main menu at ch.com. I did some additional research and discovered that while I have been drinking lots of water during the day, my body may not be holding on to it long enough for it to be delivered to the cells. Several sites I found suggested adding some sea salt to your drinking water to provide minerals and trace elements that let the cells avail themselves to the water. I tried it and got two pain free days out of it so far. It may not be a cure, but it knocked the snot out of the Beast for at least a little while. Obviously I'm skeptical of whether this will last, but I'll take what I can get.

Here's exactly what I did:
Morning - drank a 32 oz. PowerAde and had breakfast
Lunch - mixed 3 teaspoons of unrefined sea salt in water and drank it all. Tasted horrible.
Drank a gallon of water over the course of the rest of the day.
Dinner - drank another 32 oz. PowerAde with dinner

I had one of those dull Kip 1-2 hangover-like headaches after the Kip 6 I had that morning. I was 4 weeks into my cluster cycle. Then I drank all the stuff listed above. I went to bed with the same dull pain and woke up clear with no pain. For the last two days I continued drinking water with 1 teaspoon of sea salt added per gallon, and I haven't gotten hit yet. I'm drinking about a gallon a day to maintain. I'm still getting shadows, but nothing has broken through.

I bought the sea salt at the local health food store. From what I read, if it's white salt it won't work, and table salt doesn't have the right stuff in it. The kind I got is light pink in color, but there is another kind that's light gray. Supposedly either kind will work.

It sounds too simple to work, but it did. Like I said, I'm skeptical that the effects could last, but I'll take the pain-free break any way I can get it.

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by Guiseppi on Jan 25^th, 2008, 7:31pm

It sounds too simple to work, but it did. Like I said, I'm skeptical that the effects could last, but I'll take the pain-free break any way I can get it.

Yeah but who would have thought water would work in the first place! If it works, stick with it. Hoping it gives you a LONG break!!

Guiseppi

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by Jonny on Jan 25^th, 2008, 7:49pm

Damn!, I was hoping that you put a garden hose in your ass. ;;D

Ok K-Dude, dont freak....its only a joke!

Thats great that you found something that works for you, and I would like to add that you posted about it better than I have ever seen anyone post about something that work....you didnt run up in here screaming "Cure"...good for you and I hope the PF days last forever, man!!! [smiley=headbanger.gif]

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by Annette on Jan 25^th, 2008, 8:13pm

Good on you for finding something that worked !

However, be careful of how much salt you put into your body. You should see your doctor and ask for a blood test checking for urea, creatinine and electrolytes just in case, especially if you have any kidney or prostate problems.

Annette ( MD - Just to keep Potter happy ;;D )

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by George_J on Jan 25^th, 2008, 10:18pm

Sounds like it's well worth a try.

Presuming the next cycle starts when expected, I'll certainly give it a go. Since I just had a complete physical with a metabolic screen and everything was cool, I doubt it'll do any harm.

As others have said, thanks for presenting your experience in a complete, detailed, and dispassionate fashion. It's pretty refreshing.

Best wishes,

George

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by Gator on Jan 26^th, 2008, 12:03am

If it works for you, then more power to ya! I hope it keeps on working.

For me, 3 teaspoons of salt in one glass of water would probably make me puke. I think I would try dissolving it in the gallon jug. Same salt intake spread out over a longer period of time. This could make the levels of sodium and other minerals more level throughout the day rather than spiking and then crashing. I have to wonder about the long term effects of such high salt intake on the body.

However you do it, though, congrats on finding something that works for you.

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by sandie99 on Jan 26^th, 2008, 2:37am

I drink lots of water myself and I have actually tried water with salt in it, regular table salt, and it tasted horrible. I don't think I'd be brave enough to try sea salt like you have.

I'm glad that it or water or both together have given you PF time. I hope as well that it will last! :)

In the meantime, just enjoy each PF moment and don't worry about ch. :)

Wishing lots of PF days,
Sanna

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by RichardN on Jan 26^th, 2008, 12:27pm

OK . . . a little more to perhaps convince a few to try water therapy.

On about 1/3 of my posts to newbies, I will usually include, "Please don't discount water therapy (see "water X 3" . . . link on left). I'm convinced this has helped me reduce the frequency/intensity of attacks"

Why I'm "convinced"?

When I came here 2/02, and finally got a name-for-the-pain and the material to take to my doc (who provided me with Verapamil & 02), my wife also tried to get me to try water therapy. I probably suffered from the same prejudices that many doctors hold toward 02, in that their remedy for abortion of pain is . . . pill, shot, or surgery . . . 02 isn't in their bag of tricks. . . it's too easy. Whether consciously or not, I really didn't consider that water therapy might work for me . . . . after all, Verap and 02 had finally made my attacks fewer, less severe and 02 was ALWAYS available.

In 4/04, I was diagnosed with (bladder) cancer, followed by 10 mos of (3) minor surgeries, BCG treatments, and finally (2/05), cystectomy (removed bladder and prostate) . . . lymph nodes were positive for cancer cells . .. so . . . on to chemo.

All during this time, was on the Verap (360-480 mg) and had 02 availabe at all times. Prior to starting the chemo, I seemed to have some remission (CH wise), and stopped all my other meds . . . Altace, Zocor, Zetia, and yes Verapamil as my blood pressure dropped uncomfortably low . . . would count on 02 to abort.

When I started my chemo, I always brought my backpack which contained extra clothes and a "B" tank. After a month or so, I left it in my van . . . never had an attack during chemo . . . which prompted me to start a thread on whether or not chemo "juices" could have any positive effect on CH . . . I don't recall any positive or negative replys.

Now for, what for me is the "clincher". Water therapy for me is not voluntary. I'm required to drink large quantities of water to keep my kidneys and neo-bladder flushed to prevent UTIs (at least five the first year following surgery . . . one in the last year). I normally consume 4-5 quarts of water daily. I drink 4-5 cups of coffee in the morning, a cup of milk with my meds, and carry a 1/2 gal insulated mug of water wherever I go, sipping constantly. This past spring and summer was mostly PF, and the hits I had were usually under Kip 5 and easily handled with 02. On those occasions I (for whatever reason) wasn't able to consume my normal amount of water . . . the beast would show up. The less I drink, the more frequent and harder the hits. If I drink 1/3 of my normal intake, I'm guaranteed to get slammed and set off a series of attacks. If I drink 2/3 my normal intake, I'll have some minor attacks and frequent shadows. 4-5 quarts and I'm mostly PF.

It is NOT easy to drink that much water daily . . . but definitely worth trying especially if nothing else is working. I do take a multivitimin and would advise your doc if you're going to try water therapy to make sure it won't affect other meds or interfere with other therapies.

Re the sea salt. We have used (white) sea salt (in the little pepper-grinder containers) for years . . . don't know if that has anything to do with my results or not. I try to avoid nitrates/nitrites . . . . most of the time.

Okay . . . that's my spiel on water therapy and why I'm (finally) a believer.

Be Safe, PFDANs

Richard

PS If anyone knows of someone diagnosed with bladder cancer, and surgery is indicated . . . please PM me. I had a remarkable "nerve-sparing" surgery, and while I have a neo-bladder, I DON'T have a stoma and also have some sexual function. I'm especially happy to not have that bag adhered to my belly.

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by K-MAN on Jan 27^th, 2008, 9:37am

It's been 4 days, and I'm still pain-free. There's something to this treatment anyway. Who knew?

I'm still getting shadows, especially in the morning, less in the afternoon, and I keep thinking a full attack will break through. But so far it hasn't.

The only drawback is all the bathroom time from drinking this much water, but it's a small price to pay. 8)

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by sandie99 on Jan 27^th, 2008, 9:39am

I'm glad it's still working! :)

PF wishes,
Sanna

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by Gator on Jan 27^th, 2008, 8:03pm

on 01/27/08 at 09:37:16, K-MAN wrote:

Assuming it's the added salt that is helping, then maybe mixing it in the gallon of water and spreading it out throughout the day may help keep the mineral levels more constant throughout the day and may stop or reduce the morning shadows.

Right now, you are taking it all at lunchtime and having pf evenings, but by morning the levels in your body have dropped and you are getting the shadows.

In theory, this might work, again assuming it's the salt that is making this work better for you.

Glad you're getting some pf time, whatever the reason.

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by DragonSlayer on Jan 29^th, 2008, 2:15am

HI, I'm new here but not new to CH.

I've been using "water therapy" as it is called here for many years. Just a few thoughts for you to consider and my humble opinion (MHO). Water quality is very important and will vary from location to location. Have you seen the water quality test results of your water source??

Andrew Weil, M.D. (alternative medicine guru) points out that Tap water and even Bottled water can contain toxins, he recommendes using filtered water and never drink or cook with water that contains chlorine, lead, and a looong list of other toxins (ie. most muni water in the USA).

John Gray, Ph.D. (the Mars & Venus guy) recommends drinking 1/2oz water per lb. of body mass as a minimum daily intake and 1oz water per lb. body mass as a detox flush, with sea salt added at a rate of 1 teaspoon per gallon added to replace electrolytes.
(Edit: at 175 lbs = 175oz = 5-6 liters water a day for me.
128 lbs = 128oz = 1 gal water a day for smaller frame ppl. )

MHO After all I use water therapy to flush toxins from my system. Sea salt will replace electrolytes and many trace elements I would never get with my daily diet.

My last K10 was 3/2001 but maybe I've just learned to respect the power of this monster and come to believe that I'm stronger than he is.
This is a wonderful site!!! Wish I would have found it 25 yrs ago!!! You guy's are gr8 I hope this will help someone.

Now where the heck is the spell check??? ;;D
Mike

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by RichardN on Jan 29^th, 2008, 8:32am

Hi DragonSlayer & Welcome

We're fortunate to have one of the better wells in our county. A high percentage of wells here have high concentrations of iron and/or sulphur (in which case, you don't buy white clothes/sheets), and our municipal water supply sucks . . . you can smell the chlorine before you try and drink it (which we don't).

I haven't had it tested, but now am curious enough to do so. Maybe I'm sitting on a gold mine of "magic" ClusterWater ;).

I do wonder what other toxins I'm ingesting via my plastic insulated mug and the bottled water I use if I'm out and empty my mug. A couple of weeks ago Anderson Cooper did a news piece on toxins . . . he had a toxicity test done and one of the chemicals in his system was attributed to the plastic water bottles many of us have used for years.

I also wanted to add that my triggers are still/always active (alcohol/petroleum.sp? fumes), but the reaction to same seems directly linked to my water intake.

Be Safe, PFDANs

Richard

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by Guiseppi on Jan 29^th, 2008, 10:15am

There are numerous areas in the United States in which lithium is a naturally occuring compound in the water supplies, in significant concentrations! My doctor mentioned that to me when I started my lithium therapy. Not suprisingly, violence related crimes are very low in these areas! Be funny if it turns out you live in one of those areas! ;)

(Lithium, at 1200 mg a day, is my "MAGIC BULLET" when I'm in cycle)

Guiseppi

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by K-MAN on Jan 29^th, 2008, 11:33am

I'm glad to get some confirmation on the sea salt phenomenon from the rest of you. I thought I would offer an update in case anyone was wondering if the water effect could last.

Still pain-free after 6 days, but I've been getting some serious shadows--enough to get my attention, but not enough to break through into full attacks.

It's strange. My wife looked at me last night at dinner and told me the pupil in my left eye was several times smaller than my right. Nothing hurt, but the left is where my headache attacks happen. A few minutes later I started feeling some shadows. I drank a couple of glasses of water, finished dinner, and the shadows went away. I guess I'm not out of the woods yet, but I'm also not getting hit.

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by DragonSlayer on Jan 29^th, 2008, 2:11pm

on 01/29/08 at 10:15:20, Guiseppi wrote:

I've heard of that area also (isn't it's nickname Zombieville, Ky? ;) ). I'm not fortunate enough to have helpful minerals in the water here, reverse osmosis filtration would remove the salts (lithium) anyway.
I've used a good quality multi vitamin, C 1000mg, E 400I.U., Calcium 1000mg, Magnesium 400mg, Zinc 15mg, B2 100 or 200mg, and B-complex as daily supplements with 3-6 liters water (I drink water till my urine is clear). During the summer I'll stop all supplements for 4-6 weeks and continue water (summers have always been off cycle for me).
This year I forgot to start up the vitamins and now I'm paying with k6-8's since end of Dec. It's getting much better this last week with most <k6 and an occasional k8 breaking through (Thank GOD for sumatriptan). I keep my eye on omega-3's and will supplement if I don't eat 2-3 fish meals a week and I've used melatonin 300 - 600 mcg as a sleep aid.
After reading here I'm going to up the melatonin to 3-6 mg at night when necessary and i've tried the energy drinks. I've got rapid relief with the energy drink (Rock Star & Jones) but I don't like the caffeine buzz (scatter brain) and the shadow returns in about an hour. I have better long term results (albeit not near as fast) with xtra strength OTC pain reliever (Acetaminophen 250mg, Asprin 250mg, Caffeine 65mg). I want to find and try Taurine and see if I can find a balance.

Sorry for going on so long, I didn't mean to hi-jack this thread.
Best PF wishes to all!!
Mike

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by Guiseppi on Jan 29^th, 2008, 4:21pm

No apology needed! ;;D Intersting to see someone else with a VERY similar supplement regimen to mine. I do the calcium/magnesium, the B-2, the B-complex and the melatonin year round. And have been a water camel for several years. I'm convinced it has produced a reduction in both the frequency and the severity of my attacks!

Guiseppi

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by kcopelin on Jan 29^th, 2008, 6:34pm

Tommorow I start the water detox with sea salt. Nothing else is helping-and although I tried this a long time ago, I did not add sea salt and I counted energy drinks and diet sodas as water. (I was not a chemistry major ::)
Thank you so much for the detailed account and I am very glad that its helping you. 6 days is 6 days and what a blessing!

PFDAN y'all
kathy

Title: Re: Variation on the Water Treatment
Post by K-MAN on Feb 1^st, 2008, 4:29pm

Just a quick update: I rate the water treatment with sea salt a 9 out of 10. It has taken me from 2 attacks/day down to one/week.

With that said, I have been getting hard shadows and mild pain without the full-blown attacks. I did have one attack break through and get to about a K3. That was on day 6 of the plan. Not fun, but not the hardcore mess I was dealing with before.

Still seeing shadows in the mornings and late evenings, but I'm able to kick it with ice packs and sugary Cokes--obviously not your typical attacks. For those of you wanting to try it, I highly recommend it. It's not perfect, but it's a heck of a lot better than most things I've tried. Good luck.