Clusterheadaches.com Message Board
        (http://www.clusterheadaches.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi)
      

        Cluster Headache Help and Support >> Medications, Treatments, Therapies >> waddya think
        
(Message started by: chopmyheadoff on Nov 1st, 2006, 10:07am)
Title: waddya think
Post by chopmyheadoff on Nov 1st, 2006, 10:07am
i been thinking ( i do that sometimes )

when i cut off my thumb and it was sewn back on, the surgeon said "dont smoke while its healing as nicotine is a vasconstrictor and the blood vessles we have mended will not appreciated being constricted while they are joining"..

now if fags are vasoconstrictors, how come smoking doesnt kill a ch ??

And ... on a second note, at the time (regretabely) i used cocaine now and again. this is before i knew what my evil headaches actually were.
Now i DID notice that if i had a sniff as soon as i felt one coming on then 9 times out of 10 the ch would abort.

now i AM NOT NO WAY advocating the use of drugs
just bored and airing a few thoughts

what yall think ??  [smiley=curtain.gif]
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by Richr8 on Nov 1st, 2006, 10:40am

on 11/01/06 at 10:07:08, chopmyheadoff wrote:
i been thinking ( i do that sometimes )
when i cut off my thumb[smiley=curtain.gif]


Interesting, but considering that, shouldn't your name be:
choppedmythumboff?  :)
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by Charlotte on Nov 1st, 2006, 10:52am
I don't smoke, never have had the habit, but sometimes when I'm getting hit, I really want a cigarette and a shot of brandy.

Also, why are vasodialators prescribed and do work for some people?

Charlotte
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by kcopelin on Nov 1st, 2006, 4:05pm
So, hmmmm...interesting...you cut your thumb off!!!!
OMG! And the doctor told you not to smoke.  I'da thought he would tell you not to play with sharp objects.
Alot of us smoke-it is a vasoconstrictor-as is caffeine.  And, IMHO, alot of us have been self-medicating with both of those for some time.  
But, alot of us have not been cutting our thumbs off.  OMG.
kathy
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by Linda_Howell on Nov 1st, 2006, 5:42pm

Quote:
how come smoking doesnt kill a ch



  Because there is not ENOUGH  in one cigarette to abort an attack.  These HA's need something a lot stronger...like Imitrex.
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by JeffB on Nov 1st, 2006, 6:18pm
I wonder if you cut your finger off when getting hit, would that end the head pain?
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by andrewjb on Nov 1st, 2006, 9:40pm

on 11/01/06 at 18:18:59, JeffB wrote:
I wonder if you cut your finger off when getting hit, would that end the head pain?

;). lets hope not, eh ?
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by MJ on Nov 2nd, 2006, 12:31am

on 11/01/06 at 10:07:08, chopmyheadoff wrote:
i been thinking ( i do that sometimes )

Hate when that happens

And ... on a second note, at the time (regretabely) i used cocaine now and again. this is before i knew what my evil headaches actually were.
Now i DID notice that if i had a sniff as soon as i felt one coming on then 9 times out of 10 the ch would abort.

now i AM NOT NO WAY advocating the use of drugs  [smiley=curtain.gif]


just bored and airing a few thoughts.

from the archives of neurology;

"Cluster headache. Local anesthetic abortive agents
J. P. Kittrelle, D. S. Grouse and M. E. Seybold


Cocainization of the sphenopalatine fossa region has been shown to abort acute cluster headaches rapidly. Whether this response occurs by sympathomimetic action or via local anesthetic effect has been unknown. In this study, lidocaine hydrochloride was given as a therapeutic abortive agent to patients with cluster headache to elucidate cocaine's mechanism of action in relieving symptoms and to search for a safe, nonaddicting agent for self-administration. Using a 4% lidocaine solution applied to the sphenopalatine fossa, four of five patients obtained rapid relief of nitrate-induced cluster headaches and associated signs. Lidocaine was also effective in relieving spontaneous attacks. These results indicated that anesthetic rather than sympathomimetic effects are responsible for cocaine-medicated abortion of cluster headache, that transmission of pain in cluster headache likely occurs via the sphenopalatine fossa, and that topical lidocaine is effective in rapidly aborting acute cluster headache."


On the other hand cocaine has been known to cause pretty nasty headaches on its own.
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by chopmyheadoff on Nov 2nd, 2006, 3:05am

on 11/01/06 at 18:18:59, JeffB wrote:
I wonder if you cut your finger off when getting hit, would that end the head pain?


no way mate
i cut it off right at where it joins the hand, not just the tip.
it hurt like hell obviously - id say about a 7 on my kip scale
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by chopmyheadoff on Nov 2nd, 2006, 3:06am

on 11/02/06 at 00:31:47, MJ wrote:
just bored and airing a few thoughts.

from the archives of neurology;

"Cluster headache. Local anesthetic abortive agents
J. P. Kittrelle, D. S. Grouse and M. E. Seybold


Cocainization of the sphenopalatine fossa region has been shown to abort acute cluster headaches rapidly. Whether this response occurs by sympathomimetic action or via local anesthetic effect has been unknown. In this study, lidocaine hydrochloride was given as a therapeutic abortive agent to patients with cluster headache to elucidate cocaine's mechanism of action in relieving symptoms and to search for a safe, nonaddicting agent for self-administration. Using a 4% lidocaine solution applied to the sphenopalatine fossa, four of five patients obtained rapid relief of nitrate-induced cluster headaches and associated signs. Lidocaine was also effective in relieving spontaneous attacks. These results indicated that anesthetic rather than sympathomimetic effects are responsible for cocaine-medicated abortion of cluster headache, that transmission of pain in cluster headache likely occurs via the sphenopalatine fossa, and that topical lidocaine is effective in rapidly aborting acute cluster headache."


On the other hand cocaine has been known to cause pretty nasty headaches on its own.


that is some interesting reading
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by BB on Nov 2nd, 2006, 6:13am
Gee, Chop, you called yourself Uncle Chop Chop but I didnt realise you had actually done the "chop" act on yourself! :P

Nicotine is a vasoconstrictor and it does constrict arteries everywhere in the body but the amount contained in a cigarette is not enough to reverse the vasodilatation of the carotid artery and its main branches, which are the ones involved in a CH attack, as they are large vessels.

However its enough to cause significant vasoconstriction of the microvascular vessels in the hands and feet to delay wound healing there.

Thats why the specialist told you not to smoke while your thumb was trying to revascularise.

I hope it had healed well  :)

Annette
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by chopmyheadoff on Nov 2nd, 2006, 6:30am

on 11/02/06 at 06:13:53, BB wrote:
Gee, Chop, you called yourself Uncle Chop Chop but I didnt realise you had actually done the "chop" act on yourself! :P

Nicotine is a vasoconstrictor and it does constrict arteries everywhere in the body but the amount contained in a cigarette is not enough to reverse the vasodilatation of the carotid artery and its main branches, which are the ones involved in a CH attack, as they are large vessels.

However its enough to cause significant vasoconstriction of the microvascular vessels in the hands and feet to delay wound healing there.

Thats why the specialist told you not to smoke while your thumb was trying to revascularise.

I hope it had healed well  :)

Annette


thanks sweety - yes it has, it was only a year ago and it is like it never happened !! i have full strength and feeling back. oh and a dirty big scar

it was really funny when the feeling first started to come back because the surgeon said "we dont know which nerves connected to which, so we just sew any old nerve to any old other nerve".

the upshot of this was that i would touch the side of my thumb and it felt like i was touching the top etc etc really wierd. anyway, the nerves have now "learnt" what role they are playing and everything is back to normal  8)

except my CH !!

on a side note, when it happened, i was in hospital and got a cluster, i had just been given 12mg morphene iv and although the pain in my thumb stopped, it didnt even touch the cluster !!!
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by unsolved1 on Nov 2nd, 2006, 6:00pm
Smoking is not going to kill a CH for me. Neither will Cocaine. I did 4 drops of liquid cocaine in each nostril @ the Diamond clinic and it didn't help anything !

UNsolved
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by E-Double on Nov 3rd, 2006, 5:39am
As Michael suggested above, some clinics with some of the biggest names in headache treatment will use cocaine.

I used to think that it was due to my usage since the first time I reclall going into cycle was following a bit of "partying" in college.

I thought I blew out a sinus.

As it turns out, it was coincidence.
The irony was that my biggest times of "partying" were in April and November which coincided with alumni events......spring/ fall go figure this is what my cycle just turned out to be.
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by taraann on Nov 8th, 2006, 3:21pm
I must admit in the past I was an occasional coke user and while on a night of use my customary 3 am hit (of course I was still "partying" at that time) did not occur.  AND on a few occasions when my ch was just turning from shadows into an attack when I did the illegal my ch didn't grow into a ch...........the again the day after really sucked
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by chopmyheadoff on Nov 9th, 2006, 2:30am

on 11/08/06 at 15:21:50, taraann wrote:
I must admit in the past I was an occasional coke user and while on a night of use my customary 3 am hit (of course I was still "partying" at that time) did not occur.  AND on a few occasions when my ch was just turning from shadows into an attack when I did the illegal my ch didn't grow into a ch...........the again the day after really sucked


yeah , this is my experience exactly !!!
there must be something in it. and its not just the pain killing effects of the drug, as we know, pain killers dont work for CH.

BUT . .  we cant all go round off our heads all day can we ??? lol

ill ask my doc for a prescription of coke , see what he says LOLz
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by tanner on Nov 9th, 2006, 2:38am

 Just make sure and ask for the diet coke  ;) No point getting all that sugar ;;D...Tim
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by BB on Nov 9th, 2006, 4:20am

Anyone with CH asks me for a script of diet coke will be given sugarfree Redbull  :)

Plus maybe a flu needle for being norty ... ;)

Annette
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by AussieBrian on Nov 9th, 2006, 4:33am
Just to muddy the waters a little further, I've had three cycles abort immediately after extremely painful injuries. Coincidence, perhaps, and I as much as I care about serious research I'm not going chop my thumb off, thank you.

I've also found that huge blasts of adrenaline will lower an average K8 cycle to 5 or even less. Perhaps the two are related.
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by thomas on Nov 9th, 2006, 9:28am
I sometimes smoke if I am getting shadows to try and head the beast off at the pass.
Title: Re: waddya think
Post by taraann on Nov 9th, 2006, 1:36pm

on 11/09/06 at 04:33:44, AussieBrian wrote:
Just to muddy the waters a little further, I've had three cycles abort immediately after extremely painful injuries. Coincidence, perhaps, and I as much as I care about serious research I'm not going chop my thumb off, thank you.

I've also found that huge blasts of adrenaline will lower an average K8 cycle to 5 or even less. Perhaps the two are related.

Had a seriously broken toe once, broke my little one so it poked out sideways till I cracked it back into place.  When I would get hit I would try putting ALL my weight onto that toe to take from the pain, didn't work just made the SOB throb like mad after the ch was gone


Clusterheadaches.com Message Board » Powered by YaBB 1 Gold - SP 1.3.1!
YaBB © 2000-2003. All Rights Reserved.