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        New Message Board Archives >> Jan-Mar 2004 >> Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
        
(Message started by: 357Mag on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 10:51am)

Title: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by 357Mag on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 10:51am

Pardon, but i have to vent a little here because I cannot believe what I have just been told.

Episode started in mid Dec. Called Neuro last wk Fri., explained # and severity of attacks to nurse. Got an appt. 11 DAYS OUT for next Tue.

Been on Topomax [25mg 2x/day - same ole story, treating for meegraines]. This Monday decided to try meda does of 100mg 2x and have PF since then.

Down to 2 tabs left so I call nurse for refill. She asks mg and i tell her 25 but that i have upped my dosage and she cops an attitude. Didn't care or want to hear about 47 attacks since 1st of the yr.

Tells me they don't like to see patients self-med'ing and she will 'see' if the doc will refill. I told her we are going to start treating for clusters and not meegraines when i see doc on Tue. If he doesn't, I will be in their waiting room having an attack in front of their patients.

She hung up. Guess I will wwait and see if the RX gets refilled, but in the meantime, it is off to find some shrooms.

357Mag

Title: Re: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by Edski_1 on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 11:09am

I understand, and I don't...I spent six years working in the dental field, so I see the business side of it. I also recall a few years ago when I finally tried to seriously treat my hypertension and I was getting serious HA's from a med...these were NOT CH's...pretty close, they reminded me of my previous cycle, but were not quite the same.

My mom told me a lesson she learned from our family physician when I was a baby...you have to be your own detective. I stopped the meds cold turkey, the HA's went away. I started alternating the two different BP meds on different days (a diuretic and a CC blocker, I think), and WHAM, the one pill that *shouldn't* have been giving me the HA did in 15 minutes...

A few people thought I was a little stupid repeating the experiment a few times, but I wanted to be able to tell my Doc, who had kind of shooed me away when I had suggested this BP med was causing these HA's, in no incertain terms, that I had done the tests. After all, 6 years of colege to be a scientist, 8 years of professin experience as a scientist, and six years further as a computer programmer tends to make you pretyy methodical.

So .357, I see your point...you don't seem to have migraines...but some Docs only come your observations reluctantly. It works both ways. It took me 8 years to realize that my BP at 170/90 or 180/100 was not right for a 32 year old man who was other wise in great shape...So these pissing matches between patients and doctors can go on in either direction.

I hope you try to mend the fence, even if it means eating a little crow. If the dosing you have been doing witht he Topamax has been helping let them know, and try to show some documentation to support it. Better communications leads to better science, and better data, and better policy....blah blah blah....I think in the end although the doctor may not like the patients to self medicate, they probably do want the patients to feel better...

Hope this helps! :)

Title: Re: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by 357Mag on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 12:03pm

All i can say in response Edski is that i did communicate that the increassed dose has kept me PF from the first moment i tried it.

This is the same doctor that told me pressure applied to the neck couldn't possibly assit in alleviating or lessening the intense pain; and that it was, pardon the pun, 'all in my head'.

Sorry, I guess i am just feeling a bit low today even though i am PF.

Title: Re: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by PatFan on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 12:44pm

In regard to the neck pressure....
That's the only freakin way I have been able to survive thousands of headaches over the better part of the last two decades. Carotid pressure on the dilated artery slows the blood down, and for some means less pain. If I catch it as a shadow and apply the neck pressure, I can sometimes abort and the headache never develops. Your doc is an idiot. I explained this to my neuro and he totally under stood why the neck pressure can help. Hope things get better for you soon....

Title: Re: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by Brian_Y on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 2:10pm

Y'all need to have someone like me handling these issues. I had a nurse once in tears. I made her cry with an unrelenting barrage of insults and perfectly impenetrable logic where the only response was, well, to cry. And I got what I wanted as well as a personal call from the office manager apologizing. A doctor's practice IS. A. BUSINESS.

Poor diluted idiots.

I take Hannibal Lecter's attitude toward the free range rude.

As should you.

Title: Re: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by kissmyglass on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 2:23pm

I believe lying to your doctor is one of the stupidest things a person could do.
Since I've become a clusterhead, I've changed my mind.

Kev

Title: Re: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by Edski_1 on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 4:03pm

357, then that shoudl really be the most import thing to them...I think that has something to do with the Hippocratic Oath. Not sure cuz I'm not a Doctor.

But messing around with meds can be dangerous...so there is a degree of appreciation that *could* be extended. Of course I know nothing of any history with this practice etcetera...and a lot of us have had the run around of mis-diagnosis et cetera...Hell, in my current cycle I was given two contra indicated drugs and told I could take them together by my general practitioner!

No easy answers I guess...If you are able to perhaps go to another neuro. But the reality is that not everyone is "free" to choose their health care providers...so you might be stuck dealing with people who misdiagnose and chastise you for telling them that they are doing so. :-/

Title: Re: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by Cerberus on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 4:30pm

I get sooooo tired of hearing about the "god" complex some doctors seem to get after med school or after many years of individual practice. And the intervention by nurses or receptionists pisses me off even more. Don't even get me started on Pharmacists. I would love to try this tactic just once if it wouldn't land me in jail.........

Go Into the neuro's office and beat the receptionist, nurse and doc all in the head repeatedly all the while asking what are ya gonna do to stop it?

My best guess would be that whatever makes it stop immediately is the first choice. Unfortunately, even doctors are human and DO make mistakes. Getting one to admit he/she is wrong is another story entirely.

Stand your ground and discuss with your doctor the facts and implications of your treatment, if you still get an undesireable response....................Fire the bastard and get a new one who will admit to his/her humanity.

Ramon

Title: Re: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by Kevin_M on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 5:02pm

Personally I don't think it good to lie to your doctor or your lawyer, because they can easily be replaced anyway.
Not lying to my lawyer was all he asked for and he hit me all home runs.
Now, about the doctor. I agree getting results from a doctor regarding CH is frustrating. I have found my doctor has his own beliefs about clusters, none of which are correct, however he understands the pain I express. He prescribes me whatever I ask, as long as he thinks it appropriate, because I articulate what it is like to roll on the floor with an icepack to your head
pleading with God. In the respect of relieving pain he helps. But when I discuss clusterheadaches themselves, he starts blabbing about maybe have you
thought of changing your diet. What the... And when I mention the cycles and timing and a relation to the hypothalamus he laughs like it's an old wive's tale. I mentioned getting O2 and he laughed about that. So this guy is out there, but in his defense, I have not missed a day of work in six years. He asks me if I have
missed any work when I go in and I tell him I haven't and he pats himself on the back.
So, I told him, respectfully, today I was going to go to the new headache clinic the hospital opened up, just to see what they can tell me. He fills out a form to have a brain CT scan and says, "You'll be needing this before
you go."
All and all, I've not lied to him and he has stuck up for me when the pharmacy calls and asks if this amount of Imitrex is for real that has been prescribed. But I can see he can take me just so far and now I must, on my own, seek further help. I believe he sensed I was not lying and that is what led him to help, but as far as knowledge about clusters, well, I try not to insult him.
Afterall, he has had a heartfelt duty to relieve pain, as a doctor. That much I give him.

Title: Re: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by jminmilwaukee on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 5:43pm

You know, today's health care market is highly competative due to MAJOR cutbacks in medicare and "cherry picking" specialists. Now I don't know if this is an option in your town, village or city but drop that dock like a bad case of crabs and get a new one.

Would not hurt to find out who the head of that department is and file a formal complaint regarding your abuse from the nurse / receptionist from hell.

jmin but you can call me jim

Title: Re: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by Roxy on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 5:55pm

File a complaint.

Find a new doctor.

Title: Re: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by t_h_b on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 6:10pm

Ditto, ditch the MD. (Get another one first.)

Title: Re: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by chronic_chic on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 6:42pm

on 01/23/04 at 18:10:22, t_h_b wrote:

Ditto, ditch the MD. (Get another one first.)

This is what I'm in the process of doing...I feel safer assuring myself that I will have another doc before firing the one I'm seeing now. That way at least you're not floundering around on your own. I've never upped my meds on my own, but I've ditched almost all of them (except 2) on my own now. There is a time and place for playing with meds on your own, in my opinion, but always be safe.

Hugz,
Lizzie (currently hoping none of you beat ME up when I become a nurse...please!) :)

Title: Re: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by jonny on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 6:58pm

on 01/23/04 at 16:30:27, Cerberus wrote:

I get sooooo tired of hearing about the "god" complex some doctors seem to get after med school or after many years of individual practice.

Bingo, Ramon!!!

I asked my last neuro if he knew of Dr Goadsby's research and he said "Who?, never heard of him"....I kindly pointed to the wall of books and said "That guy there on your shelf".......He repiled..." I havent read that book yet"

What a crock of Im better than that guy ive never heard of him shit.

..........................jonny

Title: Re: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by brad267 on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 9:01pm

Didn't I see a list of interview questions to ask your potential neuro somewhere on this site? Maybe add:

1) If my condition changes for the worse, while under your care, are you going to make time for me THAT day?

2) Since we'll both be very knowlegeable about the drugs you're telling me to put in my body, how much variation will you allow me, based on my judgment of the day-to-day situations? (If none, see question #1)

3) What's your home phone number? (LOL, I know, I know...)

To guess at a doctorically correct scenario, 357Mag, you probably should have called and left a msg for the Dr asking him if it was ok to up your dosage. He'd probably have had a nurse call 6 hrs later and said yes, or (hypocratic oath) been obligated to see you that day. Then it's on your med file, and refills are no sweat....

Just my opinion.....

PF Y'all
Brad

Title: Re: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by t_h_b on Jan 23^rd, 2004, 9:07pm

You should probably ask the underpaid receptionist at the front desk about how available a same-day appointment is rather than the doctor--you're more likely to get a realistic answer. Some MD offices, it's hard to even get through on the phone.

My neuro has his cellphone number on his answering machine in case you need to contact him after hours. For real. No joking. I still have a hard time believing it myself. (Of course, I never actually called it, so ????)

My internist will write for just about anything that I think I need except that he is a little scared of the amount of verapamil I take--and it's only 480mg. He thought it would be better to let the neuro take on the responsibility when I doubled it from 240mg.

As far as varying the amount of your meds as you see fit, get him to write for the larger amount or to write it as a range. Some drugs might not be appropriate to vary daily, though. If you get extra, you can hoard them for when you don't have insurance. Just be sure to use the oldest first. And make sure that the Rx specifies the total quantity to be filled on a monthly basis or the pharmacy will have to call to clarify.

Title: Re: Honesty w/Doc NOT Always Best Policy - UGH!
Post by floridian on Jan 24^th, 2004, 2:16pm

Quote:

Lizzie (currently hoping none of you beat ME up when I become a nurse...please!)

Just get a big OUCH tatoo on your arm and keep your sleeves rolled up. Guaranteed to elicit sympathy from us, and fear from others. You'll be a great nurse, Lizzie.