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(Message started by: chewy on Jan 30th, 2008, 9:40pm)
Title: This happening in your community??
Post by chewy on Jan 30th, 2008, 9:40pm
I was part of a presentation tonight by the Middlesex County Sherriff's Office.

The Education coordinator described a phenomenon call "Parm Partes" or "Trail Mix Parties". Basically its when a group of kids raid the parents medicine cabinet for both RX and non Rx meds. They go to a party, dump them in a bowl, the bowl is passed around and you blindly take and ingest whatever you take out of the bowl. Sounds crazy but I guess its happening.

Is this a popping up in your communities?
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by Jonny on Jan 30th, 2008, 9:43pm

on 01/30/08 at 21:40:49, chewy wrote:
Is this a popping up in your communities?


No, I dont live in the projects....thank God.....LOL  :-*
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by chewy on Jan 30th, 2008, 9:45pm
The phenomonon is occuring primarily in the middle to upper class suberbs.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by Jonny on Jan 30th, 2008, 9:49pm

on 01/30/08 at 21:45:20, chewy wrote:
The phenomonon is occuring primarily in the middle to upper class suberbs.


Im sure Alex Jones has something to say about it.....LMAO  ;;D
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by chewy on Jan 30th, 2008, 9:51pm
If anyone has any intelligent input please feel free.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by Mosaicwench on Jan 30th, 2008, 9:57pm
I saw this mentioned on CSI awhile back but have heard of nothing like it in my community.

There's no substitute for knowing where your kids are, who they're with, and what they're doing.  That's what parents are for.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by Sean_C on Jan 30th, 2008, 9:59pm

on 01/30/08 at 21:51:29, chewy wrote:
If anyone has any intelligent input please feel free.


Whats to say dude, its everywhere.

Boston had its highest murder rate ever. Manino won't do anything, change starts there.

Pass a law that if your kid gets caught with your subscription you have to do a mandatory 14 day stay at your local State Prison in population.

They make us lock up our guns, why not start locking up mommy and daddy's adult candy dish.

I wonder if it would make a difference.

Sean.................................
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by Linda_Howell on Jan 30th, 2008, 10:01pm

  I live in an area that in 20 mins..one is out of the city and in a remote area of the BLM land and other areas like it.   The kids have "raves" and yes....that is going on.    I first heard of it a few years ago.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by chewy on Jan 30th, 2008, 10:02pm

on 01/30/08 at 21:57:24, Mosaicwench wrote:
I saw this mentioned on CSI awhile back but have heard of nothing like it in my community.

There's no substitute for knowing where your kids are, who they're with, and what they're doing.  That's what parents are for.


That was the message of the presentation. Parents are the first line of defense.

I question how prolific this Parm Party thing really is. I do a lot of work in the substance abuse arena and haven't seen this as having a big impact in this area.

Wondering about other areas.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by Redd on Jan 30th, 2008, 10:06pm
We recently had a 14 year old die from an overdose due to one of these parties.  The other 14 year old has been arrested and they are deciding if he will be charged as an adult or not.

He broke into his parents LOCKED box and stole Morphine.

Edit to add:  the two boys were also cousins.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by Jonny on Jan 30th, 2008, 10:07pm

on 01/30/08 at 21:51:29, chewy wrote:
If anyone has any intelligent input please feel free.


Theres no way Alex Jones fits in that catergory, right?

LMAO!  :-*
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by chewy on Jan 30th, 2008, 10:11pm

on 01/30/08 at 22:06:35, Redd wrote:
We recently had a 14 year old die from an overdose due to one of these parties.  The other 14 year old has been arrested and they are deciding if he will be charged as an adult or not.

He broke into his parents LOCKED box and stole Morphine.

Edit to add:  the two boys were also cousins.


The tragedy is that its the younger kids who are participating.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by Redd on Jan 30th, 2008, 10:18pm
The thought is, that because the drugs aren't "illegal" they can't be as bad for you.

We ran a 3 part story about this last year in the paper.

It's happening anywhere.  When I was in high school, we always knew where to go to get the "good" stuff.  From the kids at the Catholic school.

edit: cuz I kant speel
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by chewy on Jan 30th, 2008, 10:21pm

on 01/30/08 at 22:18:12, Redd wrote:
The thought is, that because the drugs aren't "illegal" they can't be as bad for you.

We ran a 3 part story about this last year in the paper.

It's happening anywhere.  When I was in high school, we always knew where to go to get the "good" stuff.  From the kids at the Catholic school.

edit: cuz I kant speel


That is exactly right. The notion that the drug is a prescribed drug justifies the use. Its not just Rx drugs though. Its the over the counter meds that are being used as well.

You dont have that series archived somewhere do you?
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by Redd on Jan 30th, 2008, 10:28pm
I don't know.  If you can give me a real good reason to ask if someone in the IC center to take time to look it up I can find out if they will. ( time constraints with only having 4 news and 2 sports reporters right now could make it more difficult.)

We have a new Managing editor who started 2 days ago, and from what I understand she is a real hard nose witch.  It may be one of those back burner things.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by andrewjb on Jan 30th, 2008, 10:37pm
teenagers get bored, its ' a rights of passage ' for some. andrew.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by chewy on Jan 30th, 2008, 10:41pm

on 01/30/08 at 22:37:25, andrewjb wrote:
teenagers get bored, its ' a rights of passage ' for some. andrew.


Thats the attitude that get them killed. If they are bored then its the parents responsibility to get them unbored.

A lot of kids don't make it to the end of the passage.

Check your PMs Redd.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by Jonny on Jan 30th, 2008, 11:05pm

on 01/30/08 at 22:41:53, chewy wrote:
If they are bored then its the parents responsibility to get them unbored.


And just how is this done, Yee who has no children?
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by Redd on Jan 30th, 2008, 11:10pm
Another facet to this multi facted problem, is that in the larger areas much of this news is over shadowed by the latest murder, the next white coller crime.  It's when there is a tragedy in small town America like we had, that proves if it's going on in hicksville USA, it's an even larger problem in the big cities.

The time it takes from injestion to death for a drug overdose is much longer than we see portrayed on TV dramas.

This kid took the drugs, was out cold when his friends took him home and he was poured into his bed ... asleep in his own bed and was dead by morning.

Many of these deaths are deemed suicide.  You've heard the parents state they didn't think anything was wrong.  The kid was an A student.  Looking to go to college.  No signs at all.  It was an accidental overdose.  Not suicide.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by chewy on Jan 30th, 2008, 11:18pm

Quote:
You've heard the parents state they didn't think anything was wrong


Thats where it gets complicated. Denial? Not knowing the signs and symptoms? Combination of both?

Those are the parents we are trying to reach. The presentation tonight was specifically designed for those parents.


Quote:
Yee who has no children?


Shows how little you know.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by Linda_Howell on Jan 30th, 2008, 11:22pm

 
Quote:
From the kids at the Catholic school.


   [smiley=confused.gif]


or the Baptist school or the Jevhoa Witness school or the Jewish school or the Muslim school or the Anglecan school or the Unitarian school, or the Mormon school or the Pentecostal school.

Drugs are everywhere.  
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by Redd on Jan 30th, 2008, 11:32pm

on 01/30/08 at 23:22:04, Linda_Howell wrote:
 

   [smiley=confused.gif]


or the Baptist school or the Jevhoa Witness school or the Jewish school or the Muslim school or the Anglecan school or the Unitarian school, or the Mormon school or the Pentecostal school.

Drugs are everywhere.  


It's another example of the denyal mode Don is talking about only Linda.  I agree drugs are everywhere.  

What I was trying to illistrate is that the mentality that "These are good kids from good God fearing families" isn't going to alter the statistics.  
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by nani on Jan 30th, 2008, 11:39pm
I've heard rumors of such parties, not in my town, but in more affluent areas of Albuquerque.

I live in a piss-poor county, where most parents are on DEA watch lists. If these kids are gonna cop from their parent's stash, it'll be all illicit drugs.

Parents are the first line defense against this kind of risky behavior, but frankly, way too many parents are not up to the job.  :-/

Kids are getting drunk on cough syrup every weekend... for heaven's sake! Scary world...

nani, who hopes she taught her kids well.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by George_J on Jan 31st, 2008, 12:12am
Not that I've heard of.  

That's not to say it isn't happening, of course, but around here, the use of methamphetamine by all segments of the community--rich and poor, young and old-- is certainly more noticeable.

Best,

George    
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by zwibbs/Scott on Jan 31st, 2008, 6:10am
It is definately happening here in Westchester County. The situation is alot of health care providers use an " Express Script" company who will provide two to three refills at one time.They come via the postal service and instead of 1 bottle you now have three. ( This is for anyone who is on a long term medication) If a teenager were to take three from every bottle, it would be almost impossible to detect. The detox hospitals are over crowded with teenagers. I feel for parents of these kids because most of them are good people. I have found that " instant gratification" is the policy of alot of the young kids. Beer used to be their choice, and now it is the trail mix party.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by andrewjb on Jan 31st, 2008, 6:21am

on 01/30/08 at 22:41:53, chewy wrote:
Thats the attitude that get them killed. If they are bored then its the parents responsibility to get them unbored.
                           
i would imagin most parents try like hell to keep their children / teenagers ' unbored ', but with the presures of society, earning a living and simply the demands of being an individual, the youth end up expermenting, some alas tragically, dead. iam not sure social status has a bearing. its just that there is less heard from lower down the social scale, andrew.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by john_d on Jan 31st, 2008, 6:35am
Yeah, it's all fun and games until someone puts a pile of prescription-grade Laxatives in the bowl.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by andrewjb on Jan 31st, 2008, 6:42am

on 01/31/08 at 06:35:08, john_d wrote:
Yeah, it's all fun and games until someone puts a pile of prescription-grade Laxatives in the bowl.

;;D.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by artonio7 on Jan 31st, 2008, 7:13am
Sadly we've been living in the world of better living through chemistry for years and years now... turn on the television and you don't have to wait long before  a messenger will deliver the promise that your life will be better/different if you just take one of these little pills. It's no longer even noticed... just an ever increasing status quo.

I'm a child of the late sixties and early seventies... so this is nothing new to me... instead of trail mix parties, getting drunk, high or popping some new pharm were just another saturday nights option for entertainment.

We seem to be allowing the message to get across to EVERYBODY that it's ok to alter your perception through additives rather than developing spiritual fortitude and resilience the old fashioned way... work for it. Look at some of the leading commercials during the super-bowl... alcohol commercials. I'd say we are a nation who loves to give out mixed messages and it's no wonder the kids are so fucked up...

I don't know if it's a matter of denial as much as it's a "do as I say not as I do" message that the kids are getting. My community has doctors who pass out scripts to Oxycontin like gatoraide at a marathon. Recently a young girl at a local high-school died before the ambulance got there due to oxy consumption, on further investigation... kids were snorting oxy's as a regular activity while at school... during movie time the kids would put their hoodies up lower their head to their desk as if they were napping and were using that as a cover for snorting... the school imposed a no hoody policy.

There is no simple solution to this problem short of changing our values, budgeting our time and shifting our standards. Parenting, a full time job, is given part time priority, for many there is no choice.  For some it's just poor parenting.

Here is a link that I found that you may find helpful concerning trail mix parties.
http://www.pioneercounseling.com/display_article.asp?article=7044

with warm regards,
Tony
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by deltadarlin on Jan 31st, 2008, 10:12am

on 01/31/08 at 07:13:53, artonio7 wrote:
I'm a child of the late sixties and early seventies... so this is nothing new to me... instead of trail mix parties, getting drunk, high or popping some new pharm were just another saturday nights option for entertainment.


with warm regards,
Tony


There's a *yeah but* here.  I may be a bit younger than you (not much), but we probably had the same mantra, "drugs, sex and rock n' roll.  That being said, most of the people that I knew wouldn't take anything that they didn't know exactly what it was and most of us didn't have a tendency to mix drugs.  Hell, most of us had a copy of the PDR and if we didn't we knew somebody who did.

I think some of these kids today are quite lacking in common sense.  Common sense tells you that you don't take pills when you don't know what they are and common sense tells you that you don't mix drugs.  Some of this is the parents fault, but you have to lay the fair share at society's door too.  As they say, *remember when?* parents could actually discipline their child without the government intervening?  when you set rules for your kids, there were actuall consequences if the rules were broke, rather than society questioning *why* little jonny or little mary did what they did (again, the responsibility is laid at someone elses' feet)?* and I could go on and on.

And believe it or not, some of this may be related to what we've told our kids about drugs.  They are told how *bad* they are, not to take them, yada yada yada.  Well, then either they or someone they know does a drug and nothing horrible or bad happens, at that point you begin to lose credibility.

With daughter, we were completely honest about our *past* peccadillos.  We did not lie to her and paint horrid pictures of drugs.  We did tell her what can happen when you're stupid and that stupid sh!t leads to bad consequences.  We also told her about *our* friends who are no longer with you because of bad choices.  We lucked out, she's 24 now and has NOT used drugs, legal or illegal and has no intention of using them.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by midwestbeth on Jan 31st, 2008, 1:03pm
Reading about these kinds of parties and hearing the girls talk about drugs they know kids their age are doing led me to have (and still often do) very frank discussions about what would happen if they ever chose to do something as stupid as to take drugs.  Good senerio; they go to the er and get stomach pumped, not pleasant.  Bad senerio; they could die, they are not invinsible.  

When they have done something stupid in the past (I always find out, I'm nosey like that) they get grounded and talked to.  I try to be as honest and frank with them as possible, reminding them that I love them, but I'm not their friend, I am thier Mom and no one, not even sopossed friends, have thier best interests at heart like I do.

My youngest, very pretty, popular cheerleader type, has been sitting at home on Saturday nights for the last couple months because all of her friends have been making bad choices lately and she does not want even be around that.  She's upset and feels she is losing friends, but will not even consider caving in to the tremendous peer pressure she has been experiencing lately.  She has been very honest with me.  All I can do is listen to her talk and cry.............I am so proud of her, and at the same time heartbroken to see her so upset, but then proud again of her knowing this develops character in the long run and I know she will be just fine.

It really is the parents responsibility to know who, what, when, where, and then to check, just to make sure.  Even if you do trust them.

Beth
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by BarbaraD on Jan 31st, 2008, 1:36pm
Why are people just "noticing" that this is a problem (this from a mother who raised a kid)? It's been going on for years... these parties were happening back when my son was a teenager (he just had his 20th class reunion this summer) so it's NOT new.

How do I know - because my son TOLD me about them. I was a LUCKY parent who kept the lines of communication open and my son could tell me anything (and he told me a whole lot of things I didn't really want to hear). But I didn't react hysterically - we discussed.

I knew when he drank beer and I knew how much he drank and where he drank it (I might not have approved, but I knew he wasn't driving when he was drinking - that was MY rule and he still follows it today). I knew when he tried pot because he came home and told me he tried it and didn't like it. (I tried not to act shocked on that one, but at least he TOLD me about it).

I knew when he lost his virginity (I could have done without that one!).

But it comes down to communicating with your kids - not telling them, but communicating with them. They're not going to do everything you think they should (and yes, they're going to do things you'll cringe about), but if you don't react negatively, but stay calm and DISCUSS with them, you'll come out a lot better and have a lot less shocks in the long run.

But I don't think it's about locking up anything - I think it's about communication with your kids - if they know they've got their parents behind them, they're less likely to be too stupid, but being a parent is a full time job - most people with kids today just aren't willing to make the effort - it's easier to make excuses "after the fact."

Hugs BD
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by Rosybabe on Jan 31st, 2008, 3:33pm

on 01/30/08 at 22:41:53, chewy wrote:
. If they are bored then its the parents responsibility to get them unbored.


bored because they have no chores ..I understand kids should have some free time to unwind and play but some responsabilities won't be bad for them. My daughter is only five but she has to keep her room clean and organize her toys every day and empty the trash bins at the bathroom and so on...a few chores and she is never bored I promise you. just my 2 cents in here.....
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by Annette on Jan 31st, 2008, 4:04pm

I see this problem happening as the nuclear family is breaking up and so many parents arent just doing their jobs right anymore. Parents these days are either too stressed, too tired, too bored themselves, working too much .... and they used meds/drugs/chemicals to get through the days themselves, hence sending the wrong messages to their children.

Firstly, parents who need to take that much meds and therefore having that much meds in the house, prescribed or not , especially strong ones like morphine and codiene, are the source of the problem to start with. Being on those meds regularly they are less likely to have clear mind, clear conscience, clear whatever to be good responsible parents. We all know CH pain is the worse pain known to man yet most CHers dont need to take pain meds for it. Many are using meds for the wrong reason, ie as a quick/easy fix rather than proper treatment. There are too many adults ( parents ) out there abusing meds, the kids see their own parents taking those meds like lollies and feel "better" on them, of course they will think its OK to take them too.

Its the same problem as kids drinking alcohol and getting drunk from a young age if they live in an alcoholic household. Children learn mainly by copying and mirroring the parents behaviours. They wont " do as I say ", they will more likely " do as I do ". If the parents take drugs or meds or drink regularly, they wont be able to teach or convince the kids not to do it.

Its those parents that need rehab, before the children can be helped effectively. The denial we see after a tragedy is the parents trying to defend their own actions, shirking their responsibilities. They see no problem is themselves needing to take all these meds. That attitude needs to be changed.

JMHO.
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by chewy on Jan 31st, 2008, 4:59pm
Its always an interesting discussion. It always produces something positive to think about and act on but my intent is simply to find out what the prevelance of these Pharm Parties is and if they are happening then where are they happening.

Whose better at a run on sentence than me?  8)
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by brewcrew on Jan 31st, 2008, 5:01pm

on 01/31/08 at 16:59:20, chewy wrote:
Whose better at a run on sentence than me?  8)

That was a pretty good one. ;)
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by nani on Jan 31st, 2008, 5:03pm

on 01/31/08 at 16:59:20, chewy wrote:
Whose better at a run on sentence than me?  8)




The comma is your friend. Don't be afraid of it.   [smiley=grin2.gif]
Title: Re: This happening in your community??
Post by monty on Jan 31st, 2008, 5:40pm

on 01/30/08 at 22:02:37, chewy wrote:
I question how prolific this Parm Party thing really is. I do a lot of work in the substance abuse arena and haven't seen this as having a big impact in this area.

Wondering about other areas.


No personal knowledge - I googled 'Pharm parties" and found a few articles which seemed to be alarming/alarmist. Some of these things are self-limiting (like the use of inhalants). Also, I suspect that most kids that are using swiped pills have a rough idea of what it is they are taking, if it makes them go slower or faster, what the usual dose is,  etc.  But assuming that the general public (especially young-uns) have common sense is often wrong.  Assuming that people are in-control or even want to be in control is another dubious belief.

Might be good to invent an urban legend about the pharm party with laxatives (as john_d suggested).


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