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        Cluster Headache Help and Support >> Cluster Headache Specific >> Prednisone and CH
        
(Message started by: cash5542 on Jul 17th, 2007, 5:51pm)
Title: Prednisone and CH
Post by cash5542 on Jul 17th, 2007, 5:51pm
OK I know when prednsione is used for CH and then tapered it seems to create more headaches but has anyone found it can actually trigger CH if its being used for a different reason? Lisa is on her 3rd day (40mg) and will be done tomorrow after 20mg. She took 60mg Sun and Mon. Before Sun. she was just having an occasional hit once or twice a day but today its been one less than every 2 hours. Coincidentally, we go to Jefferson Headache Center tomorrow for a checkup do he can help too. Just wondering if any of you can help!!!

Thanks!!!!!

Charlotte
Title: Re: Prednisone and CH
Post by thebbz on Jul 17th, 2007, 5:58pm
http://www.drugs.com/prednisone.html

http://www.brightok.net/~mnjday/chtherapy.pdf
Good luck at Jefferson
jb
Title: Re: Prednisone and CH
Post by Guiseppi on Jul 17th, 2007, 6:00pm
When I take pred, at doese as low as 30 mg a day I get complete relief. When I taper off, if I have nothing else on board by way of prevents, I get slammed with Kip 10's. I've never taken it for anything except CH so not sure if it would start a cycle for me. Good luck!!!

Guiseppi
Title: Re: Prednisone and CH
Post by Kris_in_SJ on Jul 17th, 2007, 7:53pm
Ditto to Guiseppi

I start my Pred taper at the same time I'm ramping up the Verapamil as prevent.  By the time the 2 weeks of Pred are done, the Verap is kicking in.  Yes - I get some minor hits and start shadowing a little, but no major hits.  Can usually get by with a strong dose of coffee during the day, or a pack of frozen peas in the evening.

Prednisone can certainly knock back the headaches, but it takes a polydrug approach to control the cycle.

Hope this helps.  Many hugs and good wishes for your doctor's visit.

Kris
Title: Re: Prednisone and CH
Post by cash5542 on Jul 17th, 2007, 10:37pm
This is just different. The prednsione is doing the opposite of what it usually does for clusters. She uses it for asthma and it takes care of that but I guess since the headaches were pretty under control it did something different with her head. We'll just take it one day at a time! Thanks for your help, can't wait for Jefferson!
Title: Re: Prednisone and CH
Post by Patrick_A on Jul 18th, 2007, 7:32am
I started taking Prednisone at 80mgs a day. I felt like my head was going to explode but not in a CH way.
Slowly tapered back to nothing in about 4 weeks.
You might be tapering too fast.
I havent had a CH since!

Pa
Title: 'Re: Prednisone and CH
Post by horsegirl on Jul 18th, 2007, 4:20pm
 i don't understand the two week thing ,that must be the taper.this last time they gave me three a day 20 mlg.for 7 days ,  no tapering.  just that sat night i took my last one and sun afternoon i got a realy bad hit, but just one , its not like going off of it makes your ha worse or more, not for me anyway.hopefuly it never does the oppisite for me because it might not stop my cycle, but it breaks my cycle. like it seems we get in a rut and have ,say , five a night ,every night,just like clock work ,get on the predisone and it practicly stops it,then when your finish it,ya they come back but there not the same .
Title: Re: Prednisone and CH
Post by Kris_in_SJ on Jul 18th, 2007, 7:39pm
My taper works this way ...

80mg/day for 7 days, 60mg/day for 2 days, 40mg/day for 2 days, then 20mg/day for 3 days, then stop.

Usually by then the 480mg/day of Verapamil is kicking in.  

If you don't slowly taper down the dose, you can not only get bad hits, you can have bad things happen due to sudden Prednisone discontinuation.

Horsegirl - you need a new doc!

Hugs,

Kris
Title: Re: Prednisone and CH
Post by thebbz on Jul 18th, 2007, 8:28pm

Ditto Kris......get a new doc.
My tapers usually go
80mg 4 days, 60mg 3 days, 40mg 3 days, 20mg 3 days, 10mg 3 days, by then the beast is back unless you are also ramping up on one of these. Lithium,Verapamil,Keppra,or topomax. Sometimes they will throw in a beta blocker, calcium channel blocker, or some of the psycotrophic.
http://counsellingresource.com/medications/index.html

http://www.topamax.com/topamax/?WT.srch=1&utm_source=ppc&utm_medium=ppc&utm_term=ppc&utm_campaign=ppc
http://www.medicinenet.com/beta_blockers/article.htm
http://www.webmd.com/heart-disease/heart-disease-calcium-channel-blocker-drugs
They are all migraine hand me downs.
Title: Re: Prednisone and CH
Post by cash5542 on Jul 18th, 2007, 10:44pm
When Lisa started taking prednisone for asthma several years ago, I was looking for a set way to use the drug. After several doctors I learned each has their own style. Some even do alternating days for tapering. With asthma the biggest problem going too fast, is the lungs arent stable or the adrenal glands need to be woken up. The shorter the duration, the easier the taper. For CH it seems the purpose of taper is to be slow so that the hits don't begin again. We just got back from Jefferson and he said he thinks the exposure to milk(she's highly allergic to) triggered this cycle, not the prednisone. She only needs 3 days cause it's for an allergic reaction. Her lungs are happy and when her head can get over the epipen and the reaction sjhe should be better. In the meantime injections of dhe should help the hits. Thanks for everyone help. Asthma just complicates it!
Title: Re: Prednisone and CH
Post by thebbz on Jul 18th, 2007, 10:57pm
Prednisone for CH ? Or allergies? You asked

Quote:
OK I know when prednsione is used for CH and then tapered it seems to create more headaches but has anyone found it can actually trigger CH if its being used for a different reason?

NOPE.


Quote:
She took 60mg Sun and Mon. Before Sun. she was just having an occasional hit once or twice a day but today its been one less than every 2 hours.

Seems to me she is just beginning an episode?
I have not heard of Prednisone being used for CH in such a dose. At a dosage to treat allergies it would just piss the demon off. Just my opinion. It is not uncommon for even prednisone to fail in treating CH. Even at higher doses. Lived it.
all the best
jb
Title: Re: Prednisone and CH
Post by cash5542 on Jul 18th, 2007, 11:29pm
The dose was completely for the allergy (even given by the allergist, not nuerologist)and is supposed to be short term.Yes she did piss off the beast. Hopefully time and the dhe will put him back in the cage. He was resting and she went and woke him up with the milk reaction.
Title: Re: 'Prednisone and CH
Post by Gator on Jul 19th, 2007, 10:39am

on 07/18/07 at 16:20:56, horsegirl wrote:
 i don't understand the two week thing ,that must be the taper.this last time they gave me three a day 20 mlg.for 7 days ,  no tapering.  just that sat night i took my last one and sun afternoon i got a realy bad hit, but just one , its not like going off of it makes your ha worse or more, not for me anyway.hopefuly it never does the oppisite for me because it might not stop my cycle, but it breaks my cycle. like it seems we get in a rut and have ,say , five a night ,every night,just like clock work ,get on the predisone and it practicly stops it,then when your finish it,ya they come back but there not the same .


A doctor gave you 60mg per day for seven days and then had you stop without a taper?  Time to find another doctor.  

The reason for tapering is that prolonged use of prednisone can cause the body to stop its normal production of natural steroids, such as cortisol.  The dose must be tapered to allow the body to restart production and to get it back to normal levels.  Failing to do so could result in adrenal crisis or exogenous adrenal insufficiency. Tapering also reduces the symptoms of steroid withdrawal, i.e. joint and muscle pain, fatigue, headache, fever, low blood pressure, nausea and vomiting.

A typical prednisone course starts at 60mg to 80mg and tapers by 10mg or 20mg every third or fourth day.  Doctors familiar with the treatment of ch will prescribe a pred taper in conjunction with a preventative, such as Verapamil, or sometimes to give the sufferer a much needed break.  

Title: Re: Prednisone and CH
Post by horsegirl on Jul 20th, 2007, 10:45am
yes i understand,this was the first time it had been perscibed to me like that,i called a pharmacist and questioned the no tapering,i don't remember his exact words except that yes sometimes he had seen it perscribed like that, i will never take it like that again, i promise, you guys are very sweet and observent to,thanks, eve . ps the rebound hit i got was bad,bad, i remember i took my ha outside ,not to bother my husband with the balling and moaning, rolled around in the grass for a couple hours, we live out in the country. no nighbors, but lots of jiggers.


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