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        Cluster Headache Help and Support >> Cluster Headache Specific >> Anxiety
        
(Message started by: birdman on Dec 18^th, 2006, 8:37am)

Title: Anxiety
Post by birdman on Dec 18^th, 2006, 8:37am

Does anyone have any suggestions for the anxiety associated with this monster? While my current med's (verapamil, melatonin, trex, o2) help me, I still find myself stressing over when the next one will hit. I pretty much have one breakthrough a day (between 9 and 11 am) and find myself waiting for it. Wonder if that is part of the problem. By the end of the day I have what I believe are stress headaches. Can't head to the gym and get rid of my stress because once the BP and heart rate increase I am guaranteed a big one. HELP!!!!

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by UN solved on Dec 18^th, 2006, 9:43am

Many of us find ourselves waiting for the next one. It can be a problem and may just lead to more problems. You should talk to your doctor about this, there are meds that can help. If you're like many of us that don't want to take any more meds, you've got to take control of this issue yourself, regain control, and don't let anxiety bring you down. It's easier said than done, but it can be done.

Goodluck

UNsolved

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by birdman on Dec 18^th, 2006, 9:47am

Friend has used Ativan in the past in small dosages to calm nerves but I am concerned about the addictive qualities, both physical and mental. Was using the gym as a great outlet but had to put it on hold. Thanks for the comments though.

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by UN solved on Dec 18^th, 2006, 9:59am

I used Ativan injections for a short while. ( It was very hard to draw up in a needle ). I didn't find it to be addictive at all. There was no buzz or high feeling with it for me. It didn't help the 'headaches' either ... that's why I quit using it.

Goodluck

UNsolved

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by Bob_Johnson on Dec 18^th, 2006, 10:48am

When we read someone writing about their dread of CH or the anxiety of waiting for the next attack, we are seeing the emotional effects of CH. These reactions are not fixed even by good medical treatment of the Clusters.

This is the first few paragraphs from a longer article: You can find the entire piece on the OUCH site (below). (The whole thing is too large to be posted here.) The approach outlined to reduce suffering is developed from cognitive therapy, a well researched therapy used by mental health types. But don't ask for it unless you accept that it takes practice and commitment to make it work! There is no Imitrex injection for this problem.

------------------------------------------------------------------------ ----------------------------------------
AT THE HEART OF THESE PARAGRAPHS is the recognition that pain and suffering are rather different experiences which can and must be changed by rather different responses. The pain of our CH is the subject of many of the messages we exchange, the topic fills the medical literature we read, and is the primary purpose for the multiple visits to doctors.

Suffering is quite a different animal. It is an emotional/psychological condition which is often experienced even when there is no pain; it is commonly experienced as fear, anxiety, depression, hopelessness, dread, and fearful anticipation.

Suffering is a normal, even automatic, response to pain, loss (as in death, divorce, or other major losses), and a host of other difficult experiences. However, suffering can be intensified, sustained, and even created quite independently of any of these experiences. In the case of our CH, suffering is too often experienced when we are not having attacks.

The hard paradox is: WE CAN SUFFER EVEN WHEN WE ARE NOT IN PAIN! This is the paradox which we need to resolve if CH is not to be the controlling experience in life.
------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.ouch-us.org/chgeneral/painvsuffering.htm

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by Karla on Dec 18^th, 2006, 5:30pm

I have used 3 different antianxiety meds. Took zanax for a year. then dr wanted me off of it to make sure I was not addicted and put me on klonopin but that did notihng for me. So now I am on ativan. It helps a great deal. I don't feel high or anything like that. It really helps. Talk to your dr about how your feeling.

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by JeffB on Dec 18^th, 2006, 7:15pm

KGB. Works for me.

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by Linda_Howell on Dec 18^th, 2006, 8:32pm

Quote:

I still find myself stressing over when the next one will hit.

Stop doing this to yourself.

The headaches will come when they come. Live for the pain-free times and really live them !!! A hit comes you do what you can and when it's over you go on with your life. Either that....or you let it rule your life.

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by georgej on Dec 19^th, 2006, 2:13am

on 12/18/06 at 20:32:14, Linda_Howell wrote:

Linda's right. One cycle at a time, one day at a time, one hit at a time.

PM me anytime if you'd just like to talk.

Best wishes,

George

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by BarbaraD on Dec 19^th, 2006, 5:54am

Ok, here's Granny's home remedy -- EAT BANANAS -- there's a lot of Vitamin B in them and they help stress. Also a lot of other ailments.

Hugs BD

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by Charlotte on Dec 19^th, 2006, 8:42am

If you need it, talk to your dr about a med for anxiety.

Charlotte

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by brewcrew on Dec 19^th, 2006, 9:27am

on 12/18/06 at 20:32:14, Linda_Howell wrote:

Stop doing this to yourself.

Linda,

With all due respect, having encountered a number of people in my life with true anxiety problems, I can say that for some, this is much easier to say than it is to do. Some of us have the ability to put a halt to the worry. For others, it is a downward spiral. It is for these folks that the anti-anxiety meds are made.

If I didn't have the ability to talk and think myself out of stressful situations, I would want access to these meds. I have also found that this ability to "talk yourself off the ledge" fades with age. I witnessed it first-hand with my father-in-law, and I see it starting to happen with my mom.

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by birdman on Dec 19^th, 2006, 10:42am

Jeff - What is KGB?

Also, thank you all for the support. It is awesome just to know that there are people like you around

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by kcopelin on Dec 19^th, 2006, 6:24pm

IMHO, anxiety, just like depression, is part of the cluster syndrome. I am not a doctor, but it sure seems that there is a correlation between clusters and low levels of serotonin. This doesn't really have anything to do with us not being hardy enough, obstinate enough or strong enough to not give into suffering. It has to do with brain chemistry. Do you think people with clinical depression should just get over themselves? Anxiety is a part of that process. And it is very different than consciously choosing to worry. Worry is cognitive, and we can control that. Birdman, what you described is that worry part. Anticipating the next hit. Linda is right on-don't waste your precious pain-free time, okay? On the other hand-try as I might-I cannot think or reason myself out of depression or anxiety caused by messed up brain chemistry. So if you cannot control the worry about the next CH, then BLTC.
(IMHO, which in my universe is right ::))
PFDAN y'all
kathy

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by TonyG1 on Dec 19^th, 2006, 6:58pm

on 12/18/06 at 20:32:14, Linda_Howell wrote:

Linda - I agree -- we can't worry about what we can't control -- I'm a night time hit person and when i go to bed -- I hope for the best but do expect the worst -- can't do a darn thing about it ... I just sleep when I can...

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by Richr8 on Dec 19^th, 2006, 7:15pm

After fourteen years of this crap, I still believe my current one is always my last. Side benefit of few remainnng brain cells I guess. Sleep dep and the side effects from meds are what eventually take me out, not worrying about the next one.

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by BarbaraD on Dec 20^th, 2006, 5:57am

Maybe it's just my age, but I've learned not to worry about much of anything. If I anticipate something, I make a plan what I'll do if it happens. Then if it does - I have a plan, if not I haven't spent a lot of time worrying about it.

With CH - make a plan (get your meds, O2 ready and close at hand) and then don't think about it unless it happens. If it does you're prepared. If not, well you haven't spent the day worrying about something that never happened.

And yes, CH causes depression and anxiety, but a lot of it can be controlled by thinking positive and some with meds. I wasn't kidding earlier about Bananas. They contain vitamins that control anxiety. I've been eating at least one banana a day for weeks now and they really do help. I haven't threatened to kill anyone in weeks. :D

Hugs BD

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by kcopelin on Dec 20^th, 2006, 1:27pm

Ah shot, Barbara, my dyslexia kicked in again. I thought you told us to eat a bandana every day. I was wondering why my husband looked at me oddly (I don't own any bandanas so I had to eat one of his ;;D)

sheez....

PFDAN y'all
kathy

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by vietvet2tours on Dec 20^th, 2006, 1:38pm

Two years and four months pain free and I still think about them every day.

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by JeffB on Dec 20^th, 2006, 2:40pm

on 12/20/06 at 13:38:32, vietvet2tours wrote:

Two years and four months pain free and I still think about them every day.

Ain't that the truth, brother.

But we must enjoy every pf moment we have. At this point, I can accept what I know is going to hit me sooner or later. Just go on with your life and deal with them the best you can and take advantage of the vast knowledge offere here.

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by chewy on Dec 20^th, 2006, 2:59pm

A disorder for every med.
A med for every disorder.

Try the bannanas.

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by BarbaraD on Dec 20^th, 2006, 6:30pm

on 12/20/06 at 14:59:56, chewy wrote:

A disorder for every med.
A med for every disorder.

Try the bannanas.

Seriously, I think we're an overmedicated society today. Everytime they come up with a new drug we find a new disease for it.

Back when I was a kid we didn't take meds except EMERGENCY cases only. Vick's Salve was a staple along with iodine and a few other things my mother kept in the medicine chest (Castor Oil was one of her favorites). We weren't sick that much and if we were penicillin would usually make us well (I always got LOTS better after a couple of shots).We went to one doctor who knew the whole anatomy and could treat us for about anything from ring-worms to a burst appendix.

Then sometime around the 60s people started popping "tranquilizers" and it went downhill from there.

Ya know my mom was 83 when she died and she still took an aspirin for anxiety (and she had to be shaking when she took that much).

Oops got on my soap box again. sorry 'bout that...

Hugs BD

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by Charlie on Dec 20^th, 2006, 10:24pm

I can understand the anxiety. You might give this a try. It worked wonders for me and kept me busy as well:

Dr. Wright’s Circulatory Technique:

I am not sure what mechanism is triggered by this but whatever it is, at least indirectly helps kill the pain. I do know that this technique has nothing to do with meditation, relaxation, or psychic ability. It is entirely physical and takes some work. It involves concentrating on trying to redirect a little circulation to the arms, hands, or legs. It can described as a conscious circulatory flexing. Increased circulation will result in a reddening and warming of the hands. Try to think of it as filling your hands with redirected blood. The important and difficult part is that it has to be done without interruption through the pain. Do not give up in frustration. It may not work on the first try. Every now and then it will work almost immediately. I lived for those moments. Try experimenting between attacks. You will find that it gets easier with practice.

I was given less than five minutes instruction in the use of method. The doctor, while placing his arm on his desk, showed me that he could slightly increase his arm and hand circulation. After several attempts, I was able to repeat this procedure and use it successfully. I have had about a 75% success rate shortening these attacks. My 20 minute attacks were often reduced to 10 minutes or less. Once proven that I had a chance to effectively deal with this horror, I always gave it a try as I had nothing to lose but pain.

Perhaps it will help if you think of it as trying to fill the arm as if it is were an empty vessel. I used to try to imagine I was pushing blood away from my head into my arm. Use your imagination. There is one man who wrote that his standing barefoot on a concrete floor shortened his attacks. This may be similar as it draws some circulation away from the head. Cold water, exercise, or anything affecting circulation, seems to be worth a try. My suggestion is to not let up immediately when the pain goes. Waiting a minute is probably a good idea. So long as you do not slack off, this has a chance of working.

This technique is very useful while waiting for medication to take effect or when none is available. It costs nothing, is non-invasive, and can be used just about anywhere. It is not a miracle but it helped me deal with this horror. It can be a bit exhausting but the success rate was good enough for me and a cluster headache sufferer will do just about anything to end the pain. It gives us a fighting chance.

Charlie

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by ax on Dec 21^st, 2006, 2:43am

Anxiety sucks

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by Jimby on Dec 22^nd, 2006, 1:13am

Hi Birdman,
I've had clusters for about 30 yrs and still get panicky and anxious both when I am having them in between individual headaches as well as in between episodes. I get them bad at night and so I dread going to sleep at night. One thing I have found is that you have to monitor your own self talk. Keep telling yourself you can do this. You have done it before and can do it again. Try not to give in to despair. Try to flow with this thing and not get all keyed up. I know that is really hard.... but it helps.
Now some practical reflections .... The episode that I had before the one I am currently going through, I ended up in the hospital ER one night in great pain and having a panic attack. My blood pressure was measured at 175 over 130. I thought I was going to have a heart attack and die. Somehow I managed to get through the attack even though the staff in the ER did not know what to do with me. They did eventually give me an Attivan to calm me down as well as a lot of Oxygen. At the time I was on Depakote, Verapamil, Prednisone, Melatonin, Oxygen, Imitrex, and Zoloft for Depression. What I learned from this is that I was taking too many serotonergic meds all at once. These meds mostly all raise your serotonin levels to some extent. It was pushing my body into a hyper anxiety state. I think this was the beginnings of Serotonin Syndrome. When coupled with fatigue, lack of sleep, fear of the next headache, stress, etc the result is tremendous anxiety. This was the longest and worst cycle I ever had. I attribute it to all the medicine. Now, for my current episode, I resolved to use minimal medicine. But again, I did use a Triptan (Amerge - naratriptan) for 16 nights straight, but no other med besides Oxygen. Triptans are only supposed to be used a few days per month. Once again I started to feel uncomfortably anxious. I looked up the side effects of the triptans and they do cause anxiety all by themselves especially if you are using them a lot. I am sure the naratriptan was making me very anxious. My Neuro wanted me to have an MRI and I had a panic attack as soon as I put my head into the MRI chamber. I went off the Amerge and a few days later repeated the MRI without a problem. So, I suspect the Trex you are using is adding to your anxiety greatly even if it is aborting headaches for you. It is an unfortunate trade off. Also meds like Melatonin, Pred, and Verapamil and Oxygen can contribute to anxiety and can interact with Triptans in unexpected ways. Too much medicine is not a good thing. Try to figure out what is most effective and stick with that. If you are not sure something is helping, delete it. One thing I did this time around because I knew I wasn't ever going to take all those meds again, was prepare for my episode by changing my diet ahead of time to one that reduces pain and inflammation. For several months ahead I stopped using all vegetable oils except coconut oil and a little bit of Olive oil. No soy, corn, cottonseed, safflower oil, etc... These oils form arachidonic acid which is very inflammatory. I also started taking 5 grams of EPA/DHA from a combination of Cod Liver Oil, Omacor Fish Oil, and Krill plus 800 IU of Vit E and some Primrose Oil to balance the fats. In addition I took about 400 - 600 mg Magnesium Citrate and Magnesium Taurate. This regimen reduced the intensity of my headaches to where the Oxygen alone was nearly sufficient. As I said I used Amerge for the worst two weeks, but then got off it when the anxiety got too bad. The pain intensity of this episode has been less than I have ever experienced in 30 yrs, so I know the diet is helping. I have also fought pain and inflammation by using Oxygen more aggressively to get rid of as much of the shadowy low level pain as possible. And I have avoided food triggers and any supplements that I suspected of being triggers. For example I stopped Coconut Oil during the episode because I became convinced that it is a trigger once the episodes start. I also avoid capsaicin, ginger, salt, pepper, tumeric, aged cheeses such as cheddar, onions, garlic, and any strong spices, MSG, MSG substitute flavor enhancers, Nitrates (cured meats) and alcohol. One evening I had some eggnog for Christmas and got headachey during the evening before I went to sleep. It was from the tiny bit of alcohol in the vanilla used in the eggnog. Another time I had a Wendy's hamburger that had some of their sauce on it in the middle of the afternoon and got headachey soon afterwards. I looked up the ingredients of that burger on the internet and sure enough it had some MSG substitute chemicals in it for flavor enhancing. So I am learning that I seem to benefit from a fairly bland natural non-processed food diet, by having less tendency to trigger headaches in the first place. Another thing is that if you are getting morning headaches, you have to try to get yourself completely awakened in the morning. Perhaps try some Green Tea. And you may try using a light box or Go-lite in the morning. And watch what you eat for breakfast. It may have trigger foods that are kicking in around 10 or 11 am.
e.
Well, good luck! Hang in there! You can get through this. Take consolation in the fact that you are already beating "the Beast". The CH sufferers on this site know you are already special for having gotten this far ! Bye - Jimby :)

Title: Re: Anxiety
Post by birdman on Dec 27^th, 2006, 9:35am

I am starting to think it is the high melatonin dose that is doing it to me. I have in the past used 3mg but after seeing some posts here about it, I increased it to 9mg a night. I think I may try reducing it back to 3mg or 6mg. Been having some terrible dreams will on it too. Wake up freaked out sometime. Thanks for all the advice. Trust me it is appreciated.