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        Cluster Headache Help and Support >> Cluster Headache Specific >> Long-Term Vascular Damage?
        
(Message started by: serendipity on Jul 28^th, 2006, 2:30pm)

Title: Long-Term Vascular Damage?
Post by serendipity on Jul 28^th, 2006, 2:30pm

Hi everyone. I've been a member of this site for several years, although I rarely post. FYI - I'm an episodic CH sufferer for 17 years now.

My question is this: Since cluster headaches are (presumably) a vascular disorder, is there any long-term risk of aneurisms or other vascular problems as a result of weakened blood vessels? It seems to me that if cluster headaches affect the blood vessels, that those same vessels would weaken or sustain damage over time.

This is a question I've asked many doctors, but I've never really gotten a straight answer.

Title: Re: Long-Term Vascular Damage?
Post by seasonalboomer on Jul 28^th, 2006, 2:56pm

on 07/28/06 at 14:30:50, serendipity wrote:

As much as my answer may sound smart-alecky, the truth is we have quite a few pretty old guys (and gals) that are still kicking around here that would at least support, anectdotally, that it isn't producing long term damage.

It would seem logical that anything that hurt that much should be really bad for you but I've yet to read anything here that seems to indicate we're wearing anything out with CH.

Let's look at it from an alternate viewpoint, maybe all that blood flow and head action is actually keeping our brains in a stronger condition...... or "in shape".

:-/

Scott

Title: Re: Long-Term Vascular Damage?
Post by Charlotte on Jul 28^th, 2006, 3:24pm

plus all the sweating may actually prevent wrinkles.

No actual vascular damage that I know of, although it feels like it may pop.

I'd like to know if anyone has a link or photo or diagram of the circle of willis(?) which are the blood vessels that are supposedly in the same area as the trigiminal nerve?

Charlotte

Title: Re: Long-Term Vascular Damage?
Post by ShaneM on Jul 28^th, 2006, 3:53pm

Charlotte,
A couple of googles away...

this was a pretty cool animated link: http://pathology.mc.duke.edu/neuropath/nawr/blood-supply.html
and
a more simplified version:
http://cogsci.ucsd.edu/~ffilimon/williscircle.jpg

Shane

Title: Re: Long-Term Vascular Damage?
Post by Charlotte on Jul 28^th, 2006, 3:57pm

Thanks, Shane. I was all wrong about the location. I really appreciate the links.

Charlotte

Title: Re: Long-Term Vascular Damage?
Post by ShaneM on Jul 28^th, 2006, 4:06pm

No problem. But as I am just now learning so much about the condition I have lived with so many years, where exactly does the Circle of Willis fit into the picture? I understand that it maybe a two part issue (nerve and vaso), beyond that I must admit that I am a little clueless about the pieces and parts.

Shane

Title: Re: Long-Term Vascular Damage?
Post by Charlotte on Jul 28^th, 2006, 6:49pm

It's not what I thought, and I was way off. I thought the trigiminal nerve irritations caused irritation in the circle of willis, but it doesn't look like they touch or are in the same area so I must have gotten it wrong.

I know that 10 or 11 years ago, clusters were considered vascular, and it feels like there is a vascular component. However, once I saw the picture of the trigiminal nerve, I understood why all those tingles and burning and spasms in the face, why sometimes it feels like a toothache or earache or sinus.

Then I read about the dodgey hypothalamus, and that also makes sense.

I don't know why some of the hits that don't hurt as much wipe out my mind more than the really painful ones. And I really don't understand the patterns, the whole why of it.

Charlotte

Title: Re: Long-Term Vascular Damage?
Post by kevinpix on Jul 29^th, 2006, 12:39am

I don't think so. I agree that all the pressure "exercises" the vessels to make them stronger. I always wondered if the pain would cause a heartattack. I think we know what to expect during a bad hit, but the lighter hits surprise us enough to be a tad bit scared, which causes more pain in the long run.

Title: Re: Long-Term Vascular Damage?
Post by georgej on Jul 29^th, 2006, 1:01am

on 07/29/06 at 00:39:19, kevinpix wrote:

I agree that all the pressure "exercises" the vessels to make them stronger.

Don't know, really, but I always figured that if I had an aneurism ballooning out and waiting to go off it would have done so already, what with the things my head does.

My brother-in-law had one all unknown in his head. Probably had been there most, if not all, of his life. Killed him almost instantly at 50 years of age--we were told that nothing could have been done even if it had happened in a hospital. Pretty serious stuff, but nothing you can do about it, really, if you don't know.

Best regards,

George

Title: Re: Long-Term Vascular Damage?
Post by floridian on Jul 29^th, 2006, 12:42pm

If nothing else, the see-sawing blood pressure with an attack and large number of cluster heads with hypertension mean an increased risk of stroke or aneurism.