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        Cluster Headache Help and Support >> Cluster Headache Specific >> Food intolerance?
        
(Message started by: jmorgan52 on Mar 7^th, 2006, 3:46am)

Title: Food intolerance?
Post by jmorgan52 on Mar 7^th, 2006, 3:46am

This article is about migraine (a bit taboo here!) possibly caused by food intolerances which is "old hat" but with some new angles (which I personally think could also be related to CH as well as Migraine) Some interesting ideas anyway

http://portal.telegraph.co.uk/global/main.jhtml?xml=/global/2006/02/27/hmig27.xml&DCMP=EMC-exp_06032006

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by Kevin_M on Mar 7^th, 2006, 5:02am

on 03/07/06 at 03:46:42, jmorgan52 wrote:

with some new angles which could be CH related?

As maybe one's personal opinion, but Ch is not even questionably mentioned in the article. I am assuming you are asking a question about this article's relationship to clusters.

I've avoided lots of dark chocolate because for me, it can cause hits coming through the verap. But abstaining from it never offered hope of controling the condition without preventatives.

from the article:

Quote:

Many migraine sufferers have long believed that their headaches are triggered by certain foods, with chocolate, cheese, citrus and red wine being among the usual suspects. A recent survey not only suggests that these sufferers may be right but also offers new hope for controlling the condition without drugs.

Also from the article, this may not be wise for CH:
Quote:

"Food avoidance may be a better way forward than responding with medication, which only ameliorates the problem, and it may turn out that the cost of a test is well worth it to the NHS in the long term."

I don't see CH mentioned on the Yorktest website.

One clinical trial listed:

Quote:

Clinical Trials
A clinical trial, published in the medical journal ‘GUT’, focused on diagnosed sufferers of Irritable Bowel Syndrome.

I don't see any anything saying it "could" be CH related:

Quote:

Survey Results:

Main Medical Condition Reported Percentage of People Who Reported Moderate to High Benefit

Gastro-Intestinal e.g. IBS, Chrohn's etc 80%
Respiratory e.g. Asthma, Breathing Difficulties 72%
Neurological e.g. Migraine, Headaches 78%
Dermatological e.g Eczema, Acne, Psoriosis 76%
Musculo-Skeletal e.g Arthritis, Rheumatism 64%
Psychological e.g. Depression, ADHD, Panic Attacks 81%
Other e.g. Bloating, Lethargy, Gen. Feeling Malaise 79%

I might see that it would be a "personal opinion" that the article "could" be questionably related.

Best to you with your methods.

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by chewy on Mar 7^th, 2006, 7:23am

Quote:

I might see that it would be a "personal opinion" that the article "could" be questionably related.

Best to you with your methods.

Says it all.

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by jmorgan52 on Mar 7^th, 2006, 7:53am

I did say this was migraine related.

There is no mention on CH in the article. I never said there was.

Maybe I should have stated that any inference that there "could" be a connection with CH is entirely mine. Sorry :)

I put this link here because I think it raises some important questions and ideas on what triggers or causes migraine (and maybe CH?).

For me I am fairly convinced that too much wheat or gluten or yeast gives me headaches and it definately gives me heartburn.

I for one believe that CH and Migraine are actually quite closely related - I suffer from both, but I only seem to have either of them when I am in a CH cycle.

The symptoms for me:

CH - one sided, rapidly ramping up to intense pain in the eye and temple, red watery eye, 2 hours of pain like clockwork 2 or 3 times a day, usually waking up due to pain at around 2am, 6am etc. I cannot function at all on any level.

Migraine - usually starts as one sided, similar to CH, but slowly ramping up with throbbing pain that can spread all over the skull and neck, anything from 3-48 hours of consistent waves of pain occasionally with vomiting. Sometimes see spots or wave patterns. Pain can be just as bad as a kip 10 CH at times. I Just want to lie down and try to sleep in a dark room.

Both respond to imitrex injection within 10 mins

Just read the article and make your own mind up. Take it or leave it.

John

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by Charlotte on Mar 7^th, 2006, 3:11pm

When one of my sons was on an allergy elimination diet at 1 year old, I was on it also because I was nursing him. I found that upon reintroducing corn, I got a mild cluster like headache, upon reintroduing wheat I got a banded tension type headache, and eggs caused a pain that felt like arthritis.

I never would have gone on an elimination diet for myself but I did for my my son. The headaches were not full strength. I rotated allergins and it helped. He was on a restricted diet for several years.

In the past, some medications helped when I avoided these three foods and didn't work otherwise, but that could be coincidental.

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by ABarham on Mar 13^th, 2006, 11:55am

Hi Everyone: Not sure this is the right thread to ask this question, but here goes. Adam asked me to find out if anyone has ever noticed that Kool Aid acted as a trigger? He was trying to cut down on caffine at one point and tried kool aid. Seems like everytime he did, he would get a pretty bad hit. This is more of a curiosity question rather than a debate question.

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by marlinsfan on Mar 13^th, 2006, 1:29pm

I don't drink kool-aid, but check the ingredients. Anything with citric acid in it will trigger a headache for me. It might be a trigger for Adam too....

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by CHTom on Mar 13^th, 2006, 2:14pm

Have there been any legitimate scientific/medical experiments to see if certain foods cause or set off of make cluster headaches (or make them worse) and prove it to be so? The only food that I know of that does so is alchohol. There are many anecdotal tales of certain foods setting of CH attacks, but if one reads them it appears that almost every type of food does it with one person or another. I personally believe that it is a defect in the hypothalamus that causes CH and don't buy into the food angle, but am interested as it is brought up on a regular basis on this site. Can anyone point me (us) to an article in a reputable medical journal that backs up the food theory? My docs have only told me to avoid alcohol, which I have for almost 10 years, with the exception of my few drinks during the year (probably comes out to a bottle of wine a year when added up). If a certain food causes CH pain in someone, there is the possibility that the person may be unknowingly allergic to the substance, could have coincidentally had an attack shortly after eating/drinking the food and psychologically (unconsciously) connected the two, thus possibly getting what appears to be a CH attack when eating the same food again (the mind can do many amazing things), etc.
Thanks to anyone who can provide something.

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by seasonalboomer on Mar 13^th, 2006, 2:24pm

on 03/13/06 at 14:14:53] The only food that I know of that does so is alchohol., CHTom wrote:

There's only one part of the population who have actually categorized that alcohol is a "food". ;) 8)

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by CHTom on Mar 13^th, 2006, 2:33pm

on 03/13/06 at 14:24:56, seasonalboomer wrote:

There's only one part of the population who have actually categorized that alcohol is a "food". ;) 8)

And boy do I miss it! ::)

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by LeLimey on Mar 13^th, 2006, 2:51pm

I heard through OUCH UK recently that there was a report that cheese, chocolate etc do not cause migraines, that that is an old wives tale and the "fact" is that blood sugars (or whatever it is) run low and you snack on these foods thus connecting them. This is off the top of my head and I know it's not the full story, I'll try and find it and post it here.
I know for my ex that food was a trigger but disturbed routines were.. as long as he stuck to relatively regular hours and meal times he didn't have a single migraine but an upset week would result in a doozy of a weekend.
I have coeliac disease so I was interested to read of your theory about wheat and gluten however, in spite of having a diet free of them completely now I'm still getting hit so for me at any rate that doesn't work.. sadly!
We're all different though, some can drink and some can't, some are triggered by light, fumes etc etc so it does stand to reason that some foods may set some of us off and not others.
All we can do is monitor ourselves and hopefully do all we can to avoid hits where possible. I wouldn't hold out too much hope for elimination being a "cure" though sadly.
Helen

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by ABarham on Mar 13^th, 2006, 3:11pm

Hey Scott: Can we bring that "food" to your house in May?

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by zwibbs/Scott on Mar 20^th, 2006, 1:49am

All I know ( for me personally) is if I eat something with MSG , my next CH will be a KIP 10--no question about it. Any , and I mean any alcohol will also raise the psin.

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by jmorgan52 on Mar 20^th, 2006, 2:22am

I am more interested in what causes CH rather than what triggers it. Triggers probably only really affect the timing of a CH, they don't cause more or less attacks, at least not for me.

The only known Trigger for me is booze which sets off a CH within 20 mins of drinking a single beer, and possibly bright sunlight. But out of cycle the only time booze gives me a HA is when I have overindulged.

Wheat, Gluten and Yeast do not "trigger" a CH. When in cycle thers is no correlation with HA and this type of food for me.

What I do believe is that long term consumption of Wheat, Gluten and Yeast gives me headaches and heartburn and makes me feel tired and listless. If I cut them out as much as possible I feel more energetic and am generally HA free.

I am not "allergic" as such to them as per coeliac disease and have no immediate reaction to them, but if I eat a lot of them over a short period - too much bread, pastry, pizza, cake, cookies I get bad heartburn, so my bodyids telling me to stop eating them!

Others may have similar "long term" reactions to dairy products, for others it might be red meat or chocolate or red wine or bananas or salt or whatever. Who knows?

Eliminations by trial end error might just strike it lucky for some who find they can avoid CH by totally avoiding certain foods.

Certainly those here who claim to eat lots of big macs and fries and coke and smoke too much and do no excercise need to look hard at themselves and at least make some effort towards cleaning up their diet to see if it helps?

John

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by Jasmyn on Mar 20^th, 2006, 3:53am

Ok John, so your theory is that:

Quote:

Posted by: jmorgan52 Posted on: Today at 9:26am
Eliminations by trial end error might just strike it lucky for some who find they can avoid CH by totally avoiding certain foods.

My interpretation of what you state here in your own words is, that you suspect that CH is caused by eating the wrong foods over a period of time and that this results in toxic build-up that eventually is the cause of CH.

You also say:

Quote:

Posted by: jmorgan52 Posted on: Today at 9:26am
Certainly those here who claim to eat lots of big macs and fries and coke and smoke too much and do no exercise need to look hard at themselves and at least make some effort towards cleaning up their diet to see if it helps?

I will emphatically state that my lifestyle before CH was such:
- I used to be a dancer(as a career with the SADTA-South African Dance Teachers Association) so I was super fit, lots of exercise about 9 hours dancing a day besides running my own gym and aerobic plus aqua aerobic classes.

- In the gym we had a sauna, so besides the daily sweating through exercise, I used the sauna frequently - my daily detoxing if you want.

- I used to be a health nut, vitamins, balanced diet, plenty of exercise and lots of water.

- I did not smoke or drink.

Now how the hell did I get CH? CH started during my peak health condition. Like you I also looked for answers in diet, acupuncture, colonic cleansing(although like most South Africans, the blue bottle was always a must to "clean the blood", right?), Chiropractics and explored many other avenues. Sadly I found that I was clutching at straws, like you do now.

You have come here and advocated a healthy lifestyle and colonic cleansing until we are all so fed up by your poking at the same old story over and over. You may not realise it but many of us have tried everything and anything but from experience can tell you that a healthy lifestyle can be to your benefit in many ways but it doesn't touch CH! IT IS NOT THE CAUSE!

Why don't you start contributing more to this site by supporting other CHer's here besides just peddling your own believes the whole entire time.

You are like a stuck record, get off it and join the community and discussions, give support and stop trying to influence and convince us the whole time that we cause our own CH by what we do and eat.

This subject is getting old because you believe what you believe (I'm glad it works for you) and desperately want us all do do the same but you are pressing an issue here.

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by jmorgan52 on Mar 20^th, 2006, 8:22am

Thanks Jasmine for your sarky comments.

I started this post - so I feel justified in adding to it if people keep posting comments.

If you don't like what I say then just ignore it.

I do plenty of support here on topics that I have personal experience of.

Just because you personally were a dancer/keep fit/health nut etc means little to me. There are many here who are not.

If this works for me then there MUST be some others it will work for.

If I do not share this then how will others get to know about it?

What the hell is the Blue Bottle?

Just remember this - I am not searching for things to prevent or cure CH for myself. I have discovered what works very well for me thank you very much, and it does not involve taking expensive and dangerous drugs. It has taken me 40 odd years of suffering to get to this point so don't even think about knocking my advice. I am not looking for any gains here, I just want to help a few others.

I don't "desperately want" everyone here to try my therapy, but I do want others to have the opportunity to read and perhaps benefit from my own good results.

If the original guys who tried magic mushrooms, seeds, kudzu etc had not persisted and not had there new off the wall ideas accepted here they would still be proclaimed as bullshit.

These therapies also don't work for everyone, just as Trex or pred or lithium or verap or whetever else does not work for everyone. So by the same token I say that my therapy will work for some and I will keep on saying it until I am proven otherwise. You have not succeeded in convincing me I am wrong!

John

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by pattik on Mar 20^th, 2006, 8:59am

Good boy, John. I see you have finally posted a little support to another sufferer without bringing the digestive system into it. Keep up the good work. ::)
Pat

Title: Re: Food intolerance?
Post by Jasmyn on Mar 20^th, 2006, 9:20am

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