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        New Message Board Archives >> 2007 General Board Posts >> Something to think about
        
(Message started by: M.R. on Dec 6^th, 2007, 6:04pm)

Title: Something to think about
Post by M.R. on Dec 6^th, 2007, 6:04pm

Warning....thoughts on gun control

As always.....I can not personal verify this article

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,315563,00.html..

Mike

Title: Re: Something to think about
Post by Jonny on Dec 6^th, 2007, 9:02pm

When Odighizuwa exited the building where the shooting took place, he was approached by two students with personal firearms and one unarmed student. There are two versions of the events that transpired at that moment, one by Bridges and one by Besen.

According to Bridges, at the first sound of gunfire, fellow students Tracy Bridges and Mikael Gross, unbeknownst to each other, ran to their vehicles to fetch their personally-owned firearms. Gross, a police officer with the Grifton Police Department in his home state of North Carolina, retrieved a 9 mm pistol and body armor. Bridges, a county sheriff's deputy from Asheville, N.C., pulled his .357 Magnum pistol from beneath the driver's seat of his Chevy Tahoe. As Bridges later told the Richmond Times Dispatch, he was prepared to shoot to kill. Bridges and Gross approached Odighizuwa from different angles, with Bridges yelling at Odighizuwa to drop his gun.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appalachian_School_of_Law_shooting

This case was cited by John Lott and others as an example of the media's bias against guns, claiming that the use of a firearm in a defensive role was not reported in most news stories of the event.

Title: Re: Something to think about
Post by BarbaraD on Dec 7^th, 2007, 7:00am

So what it all amounts to is that we're going to be getting back to "frontier justice" with everyone carrying a gun for protection.

Right now, we don't feel safe sending our kids to school, we don't feel safe going shopping, we don't feel safe driving down the highway and we're getting to the point we don't feel safe in our homes. The BAD guys have guns and we're at their mercy. We (the good guys) follow the laws and the bad guys don't. If we retaliate - we get taken to court and convicted.

Something has to change but I don't know what it is. I don't think stapping a six-shooter on is the answer, but I don't think taking guns away from citizens is the answer either. I have a lot of guns - I don't plan to shoot anyone (unless they really piss me off ;;D) but I sure don't want the government telling me I can't own them.

One thing I think we're doing wrong is getting so politically correct that we've bent over backwards with kids about playing with guns. They NEED to play with them (play guns) when they're little and LEARN to respect them. Cowboys and Indians, Army, etc. Those games are GOOD for kids. I firmly believe if they get all that out of their system when they're small, they'll be less likely to act them out in later years.

My word! When I was little, I did my share of shooting the "bad" guys and when I was in school I did my share of "whup a$$" but never even thought of taking a gun to school. We all owned guns but used them for hunting or target practice. But we LEARNED to respect guns at an early age.

Guess I'm preaching to the choir here, but it just ticks me off the way parents try to "protect" their kids from the real world.

Hugs BD

Title: Re: Something to think about
Post by brewcrew on Dec 7^th, 2007, 7:53am

The main reason the founding fathers wrote and passed the 2nd amendment was the concept that an armed constituency would keep the government in check. If the government got out of hand, the people would rise up and bitch slap them.

The gun-grabbers don't want the people to know this, so they tout example after example of how we, the people are safer without guns in society. Barb hit it right on the head: criminals don't care about gun laws - they're criminals. So we, the people must retain our right to protect not only ourselves, but our form of government - through gun ownership.

Title: Re: Something to think about
Post by artonio7 on Dec 7^th, 2007, 8:04am

on 12/07/07 at 07:00:59, BarbaraD wrote:

we LEARNED to respect ~~guns~~ LIFE at an early age.

I don't think a gun ever made a conscious decision to kill anyone. There seems to be an erosion of the respect and sanctity of life.

Sad.

with warm regards,
Tony

Title: Re: Something to think about
Post by Melissa on Dec 7^th, 2007, 8:20am

Interesting op-ed piece. I agree with this quote: "The law-abiding, not criminals, are obeying the rules. Disarming the victims simply means that the killers have less to fear."

Title: Re: Something to think about
Post by M.R. on Dec 7^th, 2007, 9:42am

More reading along these lines for the poor people like me that don't have a job yet, are bored, and it's to early to drink beer yet.... ;;D. Some good info though.

http://www.nraila.org/media/misc/fables.html

Mike

Title: Re: Something to think about
Post by Charlie on Dec 7^th, 2007, 8:19pm

Brew is right you know but railing against guns is like trying to knock out an elephant with a peanut. I've had a lot of fun with them and only got rid of mine because of my seizures.

I still think that in the long run they aren't as wonderful a self-protective item as we would like....still some of us know WTF they're doing. Mistakes make me shudder but
guns are fun.

Charlie

Title: Re: Something to think about
Post by Groov on Dec 7^th, 2007, 8:33pm

on 12/07/07 at 07:53:55, brewcrew wrote:

Yeah, people here understand simple principals that our country was founded upon....already knew Brew did (well said)....was glad to see others do as well.

Either live with others mis-use of freedom or surrender your freedom to "FEEL" safe. I know what my choice is.

Cheers, Dave

Title: Re: Something to think about
Post by Jonny on Dec 7^th, 2007, 9:15pm

Why is this lunatic walking into a mall with an assault rifle and someone with a carry and conceal is banned?

Do you think if someone permitted to carry was there some peolpe would have lived?

http://cdn-06.liveleak.com/liveleak/14/media14/2007/Dec/7/LiveLeak-dot-com-128107-1207071402_M_120707_hawkins3.jpg.thumb.jpg

Title: Re: Something to think about
Post by brewcrew on Dec 7^th, 2007, 9:41pm

on 12/07/07 at 21:15:24, Jonny wrote:

Pretty damned insane, isn't it?

By the same token, if teachers packed heat, you think we'd have the same amount of school violence? Trouble is, most teachers wouldn't carry.

Title: Re: Something to think about
Post by Jonny on Dec 7^th, 2007, 11:53pm

on 12/07/07 at 21:41:53, brewcrew wrote:

Trouble is, most teachers wouldn't carry.

Thats the key, some will and they would never know who. ;)

Title: Re: Something to think about
Post by BarbaraD on Dec 8^th, 2007, 7:21am

I'm not really for teachers packin' heat, but schools might consider "armed" and "trained" (no rent a cops) security guards. We've already got the metal detectors set up in schools - why not get some "trained" people to "guard" our kids and be available "if" an incident occurs. I'd rather see my tax money going for trained guards to protect my kids than another teacher to teach my kids about birth control or drugs.

It seems ironic that we get a concealed permit (and in Texas you have to take a course and pass a test to get one) and then everywhere you go there's a sign - NO CONCEALED WEAPONS BEYOND THIS POINT!. In this article the "good guys" left their weapons in their vehicles and followed the signs - the bad guy didn't. Had they disobeyed the signs - the results may have been different. It's a Catch 22.

We have a problem in this country that's getting more and more prevelent with all the news coverage it's receiving. Making more laws isn't going to solve it. Taking guns away from honest folks isn't going to solve it. Common sense might.

Look at the roll models our kids have these days. Not exactly ideal types. Video games? What are kids watching on TV. Where are they going on the Internet? Do parents even have a clue? How many parents these days even know what's going on in the schools? And not to start a war, but how many parents take their kids to church on Sunday morning any more?

But right now, if this keeps up, we won't need terrorists to destroy our country - we'll do it to ourselves.

Hugs BD

Title: Re: Something to think about
Post by Charlie on Dec 8^th, 2007, 12:28pm

Quote:

By the same token, if teachers packed heat, you think we'd have the same amount of school violence?

God I hope so for the teachers sakes :o :D

Seriously, I used to know a tall boomer that once bought something interesting out of a paper bag at an upstate flea market. Never knew who this guy was of course. It was long long ago.

He said he had a choice of eight similar items that were being peddled around the show. You have to wonder where they came from. It is hard to keep track of things. It was sold and "cleaned up," by someone that knew how and what to do with the thing.

Charlie

Title: Re: Something to think about
Post by catlind on Dec 12^th, 2007, 7:39am

I can't speak about incidents other than the Westroads Mall shootings in Omaha.

Robert Hawkins, 19, had broken up with his girlfriend a couple weeks earlier and was fired from his job that day. He was carrying an ak47 with a banana clip of 30 rounds. 24 rounds were shot.

I was supposed to be at that mall at 1:00 p.m. Because we were racing around to get ready to catch a flight to Canada for a funeral, I chose to go to the other mall in Omaha, Oakville, as it wasn't as busy.

Westroads mall is not a mall in the sense that most people think. It is a series of stores set up in a main street atmosphere with stores lining brick walkways and then a 'mall' building that houses the largest anchor chains. There is security everywhere, you see them driving and walking. But they can't be everywhere at once.

You are talking about Omaha NE. The community at large is stunned that such a thing could even happen here. Yes, they passed a law allowing the carrying of concealed hand guns. There is NO SUCH LAW that allows a person to carry an ak47.

The letter he left for his family said he was going to go out in style. It was his family that found the suicide note and called 911 to alert them as to the probably threat at the mall.

The problem - WHERE was he. It's a vast complex of multiple stores streets and walkways.

I am NOT defending this person. Teens have a serious problem with shortsightedness. All he knew is his life was over and he was going to take others with him. He didn't think about what his family would suffer the rest of their lives.

This week one of his friends was put away for a very long time. This strikes close to home for me, because of what we went through over the last year. Apparently a female friend of the shooter made some very negative comments. A young man who was a friend of Robert Hawkins called the family and threatened the girl saying that if she ever said anything negative about him again he'd slit her throat. He was arrested, charged with uttering terroristic threats (some will remember my experience with those kinds of charges) and several other charges. He will not see the light of day for many years.

I can't tell you there's any lesson to be had from this but one:

Watch your teens. Know your teens. Snoop, pry, invade their privacy, follow them, bug their phones if you have to. Be a parent. And teach them that in todays world, you CAN NOT EVER, EVER, EVER, make threats of death against another no matter the circumstances, innocent or otherwise. Words have power, and that means that (in this county and state) you will be charged and tried and in all likelihood convicted.

Teach your children that life is the highest value.

Ok, I"ll get off my soap box, this hit waaaaaaaay too close to home on too many fronts. After what we went through my oldest and then us nearly being at that mall during the shooting opened my eyes to some things I was blind to.

Concealed weapons? In Omaha that law had little to do with what happened. ak47's are not concealable weapons.

Cat