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Title: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by Melissa on Feb 14th, 2007, 11:29am Ok, I am planning on selling my Seagate external HD and need to know what it is I have to do to get any of my info. removed from it. So far I am deleting everything from my E: drive into the recycle bin on my laptop, but is there anything else I need to do in order for all my info. to be gone from the thing? I'm new to this whole removal process. :-/ Thanks for any help you can give! mel |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by artonio7 on Feb 14th, 2007, 11:51am I would reformat it... that should wipe it clean... also use the highest degree of wipe possible. Right click on the drive image and from the pop-up menu select format hope that helps, with warm regards, Tony |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by seasonalboomer on Feb 14th, 2007, 11:58am reformatting is not the same as "wiping". reformatting a drive will not completely erase the data -- only a "wipe" function or software can accomplish that from my understanding. For PC's there's programs like Mediawiper, for Mac's theres something called "Shred it". Or, we use a hammer to disintegrate it when we're done with a drive. Of course that does alter the resale value some..... 8) good luck scott |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by Paul98 on Feb 14th, 2007, 12:26pm Do a low level reformat of the drive Mel. This writes the entire disk clean. (Except for boot blocks) I kind of doubt you need Mil Spec cleaning of the disk. Only forensic scrutiny can pull any info from the drive after low level format is done. if it is an old drive and under 10 gig just smash it with a hammer ;;D -P. |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by Lobster on Feb 14th, 2007, 12:26pm Yeah, what SB said. I guess it depends on your level of paranoia. - Sending the drive as is would be stupid. - Deleting everything will keep the buyer from casually looking at your stuff, but un-deleting is pretty easy. - Formatting makes it about 10x harder to get at your data, but it is still there for someone who really wants it. - Wiping truly destroys your data, but will be about 10x more effort for you. I am not sure which wipers actually work as a demo. Just google 'disk wiper' and try a few demos. For example... http://www.active-eraser.com/download.htm Just be extra careful not to wipe your primary drive. |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by fubar on Feb 14th, 2007, 12:35pm I'm always a little amazed at this... I have a tiny bit of experience in security matters, so I see this a lot. What is so valuable on your drive? C'mon, really? If it's a few spreadsheets or maybe Quicken data, or even full-fledged books for your home business... what is the big deal? Delete the stuff, *maybe* wipe it, but for Christ's sake, think about what you are worrying about. It's nothing. Seriously, unless you have some dark secret to hide, or you're carrying plans for the next holocaust, what is the *real* risk that someone is going to a) find your files *and* b) use them to your disadvantage Seriously. Here's what baffles me... I get this kind of question a LOT, but the very same people who ask this: - fail to keep their system updated - surf without any regard to the sites they are going to - ignore all warnings from their browser or operating system - open emails and attachments from people they don't know - forward stupid crap to everybody in their address book - don't know what a firewall is or why they need one and the list goes on and on. You get the picture. Please. Please get the picture. Mel, if you still are losing sleep over the possible discovery of bits on your sold hardware, use this utility: http://dban.sourceforge.net/ But... Having had to extract data from dead or formatted drives more than once, it is NOT a trivial matter and costs LOTS of money... somebody would have to have a very good reason to make the effort. Sure, there are those who might buy a drive and take a looksee to see if anything juicy was left in an easy to restore format, but 99.999% of those people are looking for pR0n (porn). Stop worrying about it. -Fu |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by seasonalboomer on Feb 14th, 2007, 1:13pm I understand what your sayin' Fu but the fact that someone even is asking the question about the delete function shows that knowledge about each of our "data hygeine" habits is starting to make itself known among users. I'm sure most of us would not like to have our e-mails from the past 5 years pulled up by a stranger, or maybe even worse, an acquaintance. So, rather than simply stopping one's worry about it, go one step farther and give yourself a completely verifiably, credible reason to not have to worry about. Use a utility that will truly wipe a drive. scott |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by fubar on Feb 14th, 2007, 1:32pm Scott, Yeah, I guess, and that's why I included the link to Boot & Nuke.. The intent isn't to make Mel feel stupid for asking. but In all honesty, I don't think I'd give a rat's ass if my email archives were 'found' by anybody. I'm not that interesting. Anything interesting that I have done, I am proud of. In the security business, we assess risk and then we decide an appropriate response to mitigate that risk. What I'm asking Mel to do is assess her risk. What data is she trying to protect? What are the odds that the data could be used against her in any way? What would it cost her if this protected data were used in the worst way? Once you start to look at the problem logically, then you can decide if it's worth your time and effort to find a decent wipe program (many might look good, but are in fact Trojan horses that will really infect you) and then spend your time doing the actual wiping. My time is valuable... I'm not going to spend it chasing ghosts. The media sensationalizes this crap and now there the hackers are seeding the Internet with programs to 'protect' you. Oh joy. Download this great disk wipe utility...just ignore the fact that it sends every bit away to prying eyes right before it wipes it for you. They feed on paranoia. Asses your risk, respond appropriately. -Fu |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by Margi on Feb 14th, 2007, 1:37pm sorry to interrupt here but...isn't identity theft a real risk in this kind of situation? Steamy emails be damned, shouldn't we worry more about any online purchase trails we may have left? |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by fubar on Feb 14th, 2007, 2:03pm Again, Assess your risk and respond appropriately. Identity theft is certainly possible if you leave confidential personal data alive on your hard drive AND it falls into the hands of a criminal who wants to spend the time and effort to look for it AND they actually use the data they found AND they succeed in fooling some lender that they are you AND etc etc etc... The fact is, the majority of identity theft is not even an online problem. According to the FTC 2006 report on Consumer Fraud and Identity Theft Complaint Data: •Credit card fraud (26%) was the most common form of reported identity theft followed by phone or utilities fraud (18%), bank fraud (17%), and employment fraud (12%). Other significant categories of identity theft reported by victims were government documents/benefits fraud (9%) and loan fraud (5%) Notably, credit card fraud can almost always (with certainty) be tracked back to a transaction with a fraudulent individual or company. Identity theft through the theft of a person's computer or data hasn't even begun to be a significant contributor to the numbers, and that problem is 100 times bigger than accidental disclosure leading to identity theft. But... the media loves to make you worry. So please worry, it keeps the economy going I guess. -Fu |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by Racer1_NC on Feb 14th, 2007, 2:07pm on 02/14/07 at 13:37:28, Margi wrote:
Exactly......you can add tax returns to that list too. Some people forget just how much of themselves can be on a hard drive. I'm glad to see people thinking about issues like this. Wipe 'um......it's not that hard to do. Bill |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by fubar on Feb 14th, 2007, 2:17pm Do you honestly think your online purchase trails are safer because you delete them from your hard drive? That's silly. Think about it... I'm the bad guy, I want your credit card number because I can sell it (maybe a bunch of times) to other people. The problem is, I only get about $1 per number (or less, even if I include the security code and it's valid). I have a choice... spend hours getting your information off of your hard drive that I bought from ebay (for $20?) OR I can break into one of *thousands* of online sites that store your credit card along with thousands or tens of thousands of numbers. Hmmmm. They simply don't waste time doing this. On the off chance that someone pulls it off your drive, they are probably a b-class criminal that will fail to successfully 'steal' you identity anyway. All I'm saying is the risk is FRIKKING MINIMAL. Delete the files, wipe the disk if you must, but stop worrying about it like you are James Bond protecting the list of MI5 operatives. If you have tax returns on the drive, HELLO, delete them. If you are afraid of someone seeing data from your hard drive, IS THE $20 FROM EBAY WORTH THE RISK? Trash it with a hammer! Assess and respond In order to assess properly, you have to have the slightest clue what the real risks are (probability) and that's the perspective I'm trying to add. -Fu |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by seasonalboomer on Feb 14th, 2007, 2:33pm on 02/14/07 at 14:17:40, fubar wrote:
I'm not saying worry about it. Anxiety can be completely relieved when you simply use the tools that allow you never have to say you're sorry. Why think about what files may be on an old drive to worry about -- wipe the whole thing and all your worries are gone. And then you can go dinner on the proceeds from the sale. |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by Lobster on Feb 14th, 2007, 2:59pm on 02/14/07 at 12:35:29, fubar wrote:
Heh heh... I specifically did not mention DBAN as, by default, DBAN detects and wipes all drives. I would just format it and send it off. If the data is sensitive to the point where you are truly worried about it, then just keep it or take a hammer to the drive. Drives are cheap. |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by fubar on Feb 14th, 2007, 3:07pm Good call Lobster, DBAN is what it says it is... boot and nuke. Take out drives you want to save from the nukage. It is low-effort and very effective. |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by Margi on Feb 14th, 2007, 3:28pm thanks, boys :) this thread has been an education for me! I am one of those people who DO actually keep previous years' tax returns on my hard drive. Because my lazy ass thinks it's easier that way to just import from last year, rather than retyping my name, address and social insurance number. ::) AND also because i usually don't have enough paper to print the damn thing out. Doh! Here I was thinking I was so technologically with it.....*sigh* |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by Melissa on Feb 14th, 2007, 4:01pm Thanks for all the info. everyone, but she's erased and is overwriting right now as we speak. ;;D It's all fine and dandy to delete, but my whole system was backed up onto my external HD. It's a 100GB drive and I don't want to take the chance of some yahoo pulling information I don't want them to have. Thanks again! :)mel (and if I tell you what I have on there, I will then have to kill you) |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by fubar on Feb 14th, 2007, 4:21pm Here's some scary facts for some ... (Paul, just look away) On the new Windows products, there's a cool little process running in the background to *help* you remember stuff you deleted. Or Changed. Or moved. In fact, it remembers every bit change on a file, and who made it, and when. So, when you think you have formatted a volume, guess what? You can recover every single bit. If you are a member of an Active Directory Domain (and the features are turned on by admin) you can't even control where your data lives anymore. Fun Fun Fun. Ever done non-work stuff on a non-work computer? If your company has their crap working right (what are the odds... it is Windows after all) you can't even control this automatic 'file version archival system'. Isn't that helpful? You shouldn't be shopping at work anyway, right? |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by Melissa on Feb 14th, 2007, 4:37pm correction, it's a 120GB |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by fubar on Feb 14th, 2007, 5:41pm Here's how to secure old drives... At last count there was about 7,000 GB in there. That's 7 Terabytes (and growing)... More than a couple 400 GB drives in there, but most re 250-300 GB. The *really* old drives (under 120GB) are used for target practice. What I have online is only about 3 Terabytes. It's mostly RAID arrays, so my actual capacity is about 1.8TB. And no... none of it is for porn. http://www.nunleys.com/IMG1843.gif |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by Lobster on Feb 14th, 2007, 5:48pm Wicked magnets. Until they pinch ya. |
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Title: Re: Help! Got an external HD ??... Post by purpleydog on Feb 14th, 2007, 9:09pm http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b6cc01b3127cce8fa59bb1e47900000015108AYs3LJs5cNz http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b7dc35b3127cce81c312e6bcff00000016108AYs3LJs5cNz |
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