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Title: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by DonnaHar on Nov 1st, 2006, 5:14pm I honestly don't understand how so many average Americans could consider themselves beneficiaries of Republican policy. Republican economic policy benefits only the very richest organizations. If you disagree with this statement, could you please give an example of a Republican economic policy that has benefited you. Republican environmental policy sacrifices our environment and the environment of future generations, again to satisfy corporate greed. If you disagree with this statement, please give an example of a Republican environmental policy that has made our world cleaner, safer or otherwise improved our world. The Republican Iraq war plan is a complete failure. Did the Bush White House believe the war in Iraq would turn out this way? If they didn't, then they are incompetent. If they did expect the turmoil and civil war, then they have been misleading us. The U.S. Military is not at fault for the Iraq disaster. The U.S. Military didn't choose this war. The U.S. Military has been fighting this war with one hand tied behind its' back and no boots for its' feet.... all courtesy of the Bush White House. If you disagree with these statements about the war, please give constructive reasons for your position. I know that, although not my intention, this post could be inflamatory. I am passionate about my political views and understand that many people on this board are probably passionately Republican. Please don't take my post as an attack on you, but as an opportunity to enlighten me. I am Donna H and I approved of this post. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by BarbaraD on Nov 1st, 2006, 5:18pm Good post Donna. And I just can't disagree with your statements. Now maybe after I win the lottery, I'll have some answers for you... ;;D Hugs BD |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by fubar on Nov 1st, 2006, 5:41pm Beneficiary of the Republican Party? When I was a kid, I moved around a lot. Not a military brat, just had a pretty unstable single-parent mother. Because of that, I was 'the new kid' at about 30 (not exaggerating) different schools. More often than not, maybe because of my appearance or attitude, the resident school bully (or team of bullies) would descend on 'the new kid' and test me out. First the insults to see of I would react, then the outright picking of a fight. Sometimes, I would end up in a fist fight, and blood would be spilled. Maybe mine, maybe his, but usually these things end up bloody. Did I want to fight? No. Did I intend to win when I was forced to fight? Hell yes. Did I always know what my enemy was going to do? Hmmmm..... nope. Did I always have a rock-solid plan to win? Well, I tried out everything I had learned until that point and adjusted as I learned new things. What does all that mean anyway? I think we were forced to fight when we were attacked on 9/11. I don't think we could have had a comprehensive plan for victory even if we had 20/20 hindsight to begin with... It simply wasn't possible to plan it, but we had to fight. I feel I am a beneficiary of the Republican Party because my Party has chosen to fight, and I believe we have chosen the right fight. I think it's easy for Democrats to criticize the war, but they offer me no security. They have no plan, except to do away with all the people who did anything at all. I feel thankful that the GOP is still there for now. Ya, we pissed of some jihadists... what do you think this is? We are in a holy war whether you want to believe it or not! The enemy started this war, and to them it is a holy war. We are in a HOLY WAR (what an oxymoron). We don't get the luxury of defining this war... we only recently even admitted it is going on. We were attacked long before 9/11 and the attacks are still going on US soil but the media is not reporting it. Whatever. The fact remains, this is a holy war and the enemy doesn't give a shit what we think, they want ALL of us, regardless of party affiliation, DEAD. Not hurt... DEAD. Their doctrine DEMANDS it. So, if we are in a holy war, what comfort does the Democrat Party give you? Seriously, do you think the jihadists are going to stop attacking us just because we elect a Democrat? Lemme see... I'll vote Republican, thank you. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Jonny on Nov 1st, 2006, 5:48pm Rock solid post, Shawn!!! [smiley=bigguns.gif] http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v123/tribander_3/irak.jpg |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by vietvet2tours on Nov 1st, 2006, 5:49pm http://media.putfile.com/todd-snyder |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by JeffB on Nov 1st, 2006, 5:50pm [smiley=thumb.gif], well said! |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by brewcrew on Nov 1st, 2006, 5:52pm on 11/01/06 at 17:14:19, DonnaHar wrote:
Republican economic policy = lower taxes. Lower taxes = I keep more of the money I've earned. I keep more of the money I've earned = Spending, saving, stimulating the economy. Our forefathers were willing to engage the King's military machine over what amounted to a half percent increase in the tax they paid. Today, people all around me roll over and open their wallets to the government, surrendering 20%, 30%, 40% and more. Here's another one liberals don't get: a cut in tax rates creates more tax revenue. When people are required to pay less, there's more compliance. I don't see how these things are so difficult to understand.... One last thing. I am not a Republican, although I end up voting that way most of the time. Only because Republicans are a little closer to what I consider true conservatism. But not much closer. All of American politics is designed to pander to the 20% or so in the middle who are wishy-washy and usually end up deciding elections. I am to the right of Ghengis Khan. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by floridian on Nov 1st, 2006, 6:09pm on 11/01/06 at 17:52:45, brewcrew wrote:
That's only occasionally true. If it were always true, why not cut the income tax and the sales tax to 0.001%? Would that create enough revenue to erase the deficit? |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Bob P on Nov 1st, 2006, 6:14pm Republican policies don't punish you for being successful. Liberal philosophy is if you are successful and make lots of money, you should have to pay more to help those who don't have as much as you. Now there's a freakin'incentive to work hard! Benifit - I'm typical blue collar and I've paid a lot less in taxes the past few years (no matter what Barb thinks she knows). War - see my comment re spinless whiners in the Kerry thread. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by brewcrew on Nov 1st, 2006, 6:25pm on 11/01/06 at 18:09:34, floridian wrote:
You're so silly. You're a silly goose. It's a simplification for brevity's sake. And for all the troops in Iraq who might not understand. (That last one was sarcasm.) |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by maffumatt on Nov 1st, 2006, 6:58pm First, I am not a Republican. I am a conservative. on 11/01/06 at 17:14:19, DonnaHar wrote:
The trip to England was paid for by the tax cuts. I work hard for my money, I would like to be able to enjoy some of it. on 11/01/06 at 17:14:19, DonnaHar wrote:
President Bush plans to designate an island chain spanning nearly 1,400 miles of the Pacific northwest of Hawaii as a national monument today, creating the largest protected marine reserve in the world, according to sources familiar with the plan. on 11/01/06 at 17:14:19, DonnaHar wrote:
War is war. Plans change to counter the enemy's plans. War is not what war used to be. We could have carpet and fire bombed Iraq like we did Germany and Japan. Would this have been better? Would man handling 20 million people into submission. You might want to research the German werewolves. The aftermath of WW2 was not bloodless. Most of all I vote Republican because my conscience requires me to. Do I agree with all Republican principles? No, just more than I do with liberal ones. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by JeffB on Nov 1st, 2006, 7:13pm Well said Matt. You too Brew. Come to California and try to start up a business. I'll put dollars to donuts you would pack up and run as fast as you can when you see just what rules and regulations the Democrats try to pass. I'm a member of the California Chamber of Commerce and it's amazing what these guys are doing to small business here. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by lashultz on Nov 1st, 2006, 7:13pm I am not a Republican. Although at one time I was leaning more toward them than the Democrats. Ronald Reagan cured me of that , with his trickle down theory. All I got was the urine at the bottom of the pissing post. I ask anyone of the right, why are we always more in debt with a Republican than a Demoract. I miss Bill. Lee |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by brewcrew on Nov 1st, 2006, 7:22pm on 11/01/06 at 19:13:41, lashultz wrote:
It's simple, Lee. Because these people who call themselves conservatives continue to spend like drunken sailors, even though the money's not there. This is not a conservative value. At least a drunken sailor has to stop when there's no more money in his pocket. "Conservative" would be buying goods and services when you can afford to pay for them, and then borrowing modest amounts when the payments fit into your budget. These Republicans - Bush included - are not in any sense of the word fiscally conservative. Clinton was actually more fiscally conservative than Bush. This is why I no longer call myself a Republican. I DO call myself a conservative, although the two words have become interchangable in the mainstream media. Bill |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by lashultz on Nov 1st, 2006, 7:35pm on 11/01/06 at 19:22:08, brewcrew wrote:
Thats why I cannot call myself a Conservative. Lee |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by M.R. on Nov 1st, 2006, 7:39pm A lot of the points made above, and I get to keep my guns. Mike |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by maffumatt on Nov 1st, 2006, 7:42pm Bush is not a conservative. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Charlie on Nov 1st, 2006, 7:55pm I have to agree with everything Donna wrote. I was a Republican when the party still existed. It no longer does. As Bill Mahrer said: The Republicans were admirable when they were the mean old men watching our purse strings. They are now a bunch of nosy, if it's fun, it's a sin, pulpit-pounders spending money at undreamed of levels. When they discovered that they had been the underdogs for so long because they lacked a coherant social message, they looked for something that would work. They found it when they got behind those shining lights of social justice and clear thought: Ralph Reed, James Dobson, Jerry Falwell and other Pat Robertson-style millionaires yearning for the good old days of the mid-19th century. Goldwater hated these people. The Christian Right is more right than Christian and and they aren't paying attention. Taxes? The 1950s and the early 1960s are usually considered the most prosperous and benevolent for waspy Americans. The tax rates on the very rich scraped 90% in some cases. It was nothing to brag about but it had the effect of creating the middle class. It was a rare time when a few of the right people got some disposable income to buy cars from these same rich people. The big difference is that these were men with some social conscience and much less greed than today. I suppose it was socialist. If so, bring it on anyway. It hurt no one. The Democrats have a pretty good history of fighting. We had Democrats in the White House for WWI, WWII, Korea, A lot of Vietman. The Republicans fought FDR tooth and nail in his war preparations and even support of Britain until Pearl Harbor. You can't tell us that Repubicans are the only ones to handle national emergencies. Anyway, most kids start with the politics of their parents. I did and stuck with the Republicans until they kicked out the Libertarian wing. It's a shame. It did the country more good than harm then. Oh, Matt, I'm a conservative too but on the other side of the aisle. I have to live with myself. Mean Old Charlie |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Woobie on Nov 1st, 2006, 9:01pm That's like asking - Why are all the Catholics - STILL Catholic?? #1. The lesser of two evils is still evil. #2. When you get right down to it - they're ALL politicians, who need votes...... who lie to get them........ and who you can never trust. http://www.self-gov.org/quiz.html http://www.lp.org/issues/issues.shtml libertarian woobie |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by DonnaHar on Nov 1st, 2006, 9:21pm on 11/01/06 at 17:41:54, fubar wrote:
Al-Queda attacked us, not Saddam. Saddam was a decadent dictator, not a religious jihadist. The religious jihadist, Al-Queda sympathetic Iranians hated Saddam. They fought a war with Saddam........the Iran-Iraq war. While the Republican party led by Bush has been protecting you, bin Laden, who did attack us on 9/11, is still free and Iran, who does back Al-Queda, is about to make a nuclear bomb. on 11/01/06 at 17:41:54, fubar wrote:
I don't like Saddam. He was an evil dictator. There are many evil dictators and totalitarian regimes world wide, not activly attacking us. Going to war with them won't make us more secure. Going to war with them will distract us from the fight we need to win. I know this is a holy war. Do you know the enemy? Do you think Iran is not full of jihadists? It is led by a jihadist. Do you think Saddam would have stood for Iran going nuclear? He would have been fighting to stop it. Bush has given Iran relief from it's biggest enemy and the confusion it needed to make atomic weapons almost unopposed. Bush has put us in a terrible position. We must win in Iraq. If we lose we give it to Iran. What comfort has the Republican party given you? The Iranian nuclear bomb soon to be? bin Laden still activly taking verbal, if not violent, swipes at us? How about North Korea with an atomic bomb, and missiles to drop it on California? Don't mistake reckless aggression for security. Bush did lead us against Afganistan. Why, why didn't he finish the job ? Why is the Taliban still active in Afganistan ? We have been distacted by Iraq! Republican foriegn policy in general, and their execution of the war on terror specifically, is indicative of complete incompetency. Do the Democrats have the answer to our problems in Iraq? I don't know. Do the Republicans? The first step in solving a problem is admitting you have one. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Jonny on Nov 1st, 2006, 9:28pm on 11/01/06 at 21:21:05, DonnaHar wrote:
So please tell us, Donna....who do you think is capable of handeling this problem? |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Paul98 on Nov 1st, 2006, 9:42pm Republicians used to stand for being fiscal conservitave but as all to often happens once in power for a while they learn where the cash drawer is just as the Dems. did when they held the purse strings. The only way to stop it is to have term limits and once the term is up they are banished forever to the private sector where they have to live within the constraints of the laws they passed, taxes they levied and freedoms they take away. The reason I vote Republician for the most part is because the Dems. (the likes of Pelosi, Fat Ted, et.al.) believe more gov. = good. The Dems. need poor people for without them their party would cease to exist. Think about it...Do you really believe they want a society of happy self sufficient people? -P. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by BobG on Nov 1st, 2006, 10:07pm on 11/01/06 at 17:14:19, DonnaHar wrote:
Why? Because like most Republicans I kant spell very well. When I went to reister to vote I couldn't remember how to spel demmocrat so i just put republican. And dats why I was drafted in to the Army and sent to a war. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by alienspacebabe on Nov 1st, 2006, 10:14pm on 11/01/06 at 21:01:32, Woobie wrote:
I'm not. Not republican. Not Catholic (any more). I'm merely independent. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by DonnaHar on Nov 1st, 2006, 10:32pm on 11/01/06 at 17:52:45, brewcrew wrote:
Quote:
Visit the United for a Fair Ecomony web site for more information .http://www.faireconomy.org/Taxes/HTMLReports/Shifty_Tax_Cuts.html brewcrew: if you make more than $337,000 a year then you got a tax cut and I understand why you vote Republican. If you don't than your party is lying to you. Ninty eight or so percent of U.S. citizens got a tax shift or worse, a tax increase. Republican economic policy = tax shift . tax shift = Rich keep more of the money I've earned. Rich keep more of the money I've earned = I got the shift shaft. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by DonnaHar on Nov 1st, 2006, 10:58pm on 11/01/06 at 21:28:42, Jonny wrote:
Jonny, certainly not the people who created it...who want to continue as they have been, wasting precious lives and spending billions to do it. If the Republican candidates would just say "boy, we screwed up bad, and the crap is going to be neck deep when Iran starts supplying bin Laden with bombs, so we better do something about Iran like bombing them because we don't want them to have weapons of mass destruction.....I mean, we invaded Iraq because we didn't want them to have weapons of mass destruction, but the oh so brave Republicans can't even say....oops, let alone tackle that problem. If you listen, the Democrats are saying "we've got problems...we can't keep going the same way we are. Time to let the Democrats, as pointed out previously, the party who won world wars I and II, have a crack at solving it. Did you find any other details in my posts that you'd like to discuss, or do you agree with the rest of what I've posted? |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Donna_D. on Nov 1st, 2006, 11:29pm I sure hope this thread lasts a while. It is supposed to get cold tomorrow and every time I open this thread a WOOOOSH of hot air comes rushing out of it. Saves on the heating bill. ;;D DD |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by D_Robinson on Nov 1st, 2006, 11:53pm Donna, I am a republican because I did not win lifes lottery and have to work my ass off for my money. I have a much better idea on how to spend it then any government. I hate to see laziness rewarded and resourcefullness penalized. I do not feel the top 10% of the wage earners should bear the brunt of the majority of the taxes paid in. I fell they should only pay the same percentage I pay no more. I am no where near the top 40% but I do aspire to be. I think we should teach people how to fish and not just feed them. I believe in personal responsibility. I fell we should have gone after Bin Laddy, much earlier. US property was destroyed and US Soil was attacked when the USS Cole was hit and when the African Embassies were attacked. War is a terrible thing. Countires are destroyed and young men loose their lives, but if we do nothing young men will still die and attacks will happen like that did sept 11. Has the war in Iraq been a success. No it has not. Should we just pick up and leave tomorrow. I do not see how we can. Someone has to stick around pick up the pieces and get a government up and running. Not sure why it has been a complete failure. I think part of the plan was to remove Saddam from power and well that was done. Are we handling the power struggle very well currently? No, but what has anyone else suggrested other then leave. Maybe we should carpet bomb the country so we can spend even more money to rebuild it. Republican Ecomonic Policy has allowed me to keep more of my hard earned money, and I earn no where near the 300,000+ dollars you mention not even a 1/3 of that. Why are you a democrat? Do you feel the rich, those who are resourceful and hard working, have really just won life's lottery and owe the rest of us? Do you think we need to allow our jobs to go down to Mexico and China where manufacturing costs are lower due to the fact the world is not worried about how these 3rd world countries pollute their water, air and land, but the world is concerned with the fact the USA is not doing enough to clean up its air? The air in Mexico City is terrible and has been for many many years. No one seems concerned with cleaning it up, and you only need to read National Geographic to discover how China is challenging the environment. From what I have read they have taken Acid Rain to a whole new level. I guess we should have signed the Kyoto Accords, so like the rest of the world we could say it is ok for 3rd world countries to pollute all they want and heck let them make ozone eating R-12 refirgerant for years to come. I just do not see how someone could be a democrat. who have the democrats helped. Southern Democrats blocked desegratgation in the south during the 60s, but democrats are the party of the black man. President Carter deregulated the airlines costing how many union jobs? Bill Clinton signed NAFTA taking how many union jobs outside the USA. Unions support the democrats even tho they are getting screwed by them. All I see in the democratic party is a group of elitist rich that want to make to tell me how to live and what I can spend my money on. FYI, I do not feel President Bush has done any better job then Bill Clinton did. Neither of their stratergy was worth a shit. Dave |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by D_Robinson on Nov 1st, 2006, 11:55pm Hey didn't the democrats bring us WW2, and Veitnam? Dave |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by tanner on Nov 2nd, 2006, 12:29am Interesting thread Donna :) Am I a Republican? Not sure. I think I may be an independent like Brew because I reserve and exercise the right to vote across party lines. Do I register Republican? Yes because I think it important to give the political parties some indication of where strengths and weaknesses lie. A lot of good points have been made here but I would beg to correct some misconceptions on your part. 1945, First American is killed in Vietnam. Lt. Col. Peter Dewey OSS placed there under Truman's administration. 1950, Truman puts us into the Korean Conflict and then listens to his cronies and allows us to continue the fight but not follow it up with a full invasion of China which would have solved a huge problem. 1953, Eisenhower negotiates truce in Korea to end a then unwinnable debacle. In the meantime he provides Special Advisors to the South Vietnamese to attempt to train and equip them to master their own fate. 1960, Kennedy commits first troops to Vietnam and Agent Orange is introduced to the world. Continues to build our presence until his death. 1964, Johnson beats Goldwater on a platform of de-escalation. Tell that to the guys on the Wall! He comes up with some fabulous ideas, like carpet bombing rural areas so as not to hurt too many innocents. Creates Rules of Engagement that tie our( The Soldiers) hands behind our backs and causing untold losses especially among our Air Force and Navy pilots that are assigned missions in extreme harms way but are not allowed to fire first or at all on most of the true military targets in the north. His ROE's also get many ground troops in the south killed by creating "safe havens" for the enemy. Same can't shoot first rule applies. 1968, Despite all of the above the American Military and Allies achieve one of the greatest lopsided victories in recent history. The press and the administration allow this victory to be perceived by the public as a crushing defeat. The coward quits shortly after but the die has been cast and we are now fighting a losing , immoral , war. 1969, Nixon fights on two fronts, trying to pull a victory from what is already painted as a defeat and is now strongly opposed by the vocal left press and people. 1970, I volunteer to go to Vietnam, Kent State happens, Sept. rolls around and luminaries like Ted Kennedy, John Kerry, George McGovern and even Jane "CB" Fonda march and protest the war and the troops calling us "baby killers" and "murderers". I'm still there listening to all this on the radio . 1970-75 Efforts are made to turn the conflict over to the Vietnamese bowing to the pressure from the liberal left of the world , ironically the French are quite vocal about our "bad war". 1977, Carter gives amnesty to 10,000+ draft dodgers while not affording the same to many fighting troops who cracked under the pressure and accepted "less then honorably discharges". 1997, Clinton, Hugs and makes up with Hanoi granting them diplomatic recognition leaving hundreds of unaccounted for MIA's. I for one would really have appreciated the chance to win that one ! Given what is now going on with North Korea I would really like it if we had a strong Democratic government right there right now instead of a China leaning Communist regime. Guess thats why........Tim |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by tanner on Nov 2nd, 2006, 12:40am OH MY, I almost forgot :-[ If FDR would not have been listening to his left wing, nazi loving democrat friends like Joe Kennedy we could have joined our allies in time to stop WW2 before it even got rolling :'(. woossshh..>>>>>> |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by tanner on Nov 2nd, 2006, 1:00am Oh Darn, the WW1 thing :o England and France went in in 1914. Wilson drug his feet until 1917. I kinda think we could have spared a few lives there too :( puff...>>>>>>>Tim |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by jon019 on Nov 2nd, 2006, 1:33am on 11/01/06 at 21:01:32, Woobie wrote:
Wow, Woobie. Politics AND religion in the same post. Talk about the razors edge. I would be vaguely insulted by the Catholic reference except I'm not sure what it means, and I am a fallen Catholic. Do love quotes tho and am reminded of Winston Churchill who said: "If you are not a liberal by the time you are 18, you've got no heart. And if you are not a conservative by the time you are 35, you've got no head" Me, personally, I must be 18+35= 53 (damn close too) because I'm both and I agree with Tip O'Neil: "ALL politics is local" That's what I care about and I couldn't care less whether there is a (D) or an (R) after the candidates name. Only, what have they got to offer? Admit to having a tough time with the (L), am ok with the (I), and only bemused by the (C). Then, just to throw a little spice into the mix, there is the (A) for anarchist. My favorite of whom is Utah Phillips, who said: "Ahh, America the melting pot, where those at the bottom get burned, and the scum rises to the top" Wouldn't vote for him, but he is damn funny. Regards Jon |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by AussieBrian on Nov 2nd, 2006, 3:08am on 11/02/06 at 01:33:43, jon019 wrote:
Sex. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by BarbaraD on Nov 2nd, 2006, 6:48am on 11/01/06 at 21:42:22, Paul98 wrote:
I agree about the term limits. That's the one flaw in the constitution that our founding fathers missed. They put term limits for President, but left those guys in Congress to be there forever = not good. But this would have to start with a grassroots movement and what are the chances of these same guys voting for term limits? I also agree with LESS government. Back in the "old days" PARENTS raised their kids - not the government and we had MORE intelligent kids, kids learning responsibility, less crime among kids, etc. Since the government took over (and I don't know when this happened - blame it on both parties) we're TOLD how to raise our kids and you see the results. Education used to be on the local level - SCHOOLS deciding what was best for their students. Today, teachers and administrators have so many "government" rules placed on them, they can't teach readin', writin' and 'rithmatic anymore. And now we have metal dectectors in the schools and dogs looking for drugs, etc. My solution for what it's worth... get the guys who are IN out and put some new blood in DC. They can't do much worse than the ones who are there now. If they screw up SCREAM for their heads. But this would take AMERICANS getting INVOLVED! And most people have never written their Congressman, Senator or the President. That would take an effort on their part. Those guys in DC don't know what WE want unless we TELL them, so it's a mystery to me why people don't LET them know. But until American's TAKE BACK our country from corrupt politicians we're going to continue in this quagmire. Hugs BD |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Bob P on Nov 2nd, 2006, 7:45am Quote:
Um, did not some Democrats in Congress also vote to go war? At least most voted yes before they started hollaring no. Quote:
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by vig on Nov 2nd, 2006, 7:53am We are all Americans first, let's not forget that. the fight is out THERE, not in here... This is the first party/administration pairing that has gone this far in polarizing the country. and they did it for their own gains, not the good of the country. What did they actually do with their party's monopoly? they lowered taxes for themselves. Did they actually solve the immigration issue? the ethics issue? the gay thing? TORTURE? NO! What else did they bring up for folly? Flag Burning? Banning of Horse Meat? a Wall? they lowered the taxes for themselves. that's what they DID accomplish amidst the hubris of being full of Family Values. (I think they're full of something else) I was all FOR 'throw the bums out' in 1994 when they were democrats (remember Dan Rostenkowski? Jim Wright?) The K Street project shows what they were really after. $$$$$$$ If I've been reading correctly, Karl Rove insisted that Mark Foley run again despite Foley's suggestion of not running. He was lured by the scent of bigger lobbying money when he left. They knew he was a pervert and let him continue RUNNING the Internet Kiddie gig. (fox in the henhouse anyone?) Don't be fooled. They're not about the values, they're about the money. :-/ -one fed up American who didn't even mention Iraq |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by thomas on Nov 2nd, 2006, 8:44am I am not a republican, but I am a conservative. And the REAL HONEST answer as to why I am a conservative, is because due to my experience I am CONVINCED that liberalism is a MENTAL DISORDER. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by john_d on Nov 2nd, 2006, 10:56am I am a fiscal conservative, the neocons in government now are definitely not my kind of republicans. If I called myself one, it would be as a traditional conservative, a rarity it seems. I often find myself anti-liberal democrat because the Democratic party looks like a thousand different minority viewpoints all screaming for the government to give them free handouts and special priviledges in the form of welfare and affirmative action. These are way outside my value system as a descendant of early-American immigrants who basically had to work their ass off to live off what the land had to offer. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by BMoneeTheMoneeMan on Nov 2nd, 2006, 12:23pm Its funny how some people say they make money and they want to keep more of it.......yet we are borrowing TRILLIONS of dollars. Its funny how republicans send our troops overseas and dont want to give them the funding needed. How selfish can you be? We have our boys sitting in the middle of a civil war lacking equipment, and republicans are more concerned about buying new gadgets, or a bigger McMansion. The republicans are willing to fight, just not with our enemies. They would rather 'stay the course' against the Iraqis than put our military to work protecting America and avenging 3000 deaths. This war has cost between 200 and 600 billion dollars (depends on who you listen to). Rather than pay for it, the republicans want to borrow the money......making the true cost 1 to 2 trillion dollars after we pay the interest. Talk about fiscal irresponsibility, jesus h christ, how shameful. Rather than pay 200 to 600 billion dollars now, they want to spend 1 to 2 trillion later......and they call this "helping the economy". You want more of your money to stay in your pocket?, then dont fucking borrow money!! B$ |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by floridian on Nov 2nd, 2006, 12:44pm on 11/02/06 at 00:40:39, tanner wrote:
Ok, lets all pretend that the dems are nazis and nazi sympathizers - history be damned. We can all pretend that the Republican party wasn't isolationist or 'non-interventionist' and they weren't strongly opposed to US involvement in WWII until December 7, 1941. Wendell Wilkie (the Republican nominee in 1940) was critical of FDR for providing any indirect support to the Brits. "No man has the right to use the great powers of the Presidency to lead the people, indirectly, into war." Kennedy was in bed with the Nazis. So were most of America's big businessmen and large corporations. IBM. Ford. GM. Mellon Steel. Standard Oil / Exxon. William Randolph Hearst and his right-wing editors painted a very sympathetic picture of Adolph. To pretend that Kennedy's influence on FDR stopped the US from dealing with Hitler is a bizzare distortion. But if that's part of why you are a Republican, ... thanks for sharing that with us. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by floridian on Nov 2nd, 2006, 1:11pm on 11/02/06 at 07:45:14, Bob P wrote:
Didn't the President go to Congress and ask for the authorization to use force, as a last result if all else failed, to help him bring about a settlement? And isn't it clear that the President intended to invade all along - even going so far as to suggest to the Brits that if Saddam complied with all demands, the US might paint a plane in false colors, send it in low to get it shot down, and then we could invade? Quote:
What a brilliant way to support our troops. Lets paint up our pilots to look like they are not part of the US military (so that they can be executed under interational law if they survive being shot down), so we can lie our way into a war!! And then when thousands of them die and ten-thousands are wounded, we can say its all the fault of the minority party, some of who made the mistake of trusting the President. |
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Title: A curious observation from outer space Post by AlienSpaceGuy on Nov 2nd, 2006, 2:12pm Judging from this thread (and the Kerry thread) the Republicans have many more supporters here than adversaries. Could it be that CH not only causes smoking (as BobP always says) but also shifts political sympathy towards the Republican side? ;;D (That would also explain why Charlie enjoys such a long remission.) ASG [smiley=smokin.gif] |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by tanner on Nov 2nd, 2006, 2:35pm Hi Flo, [smiley=wave.gif] I am truly surprised that you chose only that one piece to misquote! I don't see where I categorized ALL dems as being anything! W.R. Hearst, IBM, FORD, GM, Mellon Steel, and Standard Oil/Exxon were not Ambassadors to the Court of St. James appointed by FDR. They also were not avowed Jew haters and were never called "Germany's best friend" by the then German Ambassador. You know Kennedy quit in disgust and went to pout in Florida after FDR's re-election in 1940 because we were FINALLY going to help our European friends. And no Flo, you are the reason I am a Republican. ......Tim |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by D_Robinson on Nov 2nd, 2006, 3:17pm I always find it funny that others want to spend the money I earn. Why do you feel that you or the government has a better idea on how I should spend the money I worked for then I do? You just assume since I want to keep more of my money that I am a greedy SOB, and live in some giant sized house upon a hill. You give no thought to the fact I might give money to charity, or help others with my time and extra money. I am just a greedy SOB. Well I know one thing is that you are sitting there on your high horse determining who I am and you do not have the slightest clue. I bet you are sitting there thinking I am some gun toting foot washing baptist redneck. Oh and if any government local or otherwise would seem to spend wisely I would have much less issue of what I pay tax wise. I am tired of spending 15,000 dollars to put HVAC in a classroom when my house with much more square footage only requires 6500 dollar HVAC system. I am tired of the fact our government overspends everywhere to a point where our armed forces go into battle without the proper tools. What I see currently is no matter how much money I give the government they will not spend it wisely, and get it to those in need of it, whether it be someone needing some short term help, or a foot solider that needs more ammo. So go spend your money, but do not think you can just walz in and tell me how I am going to spend mine. Oh and saying Fuck really helped your cause as far as I am concerned. I have learned that really smart people who have a lot going on always use foul language. Dave |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by tanner on Nov 2nd, 2006, 3:44pm whoo dave , i am gonna duck until i figure out which way that was aimed :) i don't want to be collateral damage! i swear you can spend your money any way you want i don't mind. there is a nice little harley i've had my eye on ;)...tim |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by deltadarlin on Nov 2nd, 2006, 5:04pm Niether party is immune from corruption. All one has to do is look at the vice and corruption in the government of my very own state and particularly the lovely slum of New Orleans. Democrats have been in power in New Orleans for the past 106 years and what have they done for this city? Not a damned thing. New Orleans is a beautiful city and corruption from the top down has tarnished it. And on the WW II issue, fault lays on both sides with the US not intervening before it did. If Japan hadn't attacked, the US might not have gotten involved (however, the US had been secretly funneling money, etc. and weapons to the other Allied nations for quite some time). The attitude of the govt. and a good majority of the citizens was, "we haven't been attacked by them, it's not our war". I can't be a Democrat because I'm sick and damned tired of people's hands in my back pocket. I can't be a *real* Republican, because on a majority of issues, I have a big problem with the idealogy. Independent? HELL NO!! I get called enough during an election, I damned sure don't want to get called twice as much during elections :o ! I don't now, nor ever will vote for someone because of party affiliation. I vote for someone because their ideas most closely mirror my own. darlin |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by JeffB on Nov 2nd, 2006, 5:08pm Serious question: Why are you a Republican: Sean Penn! ;;D |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by FramCire on Nov 2nd, 2006, 5:28pm I can't understand why anyone would be party affiliated. I am an Indep for a reason. Watch the political ads and you will know eactly why. The Missouri Senate race is the worst campagn I have ever seen. The guy I was going to vote for has run a disgusting campagn where he has lied and misled voters. One of his "approved" ads called his apponent a liar and he said in a debate he doesnt think she is a liar. This was the guy I wanted to vote for (and still might). I say let DJ be President and we all can be Congress. At least politics would be interesting. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by floridian on Nov 2nd, 2006, 5:29pm on 11/02/06 at 14:35:57, tanner wrote:
You might want to check some facts. Henry Ford was an active anti-semite; he pushed the bogus "Protocols of the Elders of Zion" manuscript that alleged to have the inside story of a Jewish Conspiracy to control the world. And it is isn't clear that Kennedy had more influence on public policy that Hearst, who owned scads of newspapers and magazines and used them to improve the image of both Hitler and the facists in Italy. Hearst went from supporting the New Deal in the early 30's to reflexively opposing anything FDR did by the mid to late 30s. Hearst was on Hitler's payroll and got loans from facists in Italy. Standard oil had secret contracts to keep selling oil to Germany even if we went to war with them. And these companies used their considerable influence to keep the US out of war - they thought it would be more profitable to sell to both sides, which is easier if we weren't in the fighting. Some of the other companies weren't political - it was just about the money for them. But to pretend that the Republicans in the late 30's and early 40's were not dominated by isolationists and non-interventionists that opposed the war as much as Kennedy did is just silly. You ought to stop - you are making yourself look foolish. Quote:
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by tanner on Nov 2nd, 2006, 5:56pm Flo, please refer to the post by KOP. I won't take the next couple of hours trying to find articles to copy, paste. or link. If I look foolish in your eyes well......I guess I will have to live with it. For every buyer there is a seller, for every point there is a counterpoint. That's why anyone can find a version of history that backs their belief system. Hope you are well...Tim |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Charlie on Nov 2nd, 2006, 6:34pm Flo: I had written this before I read your post but I decided to leave it intact. Are we on the same page, or what? :o From Tanner: Quote:
Right. FDR is responsible for WWII. On the contrary, FDR did NOT listen Joe Kennedy. He was bright enough to realize what Hitler was and sent Wendell Willkie to Churchill. That was when people from the other party were still allowed to be loyal. FDR was the rarity in the 1930s and early 40s. It was the Republicans of the General McCormick ilk of the Chicago Tribune that literally hated FDR. The great industrialists that were almost all GOP supporters backed their pals in Germany more than England because they were convinced the Nazis would win. Business always comes first with them. It was FDR almost alone that knew better and did everything but tunnel to England because of his hatred of Hitler. FDR was different too in that when the war came to England itself, he made it a point of saying that is was okay for Americans to feel differently than the official neutral position of the U. S. Hardly the same today. Bush failed to use a historic rare opportunity to gather support from just about everyone here and the rest of the world. Bright boy that he is, declared that only we knew what to do when it came to countering terrorism and that anyone that questioned in any way was pretty much a traitor. His asinine "you are either with us or against us" speech destroyed the once in a lifetime almost total support for him from the entire country such had not been seen since 1941. FDR should have been so lucky. He was bright enough to deal with the almost total rejection of him and anything he proposed because of the hatred of the New Deal by the GOP, and helped England hang on....although the RAF did a helluva job sending the picks back to the Continent with their tails between their legs long before Pearl Harbor. Oh yeah....FDR was the villain.... Of course the fear is that by our invasion, Iraq becomes a true democracy. Should this happen, they will elect for the next century or so more and more Islamic fundamentalists. It's what they know and a civil war will be and in many areas already is the result. Oh by the way, you're right Cuddlepumpkin. The beast seems to favor right wingers. Charlie |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by tanner on Nov 2nd, 2006, 6:58pm Charlie, at no point did I blame FDR for WW2. I did insinuate that as the Man in charge he could have, should have involved us earlier. After further research into Flo's points about Henry Ford and a bevy of special interest groups bellying up to the nazi trough I must absolutely concede his synopsis! I don't tend to "BLAME" wars on the President in office at the time. I simply put down a time-line in response to an earlier post that gave credit to the Dem's for winning WW I and II and by implication blaming the Rep's for losing the rest. Am I mistaken or are we voting a mid-term election next week ::) I hate to think that the public is going to base their local decisions entirely on how they feel about Bush. [smiley=twocents.gif] more......Tim |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Charlie on Nov 2nd, 2006, 7:26pm You're right Tim. I was careless in my responce. Nevertheless, it was FDR that was blocked from doing anything significant by the Republicans every time. The draft was approved by one vote in 1940. He spent most of his second term trying to convince the country that we were in serious trouble. In fact, he bent the rules to begin some of his programs and took a helluva beating for it. I'm sure that a lot of people will use hatred for Bush as a reason for their votes. That's nothing new really. My thinking is that anything I can do to halt or slow down the dangerous rubber stamp legislation is why I will vote for a change. Make it a one issue thing: With the current makeup, drug companies will block any attempts to make things easier for us. With a Democrat House and or Senate, it won't likely get better but it won't get worse. That would do it for me. Charlie |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by floridian on Nov 3rd, 2006, 2:41am on 11/02/06 at 14:35:57, tanner wrote:
That's because I know that we'll probably never agree on more recent issues, but the dust has settled enough on WWII that we can probably come to terms on that one. ;) |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by floridian on Nov 3rd, 2006, 2:57am Ok, I can't say why I am a Republican (I'm not, in case you haven't noticed). But I did just come across a letter written by a life-long Republican, Christian military parent. He gives the reason that he and his wife recently decided to leave the Republican party. http://tinyurl.com/yyp2jx |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by burnt-toast on Nov 3rd, 2006, 5:45am I'm a registered Independent. I find common sense, ethics and true desire to do the right things for this country and its citizens horribly lacking in this openly corrupt two party political system. A quick review of the "true and accurate" records/results on legislation, jobs, national debt, Constitutional rights, national security and future economic stability of this country reflects extreme misrepresentation by both Republican and Democratic administrations. While citizens get jerked into the old us-vs-them game representatives of both parties build their power bases through greed and essentially the open sale of legislation. We're being sold out by leaders from both partys who simply need to point across the isle when its time to defer blame and continue the game. "The People" have become meaningless words in this political system. Both political parties claim to represent "The People" but when either uses these words they use them in place of "The Sheep". Tom |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Bob P on Nov 3rd, 2006, 6:54am At least, as the thread title says, we now know why Charlie and Flo are Republicans. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by FramCire on Nov 3rd, 2006, 8:19am on 11/03/06 at 05:45:03, burnt-toast wrote:
Sad, very sad. Sad because it's true. This is the reason why I honestly feel it is in our country's best interest to have Congress and the President controlled by different parties. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Woobie on Nov 3rd, 2006, 8:26am My dad always said that he didn't care who was in the white house - as long as congress was ruled by the opposite party. Checks -n- balances......... it's a GREAT theory, eh?? Real nice on paper. politics suck woobie |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by thomas on Nov 3rd, 2006, 8:58am Hey Tina I don't mean to make this seem like I'm singling you out, but I have seen/heard "checks and balances" many time in reference to democrats and republicans. Let me set the record straight on what "checks and balances" means. You people all should have paid more attention in Civics class - Checks and balances is the term used to describe the seperation of power by the three branches of government, the judicial, executive and legisative branches. It has nothing to do with party affilitation. Just another example of the talking heads and spin doctors dictating what you people think. I love you Tina, don't think I'm picking on you. You know I'm a straight shooter. :-* |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by BMoneeTheMoneeMan on Nov 3rd, 2006, 10:35am Thomas, Actually, I think it does have to do with party affiliation. It was set up so that one party or group does not have all the power. Maybe not party affiliation in the sense of repugnants and dummies, but in the sense that one person or clique does not have absolute power. For example, if the President says we need to go to war, there is a balance in that the congress also has to approve it. Granted, the president and the congress are currently the same party, but the idea is meant to check the power of any one person or group. Even within the same party, it is meant to be a balance of power. Take FDR and Truman for example: both from the same party. Truman did major investigations to make sure that FDR and others were not profiteering from the war when he was Senator. Truman, the Senate, was checking and balancing the power that President had. Thats my 2 cents. What do you think? B$ |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by thomas on Nov 3rd, 2006, 10:40am on 11/03/06 at 10:35:18, BMoneeTheMoneeMan wrote:
I agree with all that you said, you have a clear picture of what it is supposed to be. Here is a diagram every one should have seen in the 8th or 9th grade. http://www.cyberlearning-world.com/lessons/checks.and.balances.chart.jpg |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by thomas on Nov 3rd, 2006, 10:41am This is the chart filled in. http://www.cyberlearning-world.com/lessons/checks.and.balances.chart.answers.jpg |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by imnotbub on Nov 3rd, 2006, 11:01am It's a simple interpretation that I use. Republicans believe that if you earn it you should keep it, Democrats seem to believe that the haves should give to the have nots. While taking care of the lesser fortunate of the country, or the world for that matter, is a noble endeavor, I think it should be a personal decision to whom your help will go and for how much. This is only one little piece of a bigger picture. Foreign policy, Federal intervention in State business, just to name a few, are a couple of issues that I reserve the right to disagree with the Republican leadership over. I have no qualm voting for someone from 'the other party', if I like what they stand for and how they present themselves. But, to answer the original question, I am a Republican because of the way I interpret the basic philosophy. Steve |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by vig on Nov 3rd, 2006, 11:43am Right, I see all that Thomas and always figured so. The question is, above all, is the President the one that trumps all. I didn't think so. I thought they were all on equal footing. The current president seems to believe it DOES. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by BMoneeTheMoneeMan on Nov 3rd, 2006, 11:43am on 11/03/06 at 11:01:47, imnotbub wrote:
I think you have that twisted, bro. Republicans seem to think we need to help the less fortunate in Iraq while Democrats seem to think we should re-kindle the war on terror. You are right, though, the republicans dont want to pay for it. I think you are also right when you say that we should choose who we help and how much money to spend. Those that want a war in Iraq should pay for it......oh, but you said republicans want to keep all the money they earn. Wait a minute......if republicans think Americans should keep all their money and not pay taxes, how would the government operate? |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by thomas on Nov 3rd, 2006, 11:50am on 11/03/06 at 11:43:02, vig wrote:
Actually during war-time the president is granted a few more powers as time is of the essence when dealing with soldiers lives, and command decisions need to happen quickly. But yes, they are all supposed to be equal. This president doesn't have the charisma to use the bully pulpit like Ronaldus Magnus. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by imnotbub on Nov 3rd, 2006, 3:10pm on 11/03/06 at 11:43:24, BMoneeTheMoneeMan wrote:
The Republicans in power want to help the Iraqis, and actually I don't think that they want to help anybody but themselves. As for not paying taxes, I don't think anybody thinks that you can not pay taxes, I would just like to see my tax money go to things closer to home. Police, Fire, Sanitation, Home security. Of course now we are back to individual interpretaion of home security. Some think bombing Baghdad is the answer, some don't. I for one don't. But niether is building a fence between the US and Mexico. As you can see it gets really convaluded. I didn't want to get into a civics disscussion, I was just answering a simple question. I am a Republican because I want to keep as much of what I earn as possible and I always thought the mindset of the party was to let that happen. Steve |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Jonny on Nov 3rd, 2006, 3:24pm http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M6Bz_r5CZTk |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by BarbaraD on Nov 3rd, 2006, 3:41pm Cute Jonny.... [smiley=laugh.gif] Hugs BD |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Charlie on Nov 3rd, 2006, 5:07pm Actually, the Presidency gained a great deal more power after WWII because of the cold war. A good thing at the time, I guess. Not so sure now http://www.kolobok.wrg.ru/smiles/remake/crazy.gif?SSImageQuality=Full Charlie |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Woobie on Nov 3rd, 2006, 6:48pm on 11/03/06 at 08:58:53, thomas wrote:
It's OK Thomas - I know......... :-* and yes - that's what I learned in American Government class, and History class, and western civ.......and Economics. I've seen that chart many times...... LOL I was saying that my dad used to call it that..... he liked it when we had a republican in the white house and a democratic congress (or vice versa) - he used to call it checks and balances......... BUt - I also believe that the term can be used both ways...... I mean - why not?? LOL I personally dont want any party to have absolute power.... (well, unless they're libertarian.. ;;D) |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Tata on Nov 4th, 2006, 1:37am I don't know why I'm a Republican, but I do know how you can tell I am one. Because I LIKE America--despite her flaws. Because I am proud to be an American and feel no need to apologise for it. Because I don't believe that somehow it's my fault that some P.o.S gang banger kills a bunch of kids with his drugs and guns--and gets to blame it on society. Because I think we need to revise all this BS about illegal immigrants--it's gone way too far. Because I don't believe that if you work for my company that I should be forced to keep paying you for doing shoddy work just because you have the protection of a labor union. Because I don;t agree with the ACLU about NAMBLA. Because I think violent sexual offenders and all child molesters should be imprisoned for life or, barring that, have their crime tattooed across their faces so they can't anonymously walk among us. Because I don't think 9-11 is our fault. Because I believe the terrorists aren't going to stop--ever. Because I know that the Middle-East Muslims would love nothing more than me voting a Democratic President into office. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by BMoneeTheMoneeMan on Nov 4th, 2006, 2:23am on 11/04/06 at 01:37:32, Tata wrote:
Thats a pretty long list of talking points, straight from karl rove's desk. You sound like his target audience. B$ |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by vig on Nov 4th, 2006, 8:51am on 11/04/06 at 01:37:32, Tata wrote:
another straw man. do you honestly believe other Americans want that? seriously, do you believe that? Just because I disagree with the president, does that mean I want terrorists talking without us listening in? I just want a warrant. Are you somehow implying that if I'm not a Republican, I'm for NAMBLA? are you serious? or that if I'm not a Republican, I DON'T like America? are you serious? Who DOES believe 9-11 was our fault? anyone? really? And as far as blaming society, just what is Mark Foley doing by checking into an alcohol/drug rehab clinic and revealing his church-born molestation? accepting personal responsibility? or trying to blame something else? |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by E-Double on Nov 4th, 2006, 9:09am I think everyone needs to read Walden Two ;) |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican Post by deltadarlin on Nov 4th, 2006, 10:04am Walden Two describes a fictional community designed around behavioral principles. The fictional utopian commune thrives on a level of productivity and happiness of its citizens far in advance of that in the outside world due to its practice of scientific social planning and the use of operant conditioning in the raising of children. Walden Two champions a lifestyle that doesn't foster competition and social strife and doesn't support war. It favors and encourages a lifestyle of minimal consumption, rich social relationships, personal happiness, satisfying work and leisure. The community is minimally consuming and minimally polluting, and it is egalitarian in the division of work. Its most controversial aspect is the communal raising of children and the educational system, which teaches patience and how to handle destructive emotions such as jealousy along with normal academic subjects. and this little tidbit form the book "It is now widely recognized that great changes must be made in the American way of life [...] The choice is clear: either we do nothing and allow a miserable and probably catastrophic future to overtake us, or we use our knowledge about human behavior to create a social environment in which he shall live productive and creative lives and do so without jeopardizing the chances that those who follow us will be able to do the same. Something like a Walden Two would not be a bad start. " |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republic Post by maffumatt on Nov 4th, 2006, 10:13am social engineering.... don't like the sound of that, |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by kcopelin on Nov 4th, 2006, 10:18am I have a solution to our political situation as it stands now. It is ingeniuos, absolutely unlikely but would probably make a difference. Here goes: 1. No more elections. Public office would be determined by the same random process as jury selection (without the interogative). This would apply from the President all the way down to our local county council. Disqualifiers would include violent criminal background, untreated mental illness, physical illness that will impede your ability to work 12 hour days and age -(gotta be between 21 and 100). So, you or I would blithely open our mailbox one day and find the following letter : Dear newly chosen official, Congratulations! You have been randomly chosen for the position of Vice President of the United States. Your term begins in six months. During this six months, you should be getting your affairs in order. Your salary will be $50,000 a year. If this is considerably less than you are accustomed to, you may want to start learning to pinch pennies. If it is considerably more than you are accustomed to, don't get too excited-it's expensive to live in D.C. You will have the following benefits: 12 paid holidays per year, 15 paid sick days, health insurance provided by an HMO, and a retirment fund, if you choose. You must pay into both the medical and retirement fund. If you chose to have domestic assistance for your residence you must hire them yourself. You will be reimbursed for milage at the rate of .35 per mile. You must use your own vehicle. We will provide protection for you and your family. Your term is for two years. If, for any reason you feel that you cannot meet this obligation you must contact the Attorney General at once. Sincerely, Your buddies in Washington Now come on, ya gotta agree this would end professional politics, bring refreshing ideas and energy to our government, put real people in positions and make use of the checks and balance system absolutely essential (So Bubba from S.C. doesn't decide he wants the south to do it again (No flames-I'm from SC and some of my best friends are named Bubba). Also, as Standard Operating Procedure, any conference or meeting that involved discussion of starting a war, escalating one in progress, attacking another country must be conducted while all members are holding tiny sleeping babies in their arms, preferably their own. If I was King of the Jungle.... kathy P.S. I'm now an Independent because the Governator is a Republican. |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by BarbaraD on Nov 4th, 2006, 10:38am I'm supporting Kinky Friedman for gov of Texas (yes, I still vote in Texas) and hope people will get out and vote. He's got some good "common sense" ideas on education, taxes, deadbeats, etc. If people can get over the "Jew-boy" bit, we could have a governor woth bragging about. It would help if politicking didn't start until 30 days BEFORE the election. And put a cap on spending (say $50,000 for state and national). And of course term limits. And anyone who runs a negative ad is disqualified immediately. Voting records are ok, but personal stuff is taboo.... (I really don't care who did what with who's wife or who said what when they were 18). Then we need to cut out all the welfare programs and FIND jobs for everyone (and some of those on disability are a whole lot more able to work than me, but I get up every morning and go to work to support those deadbeats who don't WANT to work!) Send illegals home and put our KIDS to work (it'll do them good - teach them what an education really means). Bring back the draft - it gives kids some discipline (two years of serving their country and they might know who the president is and would find out that the real world is not made for their pleasure. I really liked Clinton cause when he told you to go to hell, he could make you look forward to the trip. Bush can't even put a sentence together correctly. People call Clinton a liar because of Monica (I think he was just trying to protect his rear from Hillary) but Bush has been lying about things that matter and has gotten us into a war and not even going after the bums who actually were RESPONSIBLE for 9-11. Like Harry Truman said, "The Buck Stops Here!" on the president's desk. Quit spreading blame around and staryt thinking folks before we lose our country and have a dictatorship just like Iraq. Hugs BD |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by Charlie on Nov 4th, 2006, 11:47am Bring back the draft? An old deceased friend of mine, who was a raging liberal and lied so at 15 he could get a job at Gruman Aircraft during WWII, said something I have thought about for years. He contended that a draft is a healthy thing in the long run because it forces people to be in the army that don't want to be there, such as rich kids, kids of politicians, Ivy Leagurers and others that like America but either need to learn how to defend it and also how to keep the defenders on our side rather than a handy thing for banana republic style and potential fascist leaders from using it against their own people. It would keep the army smaller and more responsible. He thought it dangerous to have it consist of only of those who want to be there, perhaps because there was no more room in some crackpot militia or the like. WWII was the best example of true patriots doing their part and then getting out when the emergency was over to let the country resume its admired place in the world. It's a compelling arguement in many ways. Quote:
Wouldn't it be nice? You underestimate these bottom feeders. There are caps on campaign funding all over the place so the money for...especially the sleaziest commercials... comes from out of state and private interests that get around these things. It's fascinating in a gut wrenching fashion. Quote:
One form of 'buck" does stop there unless it's for awarding no-bid contracts to the greediest people to make lots of money doing the most basic services to the military. Even the Marines pay outsiders to do stuff like laundry. It ain't good that Halliburton and its ilk are allowed to charge for, rather than contribute some of its services in a patriotic way. Not bloodly likely today. http://www.netsync.net/users/charlies/gifs/mad.gif Have to admire the ideas of the last couple of posts though. Fun to consider. Charlie |
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Title: Re: Serious question: Why are you a Republican? Post by tanner on Nov 4th, 2006, 12:03pm on 11/04/06 at 09:09:19, E-Double wrote:
E, Walden Two is my all time favorite book. I have bought and given away more copies of it than any other . I just re-read it myself a month ago. I have been reading it once a year since before you were born and I agree...Everyone should read it. I also read and give away copies of Siddhartha, both books help "center" me. I guess that makes me a Buddhist Commie. ....Tim Edited to add, I did not mean the "before you were born" to be condesending it's just that you are the same age as my son who I hope will be joining Barbara to vote for Kinky Friedman :) |
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