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Title: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by medic1852 on Feb 8th, 2006, 7:13pm http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,184261,00.html Next is part of the story. BROCKTON, Mass. — A first grader was suspended for three days after school officials said he sexually harassed a girl in his class by allegedly putting two fingers inside the girl's waistband while she sat on the floor in front of him. In my opinion I think the school went a little overboard. I might feel different if it were my little girl. I dont know, what are some of your thoughts? |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by E-Double on Feb 8th, 2006, 7:21pm Oh boy! I work with developmentally disabled children. I have a few kids that I transition into typical preschools and are near indiscriminable from the others. I see little boys and girls showing eachother their privates all the time. They are little kids!!!!!!!! It is innocent. They show, stare, touch....of course they are redirected yet it is not harrassment and it is not sexual. It would be different if a child did something g-d forbid, however that may be a sign that they are being abused and there is a need to investigate. I wasn't able to open the link so I do not know if there was in fact more to it. E |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by nani on Feb 8th, 2006, 7:24pm OK...I'll bite. ;;D The general rule when discussing "private-no touch" space with children is anywhere on the body that is covered by undies. While a suspension may have been extreme, I would have called the boy on that behavior. Anywhere inside pants is off limits. What I find most troubling is the girl feeling threatened enough she needed to report it. Was the boy not acting in an innocent way, or did the girl have reason to be over-sensitive? :-/ |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by Jonny on Feb 8th, 2006, 7:28pm " According to the Brockton school’s Web site, sexual harassment is defined as “repeated, unwanted, or unwelcomed verbalisms or behaviors of a sexist nature related to a person’s sex or sexual orientation. In addition sexual harassment includes unwelcomed sexual advances, requests for sexual favors, and other verbal or physical conduct of a sexual nature.” PC idiots run amock!!!....Along with major CYA! Edit to add:....OMFG!! "The principal told Dorinvil the girl complained to the teacher after her son touched the girl's waistband, hitting her skin, in a room full of children." What next, one kid per class room? ::) |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by medic1852 on Feb 8th, 2006, 7:29pm For those of you that cant open the link...here is the rest of the story, it is all the information I have. BROCKTON, Mass. — A first grader was suspended for three days after school officials said he sexually harassed a girl in his class by allegedly putting two fingers inside the girl's waistband while she sat on the floor in front of him. The boy's mother, Berthena Dorinvil, said she "screamed" about last week's suspension from Downey Elementary School, and added her son doesn't know what sexual harassment is. "He doesn't know those things," she told The Enterprise of Brockton. "He's only 6 years old." School officials declined comment to The Enterprise, citing the child's age. "They would have not suspended the child without doing an investigation," said spokeswoman Cynthia McNally. Dorinvil said the school principal, Diane Gosselin, called her to pick up her son Jan. 30. She said her son asked the principal if the police were going to come get him. The principal told Dorinvil the girl complained to the teacher after her son touched the girl's waistband, hitting her skin, in a room full of children. Dorinvil said her son told her he touched the girl's shirt, not her skin, after the girl touched him. "He was playing with her," Dorinvil said. |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by chewy on Feb 8th, 2006, 8:20pm I think an explanation as to why that type of touching is innapropriate would have sufficed. Another case of over board political correctness. Now instead of a kid who understands after an explanation you have a paranoid and confused kid. Which is probably the hisory of the school principal. |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by E-Double on Feb 8th, 2006, 8:31pm on 02/08/06 at 20:20:39, chewy wrote:
The problem is this. Here is a basic principle of learning theory. The effects of punishment are short lived! Period. You can not punish a behavior without teaching what the appropriate behavior is. Morons just placed a stigma upon another child. |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by thebbz on Feb 8th, 2006, 8:33pm "He was playing with her," Dorinvil said. You all remember dirty doctor? LOL Common sense ain't so common. jb |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by Sean_C on Feb 8th, 2006, 8:38pm We are assuming we know all the facts but we really don't know jack to be honest. If we're guessing here and you were the principal lets throw this into the equation. What "if" that same child was warned on many occasions to "NOT" do this type of behaviour and he continued to do it anyway. On top of that what if his parents refused to discipline him on this type of behavior. Would the principle have been wrong then? What if it was your daughter and she kept coming home crying saying he won't stop doing this to her and she was scared and didn't want to go to school anymore. Would you still think they made the wrong descision? I don't know the facts but I'm sure the school knew the reprocussions of the suspention. I'm sure it wasn't an impulse thing on the principals part. JMHO Sean............................................ (sp) |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by Charlie on Feb 8th, 2006, 8:40pm Ya gotta wonder.... These are the same idiots that won't leave their kids alone. Too damn much supervising. Let them have time to do stuff like this. They are little kids doing what little kids have done since the beginning of time. Morons. It's the adults that need a good hiding here. http://www.netsync.net/users/charlies/gifs/tantrum.gif Charlie |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by chewy on Feb 8th, 2006, 8:46pm Seeing how the school admin. is taking the moral high road shouldn't they make the kid register as a sex offender? Seans right though. We dont know all the facts. I would like to hear the girl's parents position on all of this. |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by Sean_C on Feb 8th, 2006, 8:56pm I'm gonna be honest here, my daughters 7. If she was having this happen in school and she thought it was funny she probably wouldn't be upset and she more than likely wouldn't tell me either. However if she was upset or annoyed by it I know she would. Kids have that breaking point where somethings wrong here and this isn't fun anymore. If this kid was seriously trying to cuff a feel all the time (regardless of what the press leads us to believe) then something should be done. I could care less if he's 7 too. If your kid touches my kid inappropriately and I tell you to tell your kid to stop and he continues, then I look at it as you've been officially warned and anything goes after that. I can reverse that also. If my son was doing that to that little girl and he knew it was bothering her and continued to do it anyway, his asss would be candy apple red for a month. There's certain things that just can't happen regardless of a girls age. I'm sure the little girl felt violated even at 6. I feel sorry for her and her family. Sorry Sean........................................... |
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Title: Sounds ridiculous. Post by Richr8 on Feb 8th, 2006, 8:57pm But, with the media spin, who knows. |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by BarbaraD on Feb 8th, 2006, 9:00pm I still say they should take sex ed out of the classrooms and put it back behind the bleachers where it belongs... worked good enough for us back in the old days -- we didn't even know about "sexual harrasment" or political correctness and there wasn't near as many little girls getting pregnant. course we didn't have 24 hours of TV news back then either - telling us all the bad things everyone in the world was doing. We had to wait for the paper to come out and then maybe read about "some" of the things that were happening in the world. Schools, in my opinon, are getting so politically correct these days, they're forgetting they're there to TEACH kids about reading, writing and 'rithmatic. Hugs BD |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by blood_Redd_son on Feb 8th, 2006, 9:02pm this is just me, but that is yiffin wrong in my opinion |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by broomhilda on Feb 8th, 2006, 9:10pm Sean, don't be sorry I totally agree with you. We do not know all the facts or information leading up to the event, he could have done this before or had been intrusive in other ways. Lets also bear in mind we do not know either family history :-/ I don't know if its "like "it is told in the story then yes too extreme however media is media, plain and simple... ps- reverse genders a bit, my friends daughter age 6 had another child age 6 put her fingers in this girls pants, now should that warrant suspension? I don't know, back to my corner |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by Jonny on Feb 8th, 2006, 9:12pm on 02/08/06 at 20:56:49, Sean_C wrote:
Yeah, and in ten years it will be a three year old that fucking feels PC violated! Did you ever hear of this 25/30 years ago.....40 years ago? Its all PC bullshit!!.....COVER YOUR ASS!!!! Im not saying it dosent happen, but WTF?......A six year old?....who cant even probably get a hardon? I wish someone in the media today would ask Ted Kennedy why he left that woman to drown! |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by Jonny on Feb 8th, 2006, 9:17pm on 02/08/06 at 21:10:42, broomhilda wrote:
Or she could have been a six year old ho, right? Thats going on your post ;;D |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by chewy on Feb 8th, 2006, 9:20pm Quote:
No but that doesn't mean it wasn't happening. 40 years ago if a young male displayed patterns innaproprite sexual behavior he was sent off to the seminary. Could explain a lot of recent events in the Archdioces of Boston. |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by broomhilda on Feb 8th, 2006, 9:20pm Hummm nope ;;D She was being sexually abused at home and had no idea what was appropriate or not...just adding to the idea that we may not know the whole story! |
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Title: Unbelievable! Post by Richr8 on Feb 8th, 2006, 9:20pm They are six years old! What is wrong with us? It isn't possible that anywhere near the facts are printed if this really happened. If this could possibly been construed as a problem, than discipline may have been in order. Discipline=To teach |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by Sean_C on Feb 8th, 2006, 9:34pm on 02/08/06 at 21:12:35, Jonny wrote:
What are you sayin? If your daughter tells you that some kid at school keeps grabbin her snatch and he won't stop that your gonna tell her "don't worry sweety he probably can't get a hard-on anyway so its ok? You'd be kickin that kids fathers ass up and down that school hallway and you know it. I know you better than that dude, you'd be a freakin mental case just like me ;;D Now that would make good press ;;D I ain't opening this thread anymore, its all yours ;;D Sean............................ |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by Cerberus on Feb 8th, 2006, 9:36pm I don't care much for Fox News, My Girls are 15 and 11 The eldest, I know is sexually active, or at least sexually experimenting I take that for a given, I have expressed my feelings on it, I believe Woobs has and its now her on her to make the ultimate decisions. The youngest is just now starting to get into boys but she is still too immature yet to be of much concern. That said, the story basically gives NO account of the girls perspective and nor parental perspective, so we really don't know what happened or if anything did or didnt happen between these two previous to this. If Sean C is correct in his theory then I agree with the suspension. If this is merely an attempt to force school policy with no withstanding background or incident then no, I completely disagree with the suspension. the kids are the ones losing learning time on this, a shame really. 'Bus |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by Jonny on Feb 8th, 2006, 10:01pm on 02/08/06 at 21:34:32, Sean_C wrote:
My daughter is 24 years old Sean......no one ever said this kid even grabbed any crotch. more like touched her waist with his finger. With his finger!.....are you going nuts on this as a parent? |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by Sean_C on Feb 8th, 2006, 10:25pm on 02/08/06 at 22:01:30, Jonny wrote:
I think I did, don't be pissed, I get stupid and I ain't afraid to admit it. I went way off base dude, sorry. :( I think I need sleep :( Nite folks, Sean............................... |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by floridian on Feb 8th, 2006, 10:25pm Yes, its going overboard. Odds are really good that a six or seven year old is naive and an explanation/scolding would suffice. Too bad this isn't the good ole days when common sense ruled and when sister Mary would have dealt with it by beating the crap out of little Johnny with a ruler. That'd teach him. |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by chewy on Feb 8th, 2006, 10:54pm Quote:
Its local news here. The boys mothers perspective is all over the news via interviews. She basically says her son is in an emotional paranoid state of confusion. Thinks his mother is calling the police on him every time she picks up the phone but dont know why. Dont understand why he cant go back to school. Makes me wonder if ANYBODY has taken the time to sit down with the kid and explain things to him. |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by burnt-toast on Feb 9th, 2006, 7:11am We drill into our children's heads (I know we did), that "unwanted touching" needs to be immediately reported. We do this primarily to protect them from sexual predators - adults with sick minds - that prey of innocent children. As they grow these discussions expand to include their peers as well. I assume this is why the girl correctly reported what she felt was inappropriate. Sean's correct, we don't have all the information but as reported it appears this was nothing more than normal innocent 6 year olds at play. I am certain that teachers/administrators at this school are trained to handle these situations. Unfortunately, these supposedly highly educated educators handled this situation like confused children. My major concerns stem from a 6 year old asking if the police "were going to come get him". What in God's name were adults telling this poor 6 year old that he believed had had done something so wrong that the police were going to arrest him? Way overboard in my opinion and a display of what I see as paranoid behavior by ill prepared educators in charge. Talking with the children - with their parents present - explaining what was inappropriate and why and letting them get on with being 6 year olds would have been appropriate. Instead it is quite possible we have left two innocent 6 year olds very confused and possibly an entire class room of 6 year olds very confused. When we start expecting normal 6 year olds to adhere to adult rules of political correctmess we've stopped allowing children to grow and learn to interact as normal children and are creating confused adolescents and adults. Tom |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by BarbaraD on Feb 9th, 2006, 8:04am And what happens when the kid comes back to school and the other kids start teasing him... [smiley=huh.gif] Next he'll get sent home for defending his "honor". The damn teachers need to be sent home. some of these teachers need to get a good dose of COMMON SENSE in dealing with KIDS! But it goes right back to the parents.... When mine was that age I was at the school so much the principal offered to put me a desk in. If something happened I didn't like, the school board was my next visit and if they didn't get it solved I had a hot line to the board of education in Austin. some of the parents sat back and said, "Teachers know best!" That just never was my attitude - most of them didn't even have any kids - why would THEY know best? They were there to "TEACH" my child NOT raise him. Sorry for the rant, but stuff like this just makes me angry. Six year olds are just curious and they do things that are "common" for six year olds. When "grown ups" start acting like little kids about it, THEY need to be censored NOT the kids - just because the grown ups have the "authority" is no reason to pick on the kids. Too bad I ain't that mother..... There would probably be a principal looking for a job at McDonalds! Hugs BD |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by deltadarlin on Feb 9th, 2006, 8:09am My daughter was in the second grade (that would have put the kids between 7-8 years old). One of her little classmates kept putting his hands up under her skirt and making comments. She took the matter into her own hands and rather than telling the teacher, she told the little boy's daddy. Don't know what happened but the little idiot never touched her again. that was 14 years ago. Has anyone listened to what some of the kids that age are talking about now? Kids today are being exposed to *sex* and everything else at a younger and younger age. Don't ever think that because a kids is 6 or 7 that they don't *know* what they are doing. They might not have the concept of *right or wrong* figured out, but that doesn't mean they can't do something wrong. 'darlin |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by maffumatt on Feb 9th, 2006, 8:20am I had to pull my daughter out of school when she was in 3rd grade, she matured early and was constantly groped at school by the same 3 or 4 kids. They wrote her notes ( that we kept) asking her to show them her body parts ect.....We complained to the teacher first, the principle next, then the superintendent, then the schoolboard. All that was done was that the teacher moved her to the front of the class. We heard "boys will be boys" so many times it was sickening. For a month she came home every day crying. The last straw was when one of the kids tried to pull her shirt off and ripped it almost all the way off, the school called and told us we needed to bring her a shirt. The punishment for the kid ? Lunch dentention. I told them to screw off and I pulled her out of school that day and home schooled her for the remainder of that year and all of the next. |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by Drk^Angel on Feb 9th, 2006, 10:18am I agree with burnt... Why does the kid think his mom is gonna call the police on him? What has he been told, and by whom, that has him so paranoid. I doubt that it was the school that told them about the police comin' to get him. I agree with Sean... We don't know the whole story. Could be an on going problem... Could be the kid did more than just touch her shirt... Could be the kid is known for causing trouble in general. How about this... This isn't an issue about political correctness. The kid wasn't punished for doing something "sexual". He was punished for "harassing" the girl. He was inappropiately touching the girl which made her uncomfortable enough to notify the teacher of his actions. The method of harassment was classified as sexual based on the location he was touching. It's common for schools to have specific sexual harassment rules to include fairly unsexual actions. Hell... I once got suspended for sexual harassment because I snapped a girl's brastrap on the school bus. If the kid had been punished for doing something directly sexual, he would likely have been expelled for sexual assault. Also... You assume that a 6 year old wouldn't know anything about sex, unless they were being sexually abused. This is not always the case. I don't know about the neighborhood in which this kid is growing up, but when I was around that age, my friends and I routinely joked about sex, and who wanted to F-U-C-K who, and it wasn't unheard of for kids in my neighborhood to be experimenting with sexual situations. Lots and lots of variables... Very easy to jump on the anti-PC train, hootin' and hollerin' for justice... But mayhaps things aren't always as they may first appear. PFDAN.................................... Drk^Angel |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by r_headache on Feb 9th, 2006, 11:33am I know why the news is reporting that this kid is paraniod....because the mother is getting her ducks in row for a major lawsuit against the school. |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by fubar on Feb 9th, 2006, 4:17pm on 02/09/06 at 11:33:16, r_headache wrote:
ding ding ding ding ding Get that man a prize! |
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Title: Re: Is This a Little Overboard? Post by Sandy_C on Feb 9th, 2006, 5:16pm on 02/08/06 at 21:20:03, chewy wrote:
No, 40 years ago, what this little 6 year old boy did was not considered innapropriate sexural behavior. It was normal behavior for a 6 year old boy who has just realized that there is a difference between him and a little girl. He touched her back at the waistband, and the article said that the boy claimed he did this "after the girl touched him". Both children, and I repeat the word CHILDREN, are learning about their differences. It is absolutely normal. It is not sexual, and it is certainly not sexual harrassment. All that needed to happen is 1) principal reports to both sets of parents what happened; 2)parents talk with their kiddies explaining that they cannot touch each other under their clothing or in their private parts: 3) problem solved. This "politically correct" world we are living in now is causing more problems than it corrects. Off soapbox again Sandy |
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