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Title: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by Apple on Dec 8th, 2004, 3:05pm This topic is very embarassing/upsetting for me. It is probably more appropriate for the female members here, but I would appreciate all replies. Several months ago I started having problems with my appointments at the neurologist. I've been getting tongue twisted and have more than my usual problems with word finding. I'm on Topamax and some of this is related to the s/e's of the medication. I think sub-conconsciously I'm paranoid that this guy has way too much power over me. For example, one time he stopped giving me my Imitrex prescriptions because I have high blood pressure, but later changed his mind because my blood pressure is in perfect control. But the experience really shook me up. He is said to be the best neurologist in town for migraines and I'm not too interested in seeing another doctor. When I have visited others, I seem to know just as much as they do or more...and that is a scarey thought! The power thing messes up my head. Anyway, I've been bitching about the Topamax and when he sees that I'm a mute (or worse) during our appointments he is now concluding that I'm bordering on retarded. I don't want to tell him that it's partially due to the fact that I've become intimidated by him. I know this because when I go to female doctors I'm fine. What's REALLY bugging me, is that the other day I had to go to a DIFFERENT MALE DOCTOR. To my SHOCK AND HORROR, I was a DEAF MUTE AGAIN. This new guy now thinks I'm a RETARD. If I get nervous, well, that's it folks. I check out. And male doctors seem to really do it to me. Anyone else have this or a smililar experience? Are neurologists in particular intimidating? HOW CAN I MAKE IT STOP? |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by thomas on Dec 8th, 2004, 3:09pm See a counselor (female). You need to get control of this. just my two cents. :-/ |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by Jonny on Dec 8th, 2004, 3:15pm As soon as you walk in the office kick him in the balls, once he's on his knees you will be in control ;;D |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by Linda_Howell on Dec 8th, 2004, 3:16pm Quote:
Please don't take this wrong, but your Dr. was correct in not giving you Imitrex at that time. He very well may be intimidating to you but I don't think it should be for this reason. If Cat or Roxy see this post, I'm sure they will agree with me and tell you their experiences. I too am uncomfortable around male Dr.s too. It's not just you hon. One of the side effects of Tompomax is just what you described. There's a reason we call it DOPEamax. Maybe you should ask him about that. Linda |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by Gator on Dec 8th, 2004, 3:23pm I think most people see doctors as some sort of "all knowing" entity. Some doctors seem to have a god complex in their own right. The more specialized, the greater the complex. The combination seems to seriously intimidate some people. If you can't get a handle on this by yourself, you may really need to consider seeing someone to help you work through it. As a clusterhead, it is very important that you be able to stand up and say what's on your mind and even direct your treatment as necessary. Otherwise, you will just wallow around in pain due to ineffective treatment. There are also psychological implications if you do not address this. IMHO, of course. Gator |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by Apple on Dec 8th, 2004, 3:25pm Linda, I know all about that and "kinda, sorta agree." It's just that this went on for MANY months even though my blood presure responded beautifully and immediately to my blood pressure medication. Never went up one iota. But he did have his reasons. I have to admit. He's just conservative. He's also happier now because I put him in charge of my BP instead of a cardiologist. With him having more control of it, I'm sure he feels safer. I think at first he didn't believe that I had a lot of dulling with the Topamax and now ironically he might feel I have MORE than I really HAVE. I don't know how in the world I'm going to correct this or if I should bother. I certainly don't want him to lower my dosage based on this particular factor. He probably wonders how I can tie my shoes! It's odd having someone in charge of the PAIN situation in your life. Gator: I've tried directing my treatment a little with my doctor, but he doesn't always appreciate it . I get mixed input. I've done a lot of research on migraines and sometimes he seems to like this but lately I think it is bugging him! I've even been asked to write a colum starting in Jan. at a website. I think he's at a loss as to what to do with me because Topamax works so well for me, but I'm getting a lot of s/e's with this medication. There are medical reasons why nothing else is going to work for me. He prides himself at being successful (great rep) and I could be frustrating him. He's a very good doctor...so I'm hoping that will win out and I'll still get good care! |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by vig on Dec 8th, 2004, 3:28pm the doctor patient relationship is pretty complicated and in our case, it HAS to work. It can't be dysfunctional. Keep looking until you find one that suits you. |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by john_d on Dec 8th, 2004, 3:32pm on 12/08/04 at 15:05:47, Apple wrote:
I may be way off but it sounds like you just don't trust male authority figures, there is probably an experential reason for it. It is not that unusual and it does not make you abnormal in any way. I had a really bad experience with a school teacher as a child, to this day I have problems with any teacher authority, it caused me problems in college when I started giving a crap about my grades. Hope that helps, disclaimer that I am thinking like a man so I could be way off. |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by nani on Dec 8th, 2004, 3:39pm Hi Apple...welcome and I'm sorry you're here. I agree with Thomas and john about getting some counseling to deal with whatever happened to you. Odds are good you don't even remember what is was right now, and a counselor will help you with that. I also agree that drs are looked as as all knowing...which is a total load of crap. I have an MD brother in law that I've known since he was 8 yo. He is a total dork. He knows his stuff, but otherwise...total dork. I'm not sure if you can continue with this guy without addressing this. I prefer women docs, too. There are so few neurologists in NM that I have no choice. At least my guy reminds me of Mr Rogers. :) |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by lionsound on Dec 8th, 2004, 4:07pm Hi Apple, First of all it is not a problem with YOU, as in something wrong, that you may not feel comfortable around male docs. It's just the way you are and you learn can work with it. I have and continue to do so. Most neuro's I've met are pompous a$$holes. There are a few that I knew were knowledgeable, but passed them up because I felt the communication would be poor. I felt I wasn't being heard. Maybe it was me, maybe the doc...bottom line was it wouldn't work and I went elsewhere. on 12/08/04 at 15:25:52, Apple wrote:
And I have also learned that I need to be in charge of the pain in my life. You need to be in charge! You can do it! We can help!:) Doctors are only human beings. I have about ten friends that are docs (no neuros, damn it.) And they all encourage me to be proactive and lead the way in that doc's office. Last time I went to the HA specialists office I just imagined everyone from this place sitting in the waiting room cheering me on(it was really crowded)......that helps too! :) Hope some of this helps(PM me if you need to), be well, Lionsound |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by echo on Dec 8th, 2004, 4:19pm Do you have a trusted friend or family member that can go with you to the next appts and speak in your behalf when you go mute? |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by Jonny on Dec 8th, 2004, 4:20pm on 12/08/04 at 16:19:44, echo wrote:
Thats a damn good idea, Echo!! |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by Sylvan on Dec 8th, 2004, 4:33pm Apple: A few things i've learned when dealing with various Dr's over the years. First and foremost: You HIRED them. YOU are ultimately in charge. If they do not perform their jobs to YOUR satisfaction - fire them and hire a different one. Second - if you are not comfortable discussing what is going on with your Dr. -- see #1. You need to have a neurologist whom you can communicate with and who will listen to your concerns and explain when they make a treatment decision that you do not agree with. When i've had to change doctors in my life - i have interviewed all of the likely candidates and HIRED the one who best suited my needs. If you think of the Dr or other care provider as your employee - it makes it a lot easier to take charge of your treatment. Note, this is not to imply that i think you should treat a Dr with disrepect or disdain - merely that you need to actively participate in the decisions that affect your health and your life. I frequently bring articles that i think may be pertinent with me to my Drs (including my veterinarian) - and they read them and give me their opinions on whether or not this particular research has any bearing on my case - and explains why it doesn't if i was off track. As to the gender of the Dr making a difference - i've got a GP who is a woman whom i trust implicitly - but her partners (1 woman, 2 men) i will not deal with. My OB-Gyn however is a man - and i doubt if i could find a better one anywhere. I've been going to him since i was old enough to need to - and my mother does too. If you truly are uncomfortable with men in authority - i would have to agree with seeking counseling. There is no shame in it - and it can truly help you to deal with things like this. PF wishes Sylvan |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by BarbaraD on Dec 8th, 2004, 5:19pm Echo has a good idea. If you can't speak up for yourself take someone with you who can. My ex has trouble telling the doc anything except "ok whatever you say." So I go with him and heaven help the doc that says something I disagree with. I told his neurologist that I'd been treating him for 44 years and he'd seen him a sum total of about an hour - now just being logical who did he think knew what was best for him? The neuro and I started getting along right after that. Never had that trouble with my neuro. He's great and actually listens to his patients and tells me if he doesn't know something (I think he lost his ego a long time ago - he's pretty much a regular guy - even writes me scripts for margaritas cause he has migraines and can't drink them so I have one for him after my appointment - it's our little joke - he really appreciates me doing it for him). Seriously, you do HIRE these guys, and you pay them - they work for you and should listen to you. They are NOT gods, but sometimes have to be reminded about that. Take someone with you until you get confident enough to talk to them. Actually I like male docs better than females - not enough room in an examining room for more than one bitch at a time (IMHO). Good luck on your next appt. Hugs BD |
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Title: Re: My problem with the Dr. Post by Apple on Dec 8th, 2004, 5:31pm Well, here's the thing. When I take my husband I'm a little better. I guess my husband makes me calmer. I'm not sure, there IS a change in dynamics. HOWEVER, what MIGHT be happening is that the Dr. seems a tad friendlier and more cooperative. This COULD be why I'm calmer. It's hard to say. What comes first, the chicken or the egg? If the Dr. different because I'm more communicative or am I calmer because the Dr. is friendlier? Who the hell knows? But, does seem more willing to write scipts when the hubby tags along. Of course, being a child of the 60s, I resent the hell out of this. I want to be my own woman and don't want hubby tagging along at every appointment like I'm some sort of child or worse RETARD. (sorry for the use of this word...but when you are on the dreaded Dopamax, you feel like one sometimes). There's no doubt about it, this guy DOES KNOW HIS STUFF. So, I'm trying to be patient. However, I do like the idea that I'm the boss. I think he should treat me with as much dignity as he does my husband. OTOH, if I'm not communicative, he probably is wondering how he is to treat a patient well who gives him one word or garbled answers. I have vascillated between being vocal with him and being rather passive...usually passive. What a mess! |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by marlin on Dec 8th, 2004, 5:36pm I echo echo's sentiment. Try and bring someone you trust along & knows the pain you go through. Who knows, perhaps you'll do just fine with someone on your side in the room to give you courage and THAT person can be then the mute. It's also possible that you're underestimating yourself and you're doing just fine in there. :) I wouldn't suggest trying to control the entire encounter, after all, you're there because he's the expert. You need him to be on your side to help you. Try and let go a little. And believe me, Ive had my share of dopey disinterested neuros so I can tell you having a good one you can trust makes a difference. |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by don on Dec 8th, 2004, 7:05pm Contact your local health clinic or counseling agency and ask for a referal to a patient advocate. |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by marlin on Dec 8th, 2004, 7:26pm Sorry, I didn't get to read the story about your husband tagging along. I'm sorry only because I wouldn't have wasted the effort of making a suggestion. Look, I was assuming you're in there to fix a pain problem - not a "I'm woman, hear me bore" problem. For that you don't need a neurologist. If you get better results with your husband in the room what's the problem? He's helpful enough to go with you the least you could do is be happy about it. geeze. |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by Apple on Dec 8th, 2004, 7:37pm No problem. I OFTEN take my husband with me. He will always go if I have a bad pain problem and often go if it's covenient for him to do so. If I happen to have a regularly scheuled appt. and I'm in good shape, he might not go. I'm fortunate that he doesn't mind going. The doc is actually very nice...it's more of a communication and perception issue. I do NOT bore the doc with my problems. There are days that I'm very tight lipped actually. |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by Charlie on Dec 8th, 2004, 9:52pm Well....he's a neurologist. These guys are a different breed. It's the kind of specialty where they assume everybody is an idiot. They may have a point. I mean seriously, how often do you stand around the water cooler talking about neurology? Clusterheads, however know more than he, she, or it. They hate that. Some time ago, I found that my guy had some kind of heart attack (he's a little Indian twerp and about 35. You never think of these guys having heart trouble) and won't admit it. He knows I know and I think that it knocked him down a peg. He is developing a sense of humor. It helps if you know something about these guys. Anything really. It makes them human. It can be frustrating for them too as so many of their patients don't fully recover. It ain't the flu. See if you can chat with him for a minute or so about something unrelated, it should help. Telling him the truth may work too. Just some ideas. Charlie |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by cootie on Dec 8th, 2004, 10:05pm Um.....I 'know' how you feel Apple......I really do !!! I am a supporter here but I have my own shit to deal with doc wise. I go in to see the doc and about panic in the room waiting......then when he walks in the room I can't remember what I wanted to say or how to say it rite. I stumble on my own words and I just KNOW I either look retarded or look like I 'want sumthing'. I hate it......it's like I am in some dominateing forces territory and I am the prey. Had an apt with a new doc today and I wanted to cancel so bad cuz I dreaded him walking in the room and be......a big stupid blank. I watch the nurses when bored sittin waiting and they make fun of people.....human nature I know......but I hate to turn my back on em......I feel like a big joke. I found that "writeing down what you want to say and how you want to say it or at least some sort of order of it all" helps. I tell the doc rite off the bat I am nervous when I go see them and can't think so.....rite up front I am explaining my behavior and am SURE they see it alot. The doc is in charge of your pain destiny and you must sell yourself well Pam |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by cschick on Dec 8th, 2004, 10:09pm it took me 3 years to finally talk to my MALE dr about female problems. I just couldn't get over the fact that he didn't have the same equipment as me. Finally did this past week and have gotten some peace of mind. This is what I do. I write down every question I have and take it in with me otherwise I forget/get nervous and don't remember what I needed to talk to him about. Karen who has been there done that |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by thebbz on Dec 8th, 2004, 10:21pm Hey Apple! Been there,all the advice above is very good. I didn't see any suggestion like...picture the guy sitting there in a duck suit or underwear.LOL Before you go create an agenda, write it down, eg...symtoms, potential drug therapies..ect. Your not the only one. Look him in the eye and be honest. Tell him what you have told us. If he cannot address the situation, I doubt he would be any better with your CH. Try to relax. All the best BB BTW: That goes for male and female neuros. |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by marlin on Dec 8th, 2004, 10:26pm on 12/08/04 at 21:52:27, Charlie wrote:
That's good advice about trying to get to know the doc. I think it helps if they're not booked so tight there's only 1min 24secs for you to cram a whole appt in. The way I see it is they probably don't like seeing HA patients. BORING to them. They want to see the guy with a watermelon sized tumor in his brain or someone with siezures, you know, something different that they can take MRIs of or whatever they do. All they can do for us is write trex prescriptions and then get on the insurance company's shit list for it. |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by BlueMeanie on Dec 8th, 2004, 11:18pm Lets' see... the guy is a doctor. He's a human being that went to school for years. He's not an alien. He's there to listen to you to see what your problem is. You're scared to talk, so you sit there and stare at him with nothing to say ? O.K., tell him you have Cluster Headaches. Give him a list of what you've already tried that didn't work, then ask him to give you something you haven't tried that might work. I don't see why you need someone to hold your hand for that. It's not like the guy is going to cut open your brain or anything. He's just a guy....... unless it's just a guy problem with you; than maybe you should see someone else to cure that problem. I know it does seam like you MAY know more than him, but I highly doubt it. As you already know, Cluster Headaches have no cure and no medicine works for all Cluster Headache patients. All you can do is keep trying to find something that works for YOU. SPEAK UP !!! |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by Gator on Dec 9th, 2004, 9:11am Don't feel bad about having your husband go with you. I'm a 41 year old man and I take my wife whenever she can go, simply because she sees things in my behavior that I may not see or that I may not remember. She also asks about things that she may be concerned about that never occurred to me to ask. My wife, my neuro and I make a good team in my treatment. Could be that this would be a good thing for you as well. Gator |
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Title: Working it out... Post by Apple on Dec 9th, 2004, 4:59pm Thanks guys. I certainly don't think I know more than he does! Heck no! This guy is as SMART as they come! Most of this problem is on my end. I know it can be worked out and you've given me some good ideas. |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by Cerberus on Dec 9th, 2004, 10:20pm Apple... Sound to me like guinea pig syndrome. I totally agree with the others especially with Vig and Echo Quote:
Then be your own woman and let your spouse help when he can...no shame! I thought that was supposed to be a part of a marriage....WTF [smiley=huh.gif] or is there something you arent telling us? no offense intended Ramon |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by nancyc on Dec 10th, 2004, 1:19am I can relate APPLE! I dont get so much tongue tied as frustrated with my Neuro Doc....He is such a control freak so he and I clash alot...I had the opportunity to speak my mind the other day about HIS ATTITUDE, while he was doing an epidural on my spine LOL...probably not the best time to tell him I did not feel I could communicate properly with him but I did it anyway! Been working on this speech for about three months now....Dont think being open with him really helped alot..he will forget we had the conversation by next month and try to play those controlling games again with me :D....I truly think it is common with Neuros....The one I see now is the most controlling Doc I have ever seen but he is good...So , I try to use alittle of my Psych. training on him LOL..Found out while he had me in the hospital last week, that all the nurses there hate him cause he thinks he is GOD! LOL.....Good luck! smiles,nancyc |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by RichardN on Dec 10th, 2004, 2:32am If you're not keeping a journal of your ha episodes, START now, tonight. Time, duration, KIP rating, abortive (if any) etc. Don't forget to list medications and when you take them. Doctors like flow charts and it indicates you ARE being and WILL BE proactive in YOUR treatment for YOUR pain. You don't have to yell, but on at least one occasion it helped get me my 02 and Verap. Copy pertinent info from this site and OUCH and others. Highlight the points that pertain to you. . . both symptoms and possible preventatives. They'll at least throw them in your file for possible later perusal, and you might get some real interest. Take a small (dictaphone type) tape recorder with you and don't hide it. You have it to help translate some of the medical jargon you might not quite understand and will help with questions you need to ask next time. Make sure you get copies of ALL reports, lab work etc. for your own files . . . . which of course will lead to more research here and elsewhere, figuring out what they say. I usually have the terms I'm not familiar with translated by medical friends. So . . . take your friend, your notes/questions, dictaphone, pertinent info, and get copies of everything. Remember - you have the option of using his services or not. Remember also, he really has to understand what he's treating . . . essential for both of you. PFDANs Richard |
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Title: Re: My problem with male Dr.'s Post by Jeepgun on Dec 10th, 2004, 9:28am Good advice, Richard. |
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