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Title: Imitrex Commercials Post by BlueMeanie on Apr 2nd, 2004, 8:40pm 1) Is Imitrex an offically approved Cluster Headache medicine ? 2) If it is, why doesn't the manufacturer mention that Imitrex not only works for Migraines, but also works for Cluster Headaches in their commercials ? I realize most people do not know what Cluster Headaches are, but what would be the harm in mentioning Clusters along with Migraines ? |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Lizzie2 on Apr 2nd, 2004, 9:21pm 1.) Yes 2.) No idea...probably just aiming to target the large audience.... We should write them and tell them to make a CH commercial...though I bet then people might think they have it when they don't. I hate those commercials!! Lizzie :) |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Melissa on Apr 2nd, 2004, 9:29pm on 04/02/04 at 21:21:28, Lizzie2 wrote:
THIS is why the zomig trial is so important!! If you haven't done so yet, click on the sticky thread about Zomig at the top of the board! ;;Dmel |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by jonny on Apr 2nd, 2004, 9:40pm We dont sell....at least not enough to mention. .......................................jonny |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Lizzie2 on Apr 2nd, 2004, 9:49pm Blue, I just looked in my drug manual to find the indications for sure: Almotriptan (Axert), Frovatriptan (Frova), Naratriptan (Amerge), Rizatriptan (Maxalt and Maxalt-MLT), Sumatriptan (Imitrex), and Zolmitriptan (Zomig, Zomig ZMT) are all indicated for migraine headaches. "Sumatriptan injection can be used for cluster headache." The only one missing from that list is Eletriptan (Relpax). I just got this book in November, too...so I don't know why Relpax isn't in it. Maybe it isn't advertised for CH because it is only the injectible form that is indicated for CH, and the ads target the pill form? I've never actually seen a commercial for Imitrex SC. Interesting, though.... Jonny...One time while back doing my CF research, a young boy asked why there was only interest in pursuing cancer research and not research for CF. It made me pretty sad. We all felt that the cancer research was, of course, valuable, but CF is the #1 fatal genetic disease among caucasions. It just doesn't attract as much attention or have as high a population group as pediatric cancer. Stupid, though..... >:( Lizzie |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by bobkip on Apr 2nd, 2004, 9:57pm jonny, you are wrong. The reason the fat cats at the drug cos. don't give a rats ass about us is $$$$$$$. It ain't quantity or even quality, it's the bottom line. Kip |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Charlie on Apr 2nd, 2004, 11:19pm Just ain't no money in mentioning clusters in a commercial. All that valuable time and space taken up by something no bringing in hard cash. Charlie |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Kevin_M on Apr 2nd, 2004, 11:55pm Wow, All really valid points. Yep, too small a market means directing expensive advertising at at small market. But I know my doc always has many freebies of imitrex to dole out, maybe that is where they have decided to expend themselves toward clusters, in the doctors office instead of to the general media audience on TV. I think the insurance companies are behind keeping it down for clusters as it would be very expensive to prescribe the amount needed for clusters and it would cost them too much. I know I'm very expensive to my insurance and they would be glad to not have many more like me. My insurance probably provided the cash flow to Glaxo due to paying my bill each month to Glaxo to have to spend on the commercial and they would not want to have more clusterheads like me to insure I'd guess. The insurance companies are waiting for the patent to run out on imitrex I'll bet. Few more years to go though. [smiley=twocents.gif] I called about the zomig trial, nothing in my area happening but they got my name and phone #. small market, big bill. Insurance solution: keep it small. ramble rousing ranting in the dark. Kevin M |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by thomas on Apr 5th, 2004, 8:02am We may be a small number of people, however many of us use 10-100 times as much medication as a meegraine person. I'll bet the bastards make more off of us. |
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Title: Sit up straight, class..... Post by Mr.Happy on Apr 5th, 2004, 11:10am (Just got off the blower with Cat....since she can't do CH.com or OUCH for the nonce......we went over the numbers they presented to Glaxo up in New England. The following calculations of mine are wrong, WAY on the low side........but since she can't jump in and correct my heathen arse, here ya go...) OK....lets do some math. The US population is currently a little over 290,000,000. At 0.4% prevalence, that's 1,160,000 potential customers. At $75 per stat dose, that's $87,000,000 Assume 30 doses per cycle, annually - $2,610,000,000 But......let's allow room for error in the math and usage. Cut that number in half - $1,305,000,000 Over ONE Billion, THREE HUNDRED Million annually in potential Glaxo bucks, conservatively speaking. It's not a market to sneeze at, and the drug boys are wising up to that fact thanks to Thelma and Louise. Even if you jack those numbers around using one $25 Trex tablet daily for 30 days, you're talking about a possible $870,000,000 market. That's why the Zomig folks want in on this action. Don't forget.....the above cyphering is based on the LOW side, and doesn't account for the WORLD market. Pull out your calculators, and check it yourself. One CHead is worth dozens of `Grainers, dollars and sense wise. We've got their attention. Advocacy in action, RJ |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Linda_Howell on Apr 5th, 2004, 11:24am When I started reading this thread I could't wait to post what you just posted Randy but you beat me to it. And put it a lot more eloquently than I could have, I might add. This is only my own thinking...but I'll bet us chronics spend more on Trex than 10 episodics do. Just something else to skew the results in GSK's favor. Thank you Thelma and Louise [smiley=bow.gif] LindaH |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Elaine on Apr 5th, 2004, 11:53am Randy your Right! We have to show them. That means when the drug companys offer studys such as the zomig study us clusterheads need to over load there phones letting them know we are here and want these studys. Volunteer . If only 12 or so call they won't think we are serious. We are getting there people but all of you have to help! How many of you called about the study? Its not to late. No its not imitrex but its a start :-)! |
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Title: Trex-O-Mercials Post by Mr.Happy on Apr 5th, 2004, 12:23pm on 04/05/04 at 11:24:46, Linda_Howell wrote:
We don't have to do much in the way of skewing, Lin. Heh. And don't let Cat know the numbers I'm using.......she'll have my hanging by my testicles on the Water X3 page, since her math was markedly higher in Potential Glaxo bucks. Let's try some chronic math, again on the low side. If 10% of all CHeads are chronic, that's 116,000 US consumers. If they use ONE injection weekly, that's 6,032,000 doses annually. At $75/shot, that's $452,400,000/year just in filthy chronics. Would all you chronics that only need to abort ONE CH/week please raise your hands? Billions and Billions, as dead Carl Sagen used to say.... RJ |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by catlind on Apr 5th, 2004, 2:51pm Ok I couldn't hold back, and Clark is going to have my A$$ for posting and reading! When Thelma and I were in New England for the meetings, during our meeting with the Glaxo folks, we were able to show them the $$ figures for just TWO sufferers. Thelma is chronic and can use up to 12mg (injections) per day. I'm Episodic and can use up to 6mg (injections) a day (cardiac issues). The drug companies don't care who pays them, us or insurance. Based on the cost of a box of 5 vials of trex injections ($325ish), TWO FEMALE clusterheads, used $10000 worth of imitrex in a 50 day period (normal 6t week period) SHIT CLARK JUST CAME HOME. (Clark just left for the store SHHHHHHHHHHHHHH) When the reps from Glaxo realized just how much we spend on their product, their eyes nearly popped out of their heads. On top of that, Dr. Sheftell informed them (the glaxo folks) that Clusterheads use triptans on a ratio of 30 to 1 over migraine sufferers. In addition to all this, Thelma and I did a sampling survey. We survey'd 12 chronics, and 12 episodics on the cost of their triptan use. Didn't matter what triptan, just how much on triptans. Some of you may remember participating. The average $$ figure per month spent by a clusterhead is around $7500 per PERSON. Now of course these figures on that particular survey are not scientific. The $10k figure Thelma and I use is - we pay it, trust me we know how much hehe. So, the pharmaceuticaly companies have discovered a market that is HUGE that they didn't realize was there and lining their pockets before. Part of all the new studies, new things in the future for OUCH (stuff we aren't at liberty to discuss yet) is because the pharm co's now understand how much money we spend on their products. Right now Imitrex is the ONLY FDA labeled triptan for CH. Read all your packet inserts, all but sumatriptan say "xxxxtriptan has not been evaluated for efficacy on treating cluster headaches". Hope I was able to clear some things up :) And I really gotta go again, I hear the van coming back and it's about a block away.............. [smiley=yikes.gif] (something about having been throwing up for 7 days straight has him worried or somethin...sheesh ;) ) Cat |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by thomas on Apr 5th, 2004, 2:55pm on 04/05/04 at 14:51:48, catlind wrote:
Back to bed with you!!!!!!!!! |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Tiannia on Apr 5th, 2004, 3:01pm on 04/05/04 at 14:51:48, catlind wrote:
But women dont get cluster.... Sorry could not help myself... You are busted Cat. Go relax and stop worrying. Clusterville will be here when you are allowed to turn on the Computer again. Rest adn relax (I know that is a new concept for you, but you need to do it) -Tia |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by catlind on Apr 5th, 2004, 3:57pm oh yeah, one more thing before I go, Thanks for lookin out for me - I really do love you guys :) Cat |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Kevin_M on Apr 5th, 2004, 5:38pm I have been using imtrex nasal for seven years and I DO know I alone have been over $20,000 a year. Maybe they don't advertise for us because they KNOW that sumatriptan is the only approved triptan for CH. What would be the estimated gain to them to advertise when most all doctors we see already know that. My gp didn't know crap before me, but he did know about imitrex as the recommended abortive. On the opposite side, advertising would make peeps REQUEST imitrex more as a remedy if they did KNOW it's status as FDA approved for CH. I see upside in that. In fact, if I was a new CHer, I would be persistant until I got it from my doc. And actually, the correct setup of O2 for clusters was harder to get from my doctor, insurance, and from the med supply companies. Upon verifying the math from above posts, I would push for clusters included in advertisement if the decsion (yeah sure) was mine. I like the idea of making these stats known, very good point. But why doesn't Glaxo already know this if they have multi-millions invested in marketing? What the heck are they thinking? I like these efforts. Thanks for bringing this all out in the open. It plain makes sense to me. I've found it a safe drug too when not overused. It has a good record, that could be an easy selling point too. WAKE UP GLAXO!!!! COMPETE FOR OUR BUSINESS. Good job all. Kevin M |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Melissa on Apr 5th, 2004, 5:55pm Quote:
Migraines and money. Millions of people get migraines. Less than 1% of the population get clusters. Sometimes even large corporations need someone on the outside to open a new door for their eyes to see what they've been missing. Who better than the sufferers themselves? They probably thought, that because the population of sufferers is so small, we wouldn't make a dent into their financial gain. Plus, pretty much all their money into advertising, goes to the larger population of migraine sufferers. Hell, if you talk in numbers around the WORLD of migraine sufferers, that's billions of dollars right there! I'm sure you already know this, but I just wanted to say it myself, hehe. :)mel |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Lizzie2 on Apr 5th, 2004, 5:58pm Very true Mel. I've been reading this thread off and on today, and the one thought that keeps coming back to my head is that I would say 95% of the migraine sufferers I work with have little or no pain free time, and most of them do the max of 2 injections a day as often as they can/ or can afford to. Granted, chronic migraine sufferers make up a small portion of total migraine sufferers, and many migraine sufferers only get one or two migraines a month, but the cost does reach a pretty skyrocketing amount on that end, too. The point is how much MORE (in addition) they could make by targeting people with CH!! Lizzie :) |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Mikey on Apr 5th, 2004, 6:07pm on 04/05/04 at 15:57:22, catlind wrote:
We really do love you too Cat!!!! [smiley=heart.gif] Mikey, ;;D |
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Title: Vexed and Trexed....... Post by Mr.Happy on Apr 5th, 2004, 6:09pm Lizzie......shouldn't you be studying or something? Cat.......I'm calling Clark, and yer busted. Get out and stay out till the future ex gives you a green light. You've lost a lot of weight this past week due to vomiting and dehydration. Not from your abdomen, not from your butt.......All from your tits, as usual. Life is like that. Take 5 more, RJ PS: Billions and billions......... |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by HypnoticFreddy on Apr 5th, 2004, 6:15pm Like a few posts above.... I also have been reading this interesting post thru out the day. My thought is that if they advertised Imitrex on TV or a mag for the treatment of CHs, nobody (or almost nobody) would no what the hell they are talking about. Everybody has at least heard of a migraine. Migraine is a marketable word. Cluster headache is a "huh?" My thought. -Freddy |
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Title: Re: Vexed and Trexed....... Post by Lizzie2 on Apr 5th, 2004, 6:16pm on 04/05/04 at 18:09:36, Mr.Happy wrote:
LOL I'm doing my nutrition review sheet while I surf the web. I'm good at multitasking ;) But I do have to go to my piano teacher's recital in 20 minutes....Ahhh the life of a music major. 19 days till my recital! :) |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Kevin_M on Apr 5th, 2004, 6:29pm on 04/05/04 at 17:55:09, Melissa wrote:
Yes mel, much higher predominance of migrainers. But it looks like our market may need to be taken a second look at. The dollars in our market to Glaxo is substantial per imitrex user. They should have knowledge of this from the insurance companies which pay for the diagnosed CHers. We are small, but the dollars are nothing to sneeze at. I would look at any chance to expand my market with one of the most expensive drugs on the market and we are the most logical way to expense marketing dollars toward. Is there another market for imitrex to expand into other than CHers.? It is not easily understood why it is not done I would think saying in an advertisement that imitrex has been approved by the FDA for clusters and has been the most prescribed medication for these headaches too is quite a statement. Aborts a cluster? What more can be said about it. Since O2 doesn't advertise, how many others are going to make that claim? When they lose cluster market to Zomig, then maybe they will wake up. Maybe that is the timing they are looking for, when Zomig gets approval and then Glaxo comes out with their batting average with clusters, to get people not to switch. just musin' mel. :) Kevin M |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Melissa on Apr 5th, 2004, 6:37pm Kevin, the musings are all good by me! ;;D As for them knowing how much trex we ch'ers use, how do you know that when the pharmacy submits the bill to the ins. company, it isn't automatically entered into the system for migranal use?? This could be a possibility. Maybe next time someone goes to get their script, they could find out how it's entered into the computer system? Also, you'd need to know how ALL pharmacies report the info to ins. co.'s to get a good idea of the percentage. I'd be really interested to know the answer to that one. :)mel |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Kevin_M on Apr 5th, 2004, 6:53pm on 04/05/04 at 18:37:27, Melissa wrote:
A good thought mel, I'm picking up a script later and my imitrex on the 14th. I'll inquire, my pharmacist that I've gotten to know pretty well is working. If I can word my question understandably to him, I may be able to get an answer. The way I talk, I'll probably have to rephrase the question a couple times to wipe the confused look off his face the first three attempts, but I'll see. To tell you the truth, with the amount I get, there is no way a pharmacist can substantiate my prescription as migraines. Although, he has said he has been audited a couple times because of my 'script. 90 a month. Kevin M |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by ClusterChuck on Apr 5th, 2004, 6:58pm on 04/05/04 at 15:57:22, catlind wrote:
And we want to CONTINUE to love you!!! Now GET THE HELL OFFLINE!!! Where is that 2X4 she is always threatening me with when I don't follow instructions? Chuck |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Linda_Howell on Apr 5th, 2004, 7:13pm Randy, Don't you have any duct tape you can send to Clark? LindaH |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Kevin_M on Apr 5th, 2004, 7:34pm on 04/05/04 at 18:37:27, Melissa wrote:
mel, I just got an interesting answer and it seems you are most likely correct. Picked up Calan SR. Asked pharmacist (Felix) about this and on my first attempt, he got the question. He said he is not required to enter in if it is for cluster or migraine, the insurance company only wants a copy of the prescription with each order. So in effect, on a small scale, when my insurance company pays Glaxo for my bill, Glaxo has no idea if it is from one CHer or fifteen migrainers because of the amount I use. And perhaps they are ASSUMING the revenue is because of fifteen migrainers, being we are such a small bunch, and therefore marketing it totally for migraines. This is unsettling. I PERSONALLY am giving Glaxo the wrong idea. They probably think I am fifteen migrainers and they are bloating their figures of revenue from migrainers. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!!!!! They need a talking to. Thanks mel for questioning. BUT.... THE TRUTH??? I CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!!! Kevin M This should definitely be set straight. |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Melissa on Apr 5th, 2004, 7:45pm Kevin, I'm glad the pharmacist understood you. ;) hehe |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Kevin_M on Apr 5th, 2004, 7:51pm I am helping add revenue so they can market to their presumed market. Tough to swallow. Thanks for puttin' you pic' back up on your posts. ;) Kevin M |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by catlind on Apr 5th, 2004, 8:14pm I'm gonna lose my puter over this but it's important hehe. Weight loss, dehydration and dangerously low sodium/potassium et a levels can wait a few more min. hehe. on 04/05/04 at 18:29:01, Kevin_M wrote:
DING DING DING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can't say much more than that yet, cause of proprietary info blah blah blah. But has anyone heard of the American Mirgraine ONe study? Headed up by Richard Lipton? Let me leave it at this....We talked about Richard Lipton, and a prevalance study called American Cluster One ;) Nothing is guaranteed, so don't get your hopes up and don't go crazy with the info, our butts could be on the line legally for this one. I will bust if I have to keep this tidbit quiet too much longer though! Cat (who probably won't have a computer after Clark gets back home from the neighbours) PS I WASN'T HERE LOL |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Kevin_M on Apr 5th, 2004, 8:20pm Cat you are being REALLY BAD tonight. Thanks. I won't tell. This imitrex thing is disturbing to me because I've given so much to Glaxo and the revenue goes for other purposes. NOT FAIR!@@%$# Let me know how or if I can help. Luv ya Cat. Kevin M |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by catlind on Apr 5th, 2004, 8:21pm on 04/05/04 at 19:34:12, Kevin_M wrote:
Fear not Kevin, the advocacy team ais doing JUST THAT. That is a great deal of what our meetings with them were about. Setting them straight. Trust me, they see things in a whole new light now...they UNDERSTAND, they ARE getting it. Just remember it's a slow process. But the Advocacy team and OUCH is making HUGE strides in this arena, we just can't talk about it the way we want to. These pharm co's can get pretty picky. Ok, now if you guys want the advocacy team chair and VP orf OUCH to be able to continue to making them understand, I better GET OFF THE PUTER OR I'M IN DEEP DEEP DOO DOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Cat |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by broomhilda on Apr 5th, 2004, 8:45pm Cat, you are going to get caught!!!!! I came in to see you here, go back to bed!!!! Keep up all the awesome work but please try to take a break!!!! Clark will see you posting LOL! Andrea |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Not4Hire on Apr 5th, 2004, 8:51pm ...AHEM!....nothing to see here.... Move along now.... I SAID: MOVE ALONG!! (...nothing to see here, my ASS..... ;) ) and I just talked to Clark... he was shopping for those funny coats with the long sleeves ...and the buckles on the cuffs... something about a .....*LONG* weekend at ....uh..... "Happy Acres" ..... CAT: GO BACK TO BED!!! |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Elaine on Apr 6th, 2004, 2:10am Cat thats whats wrong now that you got this out your body should feel so much better :-)! I know you was about to pop. Stay in bed today Cat will ya!!!PLEASE |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by ClusterChuck on Apr 6th, 2004, 3:07am THAT'S IT!!!! I am grabbing my own 2X4 and driving out to Nebraska! You BETTER not be online when I get there! Chuck BTW, Where the eff is Nebraska? Is it SOUTH of Florida? North of Maine? West of Oregon? Damn! Looks like it may take me a while to get there ... |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by ChrisUhl on Apr 6th, 2004, 7:27am Hi guys Just spend the last hour reading all the posts. I used to work as a creative for a medical advertising agency in Denmark - so I have a few opinions about medical advertising. Ya'll have good points about clusterheads being an important target for pharmaceutical companies. BUT there's one good reason they don't throw in CH in a TV ad. The impact on the target is simply too small. If the target their ads towards migraine sufferes they will get in contact with millions. Messing up the ad with "and cluster heads too" will just hit a small number of us - and confuse all the migraine folks. Now having said that there are a whole number of other ways to get in touch with CH sufferes. GP education in terms of seminars, leaflets etc. is a good way to raise the awareness about CH amongst GPs. GSK and the others know about forums such as this website. They can contact the webmaster and inform about offers, studies etc. GSKs general website for headaches should contain a much more detailed description of CH. Maybe even the cluster quiz from our website. Since clusterheads can go for up to 5 years without the proper diagnosis, it's in everyones interest (especially GSK) to identify us in good time. 5 years is a long time and God knows how much money they are missing out on just because of misdiagnosed sufferes. So the first step should definately be to raise the awareness of CH amongst GPs. BTW - a little bird told me that one of the major companies is doing a prestudy of chronic facial neuro suffers (that's definately not the right term. But anyway). And as I understood it the trigeminus is also included. Can't say anymore sorry and don't know if we will benefit from this. Chris out |
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Title: Re: Imitrex Commercials Post by Roxy on Apr 6th, 2004, 7:16pm In the first place, the Glaxo reps were surprised that it was two women sitting there at lunch with them. Women?? And the look on their face when we added up just mine and Cat's trex use.........absolutely priceless. You could see the dollar signs lighting up. It was fun..... ;;D |
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