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        New Message Board Archives >> 2004 Cluster Headache Specific Posts >> Recommending Medication
        
(Message started by: Gator on Oct 8^th, 2004, 2:45pm)

Title: Recommending Medication
Post by Gator on Oct 8^th, 2004, 2:45pm

Ladies and gentlemen, we need to be careful about how we recommend medications to people.

1. We do not know their medical history
2. We do not know what meds they are taking regardless of what they tell us
3. WE ARE NOT DOCTORS

Every medication, including Melatonin has side effects

http://www.drugdigest.org/DD/DVH/HerbsSideEffects/0,3925,4060|Melatonin,00.html

and interactions with other medications

http://www.drugdigest.org/DD/DVH/HerbsInteractions/0,3926,4060|Melatonin,00.html

that could lead to possibly serious problems.

I realize there is a disclaimer on the front door, but not everyone comes in through the front door. Instead of saying "Try XXXX" we need to say something like, "XXXX worked for me check with your doctor about it."

Gator

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by Jonny on Oct 8^th, 2004, 3:52pm

::)

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by floridian on Oct 8^th, 2004, 3:59pm

Some good points there, Gator. We aren't here to prescribe for each other, we are here to educate and support each other.

I guess I am a bit sceptical of "ask your doctor about XXX" as in my experience, the doc often doesn't know and can't be fully trusted to educate patients about side effects and risks of medicines. Plus, "ask your doctor about ..." sounds like a commercial on TV.

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by Gator on Oct 8^th, 2004, 5:10pm

Quote:

Plus, "ask our doctor about ..." sounds like a commercial on TV.

Yeah, now that you mention it, it does. Sorry. I hate those commercials. I've just been reading "take this" and "try that" a lot lately without referring people to research for side effects and interactions or to talk to their doc about it. I don't mean to pick on melatonin, but it is probably recommended most. As good as melatonin is, one side effect is depression, a lot of us already suffer from depression and take meds for it. Mixing the two is not recommended. I would really hate to try to log in one day and find this place closed because of some stupid lawsuit or the like. Hence the reminder.

Gator

Hi Jonny! [smiley=finger.gif]

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by E-Double on Oct 8^th, 2004, 5:13pm

Seriously a good point!!!!

Dr. Eric ;)

Title: your right on!!!!!!
Post by snook on Oct 8^th, 2004, 5:58pm

Im so into the point you have made. I myself did recommend trazodone used for maybe helping chs for sleep. I added many times to CHECK with your doctor 1st. This a drug that does need to be perscribed, it has done wonders for helping my husband, no side effects for HIM. i highly recommend not only consulting with doctor and also do research!!!!! yourself.... Trazodone was 1st used for depression, finding that it didnt work it has been used for helping people when going through detox for sleep. i have been told by several doctors if used as perscribed it can be very helpful with no side effects . i am not going to recommend any more maybe suggest one to look into trazodone, by CONSULTING a doctor. I just can not tell you what its like to see my husband sleep when weeks went by with none. you opened my eyes and I thank you for that!!!!!!!!snook

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by nani on Oct 8^th, 2004, 6:12pm

I don't think suggesting that someone ask their doctor about a med or sharing what has worked for us is recommending anything. I assume that a doctor would not prescribe anything based on an internet support group suggestion. Maybe I'm wrong...

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by Giovanni on Oct 8^th, 2004, 6:22pm

If we place cautions and caveats on everything we recommend, the posts would look like the pharmaceutical cautions that all get---ten pages long. I personally like to hear of medications that have success or failure. I will research the side effects and conflicts on my own before trying and or requesting it from the physician. This caution goes with herbal as well as RX.

To remain silent on some of these treatments would be an injustice to our community that is suffering so much. Imitrex is widely recommended here, but we all know what can happen when we take it. We suggest splitting up the imitrex into two or more injections, but what happens if aseptic techniques are not followed? I try to offer suggestions on what has worked, or not worked, for me and leave it up to the individual to do reasonable research on their own.

John

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by Jonny on Oct 8^th, 2004, 6:30pm

on 10/08/04 at 18:12:25, nani wrote:

NO!, your right!

As for melatonin.....its OTC....duh!

Hi Gator :-*

.........................................jonny

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by Gator on Oct 8^th, 2004, 7:37pm

on 10/08/04 at 18:12:25, nani wrote:

[smiley=huh.gif][smiley=wtf.gif]

When you tell someone to check out something that worked for you you ARE recommending it. There is nothing wrong with telling someone to ask their doctor about xxx med. And yes, with us ch'ers, there are times when a doctor will prescribe something the patient read about on a message board. My neurologist, who knew about lithium and verapamil, never considered combining the two until I told him about several people here that get good results with the combination. Unfortunately the combo did not work for me.

And believe it or not, not everyone gets their meds from a doctor. There are plenty of instances where a well meaning family member, friend or associate gives a prescription med to someone because it helped them or because that someone could not afford it. ( ;) God Bless Them)

OTC meds and herbal supplements can interfere with or adversely interact with prescription meds just as much as other prescription meds can.

Sheesh! I didn't start this thread to start a fight, just to remind people to be careful. Don't go getting all sentimental on us.

Gator

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by nani on Oct 8^th, 2004, 8:32pm

Quote:

I didn't start this thread to start a fight

Oh I'm sorry - I didn't know we were fighting. Gimme a minute so I can get mad..... >:( Ok now I'm over it. I don't disagree with what you're saying Gator. I just don't think it is most of our intention to try to play doctor. I thought the point of this board is to share information ...

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by becky8 on Oct 8^th, 2004, 8:44pm

If you read any of my post, you will see I have learned so much. I would not even know about Verapamil. My Dr. never even asked as many questions as the CH'ers here. I listened to all, but also checked info on my own before doing anything. And for now I am on my own for my treatment (you might say) so without these CH'ers I wouldn't know all these meds to even check out. And my Dr. sure doesn't. [smiley=referee.gif]So I am very grateful to them. But I do understand what you're saying.

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by Gator on Oct 8^th, 2004, 8:45pm

on 10/08/04 at 20:32:47, nani wrote:

[smiley=ohjez.gif] Someone wanna help me with this?

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by Sean_C on Oct 8^th, 2004, 9:02pm

I know exactly what you mean Gator, point is that you wouldn't want someone to get hurt or die by accidently taking too much and/or mixing meds on someones advice here. Instead they should get proper medical attention by an ER Doc if its an emergency or contact their own Primary Care Physician about drug options.

Am I reading that correctly?

Sean..........................

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by Sean_C on Oct 8^th, 2004, 9:09pm

Sad part is, is that I'm my own biggest offender................when I'm gettin' beat up, I abuse the shit out of myself with my meds. I often wonder what damage will result later down the road.

A clusterhead in pain, will do almost anything t make it stop. Why, well we all know the answer to that question.

Sean...................

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by nani on Oct 8^th, 2004, 9:14pm

[smiley=ohjez.gif] [smiley=confused.gif] I'm not sure what I'm not getting. I don't, repeat, don't disagree with you. I'm talking about intentions...

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by Sean_C on Oct 8^th, 2004, 9:16pm

It is Nan, I think..................

Sean.............. ;;D

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by thebbz on Oct 8^th, 2004, 9:21pm

Well I don't know a whole lot about anything but I have read so many threads where someone without knowledge of this condition has inquired or reached out for help, and read the following day how this person or that had acted on the advice here and with good results. I would like to thank several hall of famers here that continually and faithfully help other with their expierence and knowledge. ATTA BOY Hall of Famers. You are very exceptional peoples... [smiley=hug.gif] Keep up the good work. 8)
BB

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by Redd715 on Oct 8^th, 2004, 9:39pm

Allow me to make an (feeble though it may be) attempt to put this into perspective.

I have mentioned alot of things I've read here to my specialist and she has been very very open to listening to me. Her only requirement is that I be totally honest with her as to what I am really taking or trying so that she is aware and can let me know of any potentialy harmful, or even fatal effects of interactions. I have been. I will discuss any and every option...including alternatives...and she is well aware of my caution and the reasons behind not moving gung ho forward with the alternative even though she has indicated to me that she could understand why I may opt to *look into* this. I know I'm not, by far, the worst effected chronic here, but I am the worst chronic she has.

If you have a good neuro or HA specialist... don't be afraid to talk to them. Be an informed consumer. Be in control of your healthcare. (Finances permitting). I have a specialist that is working with me not only on my ch.. but within my limited financial position as well. I give the woman the utmost credit.

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by Kris_in_SJ on Oct 8^th, 2004, 9:40pm

Gator - your point is well taken.

However, I don't think it's wrong to ask someone ... "Have your tried _____? It sure worked for me." I call it sharing in the hopes of helping some other poor soul like me.

The fact is, I consider you one of my personal "saviors" for your future-drugs link. Had I not taken that particular article to my doc back in May, I'm sure I'd still be suffering today. I have to agree with Giovanni that one of the main purposes of this board is to share what works for us, but acknowledge that it might not work for everyone.

You mentioned Melatonin in particular. Have you had a bad experience with it or other herbs?

Kris

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by karma on Oct 8^th, 2004, 9:42pm

Only in America.
Land of the free and home of the fuking lawsuit.
desperate times call for desperate measures but yea be careful how you word things. I'm no lawyer but written "intentions" can come back to haunt you.

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by don on Oct 8^th, 2004, 9:53pm

I highly reccomend:

Verapamil as a preventative
Prednisone to abort a cycle
Triptans to abort an attack
Melatonin at night.

I also highly reccomend IV DHE if all else fails.

But your not going to get any of it (Except melatonin) without a Doctors prescription and supervision anyway so what is the point?

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by thebbz on Oct 8^th, 2004, 10:05pm

MLOL [smiley=laugh.gif] [smiley=laugh.gif] [smiley=laugh.gif]
BB

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by Gator on Oct 8^th, 2004, 10:39pm

on 10/08/04 at 21:40:20, Kris_in_SJ wrote:

Gator - your point is well taken.

By most people anyways.

However, I don't think it's wrong to ask someone ... "Have your tried _____? It sure worked for me." I call it sharing in the hopes of helping some other poor soul like me.

Absolutely nothing wrong with sharing what works for you. That's why we are here. Just wanted to remind people about how to do that without incurring liability for a desparate sufferer or supporter taking what you say to heart without medical counsel and mixing two incompatible meds.

The fact is, I consider you one of my personal "saviors" for your future-drugs link. Had I not taken that particular article to my doc back in May, I'm sure I'd still be suffering today. I have to agree with Giovanni that one of the main purposes of this board is to share what works for us, but acknowledge that it might not work for everyone.

You are too kind. Glad I could help. You and your doctor discussed the info provided and came up with a plan. That is exactly how it should work.

You mentioned Melatonin in particular. Have you had a bad experience with it or other herbs?

Not really. Melatonin is just one that is talked about the most - first that came to mind. Again, just wanted to remind everyone that while we definitely should share our experiences with others, a little CYA is also in order.

Kris

Quote:

Posted by: karma Posted on: Today at 20:42:29

Only in America.
Land of the free and home of the fuking lawsuit.
desperate times call for desperate measures but yea be careful how you word things. I'm no lawyer but written "intentions" can come back to haunt you.

Exactly.

Quote:

Posted by: don Posted on: Today at 20:53:04

I highly reccomend:

Verapamil as a preventative
Prednisone to abort a cycle
Triptans to abort an attack
Melatonin at night.

I also highly reccomend IV DHE if all else fails.

But your not going to get any of it (Except melatonin) without a Doctors prescription and supervision anyway so what is the point?

Cute, but you know damned well how people can get their hands on everyone of these except for the DHE IV and you're intelligent enough to get the point.

This threads all yours, folks. I'm done with this one. I said my piece in good faith. C'est la vie.

Gator
Yeah, Yeah, I know - look who's getting all sensitive now. :-/

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by Kevin_M on Oct 9^th, 2004, 12:11am

I'm not that medically knowledgable, in general though, mentioning the two-prong way of handling this affliction should first be shared. That being, working with a preventative and then an abortive. Some aren't that privy to even that at first.
Preventive ideas can be mentioned to give an orientation to the type of drugs that are used. Sometimes giving the names of common preventives seems harmless enough. Some people come here on all sorts of ineffective concoctions that have been prescribed. If they have clusters, then it is up to their doctor to find which to prescribe, but a general overview of semi-effective preventives is spreading some accumulated knowledge that can be found in the tabs to the left anyway.
In the way of abortives, oxygen is beneficial and some doctors are not aware, mine never mentioned it in the eight years I was being treated by him. Even after mentioning it to him, he refused. I had to see another doctor. The only other abortives are the triptans. To be aware of these facts seems a relaying of info that is already compiled in the tabs to the left.
Awareness is a good thing to share. As far as what is best for each individual person, that is between them and their doctor.
Many come here unaware of the regimen of treatment and what drugs are used for clusters. Again, that is all to the left anyway. I guess the giving of awareness seems ok to me, and sharing what works for me can be made known, but I know clusters enough to admit what works for me has no bearing on what will be effective for another. Each must deal with their doctor. Mine thinks she knows everything so it doesn't matter what the hell I tell her anyway. Bunch of words here I guess.

blah blah and blaaaaaah blah

peace

Kevin M

Title: 411
Post by rumplestiltskin on Oct 9^th, 2004, 3:59am

Please remember to dial 911 if you think you are gonna die.

Voice comes over the mic...."uh.... there is a warning on the brown acid...."

Thank Gog for Wavy Gravy and Patch Adams.

I worry myself when I start sounding like Kim at 3 am.

Walk in the sunshine
den

PS: If you can't pry the cap off...you probably shouldn't take it.

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by cschick on Oct 9^th, 2004, 8:46am

I am new here and I would just like to say that the information I have gathered here will help me when I go to the dr. At least I will have some information to discuss with him. I don't take someone's advice as gospel and definately check out side effects before taking ANY meds, even over the counter supplements. I mean come on - don't we all know something about ephedra? We just have to use common sense in taking or leaving or gathering advice. Just my opinion. ;)

Title: Re: Recommending Medication
Post by don on Oct 9^th, 2004, 12:03pm

Quote:

there is a warning on the brown acid...."

And did Rump heed that warning?

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO !