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        New Message Board Archives >> 2004 Cluster Headache Specific Posts >> What exactly are "shadows"
        
(Message started by: Doug2 on Jun 13^th, 2004, 12:50pm)

Title: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by Doug2 on Jun 13^th, 2004, 12:50pm

Lots of folks here mention shadows as a part of the CH syndrome.

What are typical shadow syptoms. Do they precede/follow an attack when one is in the chronic phase?

Title: Re: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by Roxy on Jun 13^th, 2004, 1:26pm

Hi Doug.....welcome!

Shadows seem to be different for everyone, some get them, some don't.

I'm chronic, and I consider anything under a kip 7 to be a shadow. To me it's when I can feel my head just sitting there waiting. Sometimes the wait is long.....sometimes it's three minutes. When I can "feel" my head....it's a shadow. But I never know if I'm going to just be "feeling" my head sit there for a few hours, or if I'm going to be running for the 02 within seconds.

I'm really sorry, but this is really hard to explain.

Tracey

Title: Re: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by Superpain on Jun 13^th, 2004, 4:30pm

It's ch that's bearable....
Lingering headache that would make most people think they've got a really bad headache, but for us it ain't shit.
Irritating low level pain that just hangs around and bugs you before or after real headaches.

Title: Re: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by Doug2 on Jun 13^th, 2004, 5:34pm

Thanks so much. That "feel in my head" thing was why I saw the neurologist and had the scan. Sometimes its a pressure, sometimes a dull pain but mostly an "awareness" and anxiety around it that a headache is coming.

I know awareness sounds as vague as shadow but its the best description I can give for the sensation - cause at times its not really outright pain or pressure. I actually thought I had an inner ear problem because, for 2 weeks after my first CH in this set, the ear on that side pained on and off and when I'd bend over sometimes there would be pain/pressure around the ear. Thnakfully, that cleared up.

But then I had an attack on the other side with pain/pressure around the other ear. I seem to get ear sensations as much as I do the eye/orbit sensations.

It does not always lead to a frank CH - I've had 3 in the past 10 weeks but have had this "awareness" thing on and off in-between. It will go for about a day then disappear for several days then be back for a day or less. Not continuos, just on and off during those times I'm having the "awareness".

It will either be on the left side or the right and, when the 3 full blown CH's occurred, they did so on the same side as I'd had that awareness for a day or two preceding the headache. Which is why I get frightened every time now I feel a twitch or twinge or wwhatever in my head.

The hard thing is that I'm a bit paranoid now and, when I'm awake am often "checking the feel" of my head.

Title: Re: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by kimmiedawn81 on Jun 13^th, 2004, 8:22pm

Wow, thanks for explaining that....I never knew that. Shadows scare the crap out of me. 9 times out of 10, shadows turn into a full blown attack for me.
~Kim

Title: Re: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by Rock_Lobster on Jun 13^th, 2004, 8:52pm

I like Roxy's description... when you know your head is there.

When in an episode, my 'shadows' are the fact that I can feel that my head is present, specifically at my CH 'area'. A dull 'presence', just under or at the pain threshold.

And as SP pointed out, at the level that would likely make others whine.

Wrokk

Title: Re: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by Rick_K on Jun 13^th, 2004, 9:34pm

on 06/13/04 at 16:30:23, Superpain wrote:

Well said..................

Title: Re: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by maria9 on Jun 13^th, 2004, 10:02pm

Hi Doug2,

The shadows present as a low grade headache that persists throughout the day. I think it is actually the blood vessels being in a slightly dilated state which puts pressure on the trigeminal nerve causing the pain. The other type of pain I get when not having a cluster is what I refer to as post cluster sequela, this is the pain that you have after having a kip 8-10, where your head hurts like hell, because of the major assault, it is almost like you have been hit in the head with a baseball bat.

Hey, be well,

Marsha

Title: Re: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by JDH on Jun 14^th, 2004, 12:00am

on 06/13/04 at 22:02:52, maria9 wrote:

Hi Doug2,

The other type of pain I get when not having a cluster is what I refer to as post cluster sequela, this is the pain that you have after having a kip 8-10, where your head hurts like hell, because of the major assault, it is almost like you have been hit in the head with a baseball bat.

Hey, be well,

Marsha

Boy I've went to work a few too many mornings after some rough nights with THAT pain before. [smiley=frown.gif]
And the baseball bat analogy is how I've always described it. Your head is just sore to the touch.

Jim

Title: Re: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by BobG on Jun 14^th, 2004, 12:05am

From the archives

Shadows: “just enough of a residual Hint to keep living that "Totally Justifiable Paranoia" lifestyle”.......Mr Happy

Title: Re: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by maria9 on Jun 14^th, 2004, 2:01am

I wish that I did not need to/ nor know anything about shadows such that I would feel compelled to reply. But here I am, so it goes.

Marsha

Title: Re: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by don on Jun 14^th, 2004, 1:58pm

You have your foot stuck in a railroad track and off in the distance you hear the mournful wail of the locomotive.

Title: Re: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by Gator on Jun 14^th, 2004, 3:13pm

LOL Don! That works as a description.

Since everyone experiences this monster differently, the descriptions are going to be different. For me it's that "presence" on the effected side that hovers somewhere between pressure and pain that usually lets me know I got company coming.

I agree with Superpain - Before getting hit with CH, I would have thought I had a bad headache at shadow strength. Boy, has my definition of pain changed!!!

I had carpal tunnel surgery a few years ago. The doc didn't listen to me that it takes more anesthetic and pain medication to work on me than on most people. He was going to do both hands at the sme time, so I was prepped and both arms were tied down and a nurse was at my head. When he started to cut on my hands, I thought he was trying to cut them off or something. I screamed and said I thought you were going to deaden it before you cut. At first he tried that, "Oh, you're just feeling pressure" bit and then started cutting again. It was a good thing I was tied down. I tried to come up off the table at him. He hit me several more times with anesthetic, but never did get enough in me to stop the pain entirely. The nurse that was holding my head down on the table was crying buckets. She kept saying, "I'm so sorry." He wisened up on the other hand, but still never got it quite dead. By the time he had finished both hands, I thought that was the worst pain I would ever feel in life. I WAS WRONG.

Gator

Title: Re: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by Prense on Jun 14^th, 2004, 6:40pm

I rarely have a shadow that preceeds an attack. Most of the time if I have a shadow it means I am free and clear from an attack during the shadow duration. Many of my attacks are like throwing a light switch. All of a sudden it's on and violent. I've litterally gone from a kip 8 to completely PF in the amount of time it takes to stand up.

I describe shadows as the exact type of pain that accompanies a CH attack. My attacks never exceed 3 hours. Shadows can... They are as unpredictable as CH attacks are. My cutoff for a shadow is a kip 4. I occasionally get congestion along with a shadow and my eyelid droops. I have not had tearing from the affected side during a shadow. A strong shadow will in no way incapacitate me, but it makes me very irritable. Additionally, I have never woke to a shadow...only attacks. I normally will not abort a shadow, but when I do, I still use the trex.

Chris

Title: Re: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by jonny on Jun 14^th, 2004, 7:00pm

on 06/14/04 at 15:13:27, Gator wrote:

The doc didn't listen to me that it takes more anesthetic and pain medication to work on me than on most people.

Gator,

Ive never seen this brought up here in all the time (I can remember) been here, but theres something to that me thinks.

At the time I could not afford the $2400 to have all my bottom teeth pulled (Thats just for the pulling) so I went to a buddy of mine (Hes a dentist) and had them pulled three at at time every two weeks. It took 45 mins of shots just to numb me where i didnt feel anything, this dude was like "WTF".......LOL

I think I paid more for shots than extractions......LMAO ;;D

................................jonny

Title: Re: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by Sean_C on Jun 14^th, 2004, 8:14pm

Shadows for me are when someones touching the back of my right eye and applying steady pressure. This can last for days or weeks. I use it as a sure sign that the beast is just ringing my bell.

All in all, shadows suck too ;;D

PFDAN to you all

Sean

Title: Re: What exactly are "shadows"
Post by Gator on Jun 14^th, 2004, 9:36pm

on 06/14/04 at 19:00:16, jonny wrote:

Today at 14:13:27, Gator wrote:
The doc didn't listen to me that it takes more anesthetic and pain medication to work on me than on most people.

Gator,

Ive never seen this brought up here in all the time (I can remember) been here, but theres something to that me thinks.

At the time I could not afford the $2400 to have all my bottom teeth pulled (Thats just for the pulling) so I went to a buddy of mine (Hes a dentist) and had them pulled three at at time every two weeks. It took 45 mins of shots just to numb me where i didnt feel anything, this dude was like "WTF".......LOL

I think I paid more for shots than extractions......LMAO ;;D

................................jonny

I wonder if maybe that is why no doctor or neuro has yet been able to find a prevent that works - they were going with too small a dose. I'm no pharmacological genius, I wouldn't know what a strong dose of any particular med is. Something to discuss with the neuro on the next visit.

45 minutes of shots? That sucks. I had the same problem just having a wisdom tooth pulled. The dentist shot me up and waited the prescribed amount of time and poked me with that probe so see if I was ready. I jerked back from her and told her that hurt. She told me, "Oh you're just feeling pressure" and started to go back in my mouth. I grabbed her hand and told her in no uncertain terms that I was not feeling pressure I was feeling pain. She ended up using twice the amount of novacaine or whatever she used to deaden my jaw so she could pull the tooth. Damn military dentist. What was really crappy was most people when they get a tooth pulled get put on some real painkillers and get to stay home from work for a day or two. I had my tooth pulled that afternoon at 3:00pm and was back at work that night at 9:00. All she gave me was Vitamin M aka Motrin. I never had any real pain afterwards. Either I got a high threshold for pain or most of the people in the world are wussies.

Gator