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        New Message Board Archives >> 2002 Posts >> Re: What is an Oxygen Concentrator?
        
(Message started by: fubar on Nov 27^th, 2002, 7:07pm)

Title: Re: What is an Oxygen Concentrator?
Post by fubar on Nov 27^th, 2002, 7:07pm

That machine is cool. My life is changed now that I have one. My only complaint is the max volume of Oxygen, but it never runs out. Simply awesome.

And for those who can't believe Oxygen can kill pain, I still don't believe it. I live it, but I'm still having the hardest time believing that simple oxygen can knockout something that massive doses of demoral, morphine and (insert narcotic here) can't touch. Wow. And you DO need to be clear of narcotics before you will experience the wonder of instant relief.

Title: Re: What is an Oxygen Concentrator?
Post by forgetfulnot on Nov 27^th, 2002, 9:23pm

Hi Nich., although you are making correct statements about O2 generators threre is one simple fact that precludes them for use with cluster H/A. for most people 5 LPM wont help very many clusterheads. Most report 8 LPM or more is required for relief, although I use a 5 LPM unit with good results but I must jump on it quickly for any benefit.

Lee

Title: Re: What is an Oxygen Concentrator?
Post by Ueli on Nov 27^th, 2002, 11:02pm

My 2¢

Oxygen concentrators use one of two methods:
a) Molecular sieve that let pass the smaller O₂ molecules and Argon atoms and blocks
the larger N₂ molecules.
b) Adsoption of the N₂ in zeolyte, a spongy mineral with a huge surface. Two units
are usually used, one working while the other is regenerating.

Both type of concentrators are built for the use by respiratory disease patients, those that
inhale for hours slightly oxygen-enriched air, through these notorious nose cannulas.

I see the following disadvantage of oxygen concentrators over pressurized oxygen:

The concentration is limited to 95% (as the Argon is not removed)
Too low an output, usually designed for 5 liter/min
Startup delay, it takes several minutes to reach maximum concentration
Useless during a power black out
Difficult to take with you, not every BBQ is near a power outlet
Contamination: only nitrogen N₂ is removed, but exhaust gases, carbon monoxide,
solvent fumes, farts, etc. pass through with the oxygen

The highest possible oxygen concentration is of utmost importance to reach the needed high
concentration in the blood. 5 liters/min are never enough, even with a non-rebreather mask,
and cranking up the output drops the oxygen concentration too much. On this MB are many
testimonials of people who said that oxygen didn't help (when they were actually using
enriched air) and now have full success with the proper procedure. Any user of bottled
oxygen can tell the difference from the delay of a few minutes.

on 11/26/02 at 06:50:38, NicholasD wrote:

She could share horror stories of so-called medical grade oxygen. I was using tanks and got a contaminated tanks...

This urban legend must come from the manufacturers of concentrators. At a pressure
of 200 bar (2900 psi) oxygen is such a potent oxidizer that any organic pollutant is broken
down to CO₂ and water, with a big bang at high enough concentrations . And how the
hell, where do these contaminants come from? From the previous user of the tank who stored
his garbage in it? Ask jonny how happy he would be with 'dirty' oxygen in his welding shop.

on 11/26/02 at 06:50:38, NicholasD wrote:

IF YOU ARE ON ANY OF THE COMMON MEDICATIONS FOR CH'S, AND GET A CH, O2 WILL NOT WORK, PERIOD.

THIS STATEMENT IS UTTER BULLSHIT! EXCLAMATION MARK!

on 11/26/02 at 06:50:38, NicholasD wrote:

You have got to get off those damn medications that aren't working anyway or why in the hell are you still getting CH's?

Nicholas, has it ever occurred to you that some people don't go always for 'all or nothing'?
Some of us, although seeking for a cure too, are grateful if they find something that brings
the CH pain a few notches down.

The best strategy is to attack from all sides: Use a preventative, like Verapamil, but if an
attack breaks through (at a reduced level) use oxygen to abort it in a few minutes. If you
are using Imitrex injections, or the slower nasal spray, use oxygen to reduce the attack build
up until the med kicks in. Even while using a vibrator breathing oxygen could be beneficial.

I hope from the bottom of my heart nobody follows Nicholas' recommendation to use oxygen as
the only weapon against CH, because the he would be responsible for lots of unnecessary
suffering.

My conclusion:
If you are old and fragile, with a bad leg or two, and have nobody to carry an oxygen tank to
the third floor (with no elevator), then use two concentrators in tandem. Otherwise set
your preference on pressurized oxygen. In either case, don't neglect preventative and other
abortive treatments.

PFNADs
Ueli

Title: Re: What is an Oxygen Concentrator?
Post by Not4Hire on Nov 27^th, 2002, 11:33pm

thanks Ueli...i kinda thought this fellow was talkin out his *concentrator*.......but I'm just a "user"....and the TANK works for me......100% o2 with the NONrebreather mask.....and no GarlicOdors from the kitchen or Parfum de Dawg to flavor the headache......I don't use meds so I have no comment on the "Get clean to be effective" remark....but, thanks for your input--You da Man!!!

Nicholas:..glad the o2 (however you inhale it) works for you....but some folks have given up on this therapy because of mis- or dis-information.....and it really does work.......if used correctly.......Good luck.......

Edit: (after reading Nich's response to Ueli)

Just Fuck Off....if you had 1/100th the expertise of Ueli with this MOFO, you'd realize what ARROGANCE really is....jerk!

Title: Re: What is an Oxygen Concentrator?
Post by jonny on Nov 28^th, 2002, 10:58am

on 11/27/02 at 23:33:59, Not4Hire wrote:

I don't use meds so I have no comment on the "Get clean to be effective" remark.
]

Well I do, Not baby!!

I wish someone that says you have to be med free for 02 to work to try and tell me why it is that 02 works GREAT for me and my body has been saturated with Lithium and Verapamil "EVERYDAY!" for well over a decade.

Com'on!!, im waiting....Tell me!!!

Filling this board with bogus info is about the worst thing you can do here.....A S S HOLES!!!!

Lastly...Nice posts Ueli and Not4.

....................jonny

Title: Re: What is an Oxygen Concentrator?
Post by Ted on Nov 28^th, 2002, 11:20am

I've used the concentrators before. I had to piggyback 2 together to get the needed liter-per-minute flow. I couldn't ever start using the O2 at the onset of an attack because it take 15 minutes to get the O2 to a low 90-percentage (If I remember correctly, Ueli, it was below 95 percent). It almost never did anything to stop an attack because of these problems. And, during a blackout it was even less effective.
Thanks for your "arrogance" Ueli. Jonny's right. Misinformation filling this board is bogus. It needs to be confronted and quickly on this board. And saying O2 won't work if you're not medfree was probably the most blatant case of this I've seen in a while.

Title: Re: What is an Oxygen Concentrator?
Post by Jimi on Nov 28^th, 2002, 6:17pm

Yes....what Ueli said!

Title: Re: What is an Oxygen Concentrator?
Post by fubar on Nov 28^th, 2002, 9:44pm

on 11/27/02 at 19:07:28, fubar wrote:

... And you DO need to be clear of narcotics before you will experience the wonder of instant relief.

Let me clarify my statement. When I said 'clear of meds' I didn't mean to imply oxygen doesn't work if your on medications... pretty stupid right? What I meant was oxygen isn't going to help rebound headaches that are common in people who are depending on *loads* of narcotics to relieve their pain regularly. I could be wrong, but I've only felt oxygen help me when I'm not already taking someing like Fiorinal.

And, as for whether or not 5lpm will help you, it's not the same for everybody. Can't hurt to try it. My regulator only goes to 8, but that works for me. Sometimes the concentrator works just as well.

-fu

i am not a doctor. i don't even play one on t.v.