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Topic: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl deriva (Read 3381 times) |
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jakeman
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Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl deriva
« on: Jan 31st, 2005, 12:12am » |
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Are any of the about uses for medical purpouses. Leave the orages alone.
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Bob_Johnson
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #1 on: Jan 31st, 2005, 6:43am » |
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Try again. Your question isn't clear.
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Bob Johnson
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thomas
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #2 on: Jan 31st, 2005, 9:58am » |
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None of the medications you've listed are used to treat ch.
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Religion and sex are powerplays. Manipulate the people for the money they pay. Selling skin, selling God, the numbers look the same on their credit cards. Triptans cause rebounds. Learn it, believe it, live it. I use triptans as the absolute LAST RESORT when treating my CH.
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vietvet2tours
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #3 on: Jan 31st, 2005, 11:13am » |
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Nope none of the above are any good for ch,but you seem to have a handle on usin em.
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Kill em all let God sort em out
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thomas
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #4 on: Jan 31st, 2005, 11:42am » |
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on Jan 31st, 2005, 11:13am, vietvet2tours wrote:| but you seem to have a handle on usin em. |
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Religion and sex are powerplays. Manipulate the people for the money they pay. Selling skin, selling God, the numbers look the same on their credit cards. Triptans cause rebounds. Learn it, believe it, live it. I use triptans as the absolute LAST RESORT when treating my CH.
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jakeman
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #5 on: Feb 2nd, 2005, 12:49am » |
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Must have been wasted when I asked that question. Now, what question was I asking anyway? Oh, yes, do any of you know of legitimate uses for the opiate meds in the treatment of chronic cluster headaches? Either as an around the clock preventative therapy or just as an abortive med?
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nani
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #6 on: Feb 2nd, 2005, 12:54am » |
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No. Proof: My last visit to the ER, I got 2 morphine/phenergan shots w/in one hour of each other and they did not even touch the pain.
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vietvet2tours
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #7 on: Feb 2nd, 2005, 1:44pm » |
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No use at all but if yer doin em how would ya know ya had a headache?
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Kill em all let God sort em out
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forgetfulnot
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #8 on: Feb 2nd, 2005, 11:18pm » |
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Methadone is the only narcotic I have seen peeps say helps cluster headache, YMMV.
Lee
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pubgirl
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #9 on: Feb 3rd, 2005, 7:22pm » |
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A potential drug habit to add to my nicotine addiction and clusters, no thanks!
Opiates would be bottom of my list of things to try for CH
Think I'd probably go the home trepanning route first. 
I'm almost not kidding here Jakeman.
Surely you haven't exhausted all other possibilities???
Because that seriously would be the only reason I can think of to use these drugs to "treat" CH. The CH gurus actively warn against their use, and although we can't say they are useless because there is small handful of people here who claim they work, there is equally a larger handful of people who have taken serious cocktails of drugs with no effect beyond being off their faces AND in pain. There is an even larger group of people here (i.e. most) who wouldn't touch them.
W the B
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don
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #10 on: Feb 4th, 2005, 7:06am » |
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Quote:| Must have been wasted when I asked that question. |
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Quote:
Might address a couple of issues.
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jakeman
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #11 on: Feb 9th, 2005, 10:44pm » |
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Actually I have exhausted all of my other options. For years the docs have been treating me as if I had Migraine headaches. I've tried just about every migraine medication known to man. None of them helped except Midrin worked twice. I had to take six capsules, but it did eventually take the edge off.
My pain doctor finally wanted to try Lortab 7.5/500. The stufff worked like a dream. For the first time in my life I got legitamate, complete and lasting relief. It was truly a miracle. They say that only about 8% of headache sufferers get relief from the opiates and that most people actually can get headaches from them. I guess I'm in that 8%. My problem is that I end up switching jobs a lot and my insurance changes so I have to go to new doctors who don't believe me and I have to go through the whole same regimen that doesn't work before they'll even consider the opiates. I understand why and I understand thier point of view, but it's still a very frustrating and very painful process.
So has anyone ever gotten any relief from the opiates? What about the emergency room? I've been there my share of times in total pain and recieved morphine, demerol and dilaudid as rescue meds. They all worked very well for me.
Like I've told my doctors, I'll eat dirt if you tell me it will take away the pain. I'm willing to try anything that works. For me, I know this works.
Thanks for your responses!
--Jake
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Mr. Happy
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #12 on: Feb 9th, 2005, 10:54pm » |
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Glad you found some relief, but I'm thinking Clusters aren't what you got. Seriously, 7.5 mg of hydrocodone doesn't do squat for CH. You got something else.
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BobG
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #13 on: Feb 9th, 2005, 11:16pm » |
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Jakeman, I’m a little confused here. Have you been diagnosed with chronic cluster headaches. You have posted 3 times and haven’t mentioned any symptoms or reasons you think you may have clusters.
Have you seen a neurologist? Had a CAT scan or MRI?
You said you tried Midrin and it worked twice but you had to take six capsules. Was it the Midrin that worked or, if it was a cluster, did the headaches just end on their own?
I know it is a very personal question but I’m going to ask anyway. Why do you change jobs frequently?
I’ve been reading this board for quite some time now and I remember very few people say narcotics helped with their clusters. 99.99% have said don’t try it. It will either trigger an attack or cause rebound headaches.
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| « Last Edit: Feb 9th, 2005, 11:17pm by BobG » |
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forgetfulnot
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #14 on: Feb 10th, 2005, 1:52am » |
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on Feb 9th, 2005, 11:16pm, BobG wrote:Jakeman, I’m a little confused here. Have you been diagnosed with chronic cluster headaches. You have posted 3 times and haven’t mentioned any symptoms or reasons you think you may have clusters.
Have you seen a neurologist? Had a CAT scan or MRI?
You said you tried Midrin and it worked twice but you had to take six capsules. Was it the Midrin that worked or, if it was a cluster, did the headaches just end on their own?
I know it is a very personal question but I’m going to ask anyway. Why do you change jobs frequently?
I’ve been reading this board for quite some time now and I remember very few people say narcotics helped with their clusters. 99.99% have said don’t try it. It will either trigger an attack or cause rebound headaches.
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Bob, most mouth taken narc's do no good, just as mouth taken in the ER. The only effect way for narc's given is Iv or IM. These people saying no relief from narck's must be taking them orally.
Lee
PS: Worked for me,
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nani
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #15 on: Feb 10th, 2005, 9:17am » |
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on Feb 10th, 2005, 1:52am, forgetfulnot wrote:
Bob, most mouth taken narc's do no good, just as mouth taken in the ER. The only effect way for narc's given is Iv or IM. These people saying no relief from narck's must be taking them orally.
Lee
PS: Worked for me,
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No...if you read my post you would see I got two shots. Narcotics do not work for CH.
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Tara Ann
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #16 on: Feb 10th, 2005, 9:42am » |
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I think all your comment should say narcotics don't work for YOUR CH. You are not a doctor. Narcs usually don't work for me either. Staydol works slightly for me for about 2 weeks then its useless for ME. Also I have had Dilaudid work for me on a couple occasions, but only after several doses through IV (the doc once commented that I had enough to knock out a horse, but was still in pain and awake)
Alot of ppl here think they are CH guru's. Being helpful and informative is wonderful and the whole point But telling ppl what WILL or WON'T work soley cause thats what they experienced or cause it's the majorities experience does NOT mean it's right for EVERYONE.
Edited cause of typing errors.
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| « Last Edit: Feb 10th, 2005, 9:50am by Tara Ann » |
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don
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #17 on: Feb 11th, 2005, 7:39am » |
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Quote:Narcotics do not work for CH.
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But in extemes when you can no longer tolerate the endless pain they will afford some relief. I dont advocate narcs as an extended cluster treatment but there were many times when an ER administered narcotic saved me from going over the edge. A blanket statement like narcs dont work is misleading. The phentanyl patch has helped many people cope.
Quote:
That right.
No one here is and I have found very few absolutes with Clusters.
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| « Last Edit: Feb 11th, 2005, 7:44am by don » |
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Kevin_M
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #18 on: Feb 11th, 2005, 10:03am » |
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Rapoport and Sheftell's book, "Conquering Headache" has given brief mention about it.
Acute Treatment of Cluster Headache
Daily use of opiates is not recommended, due to risk of dependency and rebound headaches.
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Cluster Headache Treatment
Pain medication is not specific for cluster headache, but it may decrease the intensity of the pain if nothing else has worked. Cluster patients must not use opiates (narcotics) on a daily basis.
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Miscellaneous Medications
Rarely do we prescribe opioids, both because they usually do not work well in migraine and are addictive, but they can be tried if all else fails. Injectable opioids such as meperidine (Demerol), should be used no more than twice per month; tablet forms nor more than twice weekly. This may be accompanied by promethazine (Phenergan) or hydroxyzine (Vistaril); some centers may administer morphine. Butorphanol (Stadol) can be given by injection or nasal spray.
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Specialized Inpatient Therapy
When headaches become daily, severe, incapacitating, and when they are associated with disability, decreased quality of life, or rebound syndromes from analgesic and/or ergotamine overuse, aggressive therapy with intravenous medication and cautious withdrawal of the offending medications must begin.
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Don's statement:
Quote:| I dont advocate narcs as an extended cluster treatment but there were many times when an ER administered narcotic saved me from going over the edge |
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pretty much reflects a similar message.
Kevin M
*edit* also, job performance would be a concern for me, insurance is tied to it.
*edit* under Cluster Headache Treatment, above, the last statement, is one rare time I have seen the word "must" used in the book.
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| « Last Edit: Feb 11th, 2005, 10:19am by Kevin_M » |
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don
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #19 on: Feb 11th, 2005, 11:31am » |
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Thanks Kevin.
That provides a comprehensive evaluation of how narcotics play a role in CH.
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vietvet2tours
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #20 on: Feb 11th, 2005, 12:06pm » |
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Not one time was the word Oxygen used in this entire thread.
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don
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #21 on: Feb 11th, 2005, 3:33pm » |
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Probably because oxygen is not a narcotic.
I get your point though.
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bigred
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #22 on: Feb 12th, 2005, 10:35pm » |
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The thing you get from these medicines is an inpatiant treatment program to break you down and start again.
Narcotics should never be used to treat CH.
At least thats what my new doctor told me when I informed him my old doctor was giving me morphine tabs to beat the beast.
bigred
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don
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #23 on: Feb 13th, 2005, 7:07am » |
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Quote:Narcotics should never be used to treat CH.
At least thats what my new doctor told me when I informed him my old doctor was giving me morphine tabs to beat the beast. |
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I agree. For long term treatment, but, as Kev posted.....
Quote:| Rarely do we prescribe opioids, both because they usually do not work well in migraine and are addictive, but they can be tried if all else fails. |
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They do play a role.
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forgetfulnot
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Re: Heroin, Opium, Morphine, Dilaudid, Fentanyl de
« Reply #24 on: Feb 14th, 2005, 2:16am » |
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on Feb 10th, 2005, 9:17am, nani wrote:
No...if you read my post you would see I got two shots. Narcotics do not work for CH.
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I’m am sorry little girl, but you are incorrect. Maybe not for you but to make an all inclusive statement such as yours is incompetent. And unhelpful to the many people who can’t take Imitrex for example. If you have science, post it, if you have an opinion post that as well . But be prepared for 30 year c/heads, like me to nullify your ranting. Narcotics given with the proper boosters will knock you out and fifteen minuets, later you have no headache. I played this game for twenty years, not an addict and thank GOD Imitrex works for me.
Lee
Edit: 100 mg Demerol always worked for me w/phenergan 25mg hurt like a SOB. They never gave me Morphine
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| « Last Edit: Feb 14th, 2005, 2:56am by forgetful » |
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