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Topic: MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin (Read 2078 times) |
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MidnightObsidian
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MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin
« on: Feb 16th, 2003, 4:11pm » |
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Quick background info: I'm a chronic sufferer, and I'm going to try to get on some prescriptions from my doctor on Tuesday. At the same time, I'm working on getting some psilocybes to try to kill the things off from the start instead of resorting to popping meds for the rest of my life. If the psilocybin treatment works, then I'm going to start growing my own, but for now I have to get them from street dealers. I don't want to do much business with them, so I want to make the best of my money. Also, I have access to free lithium.
Question: I know that taking an MAOI Inhibitor or Lithium will increase the power of a psilocybin trip as far as the psychoactive effects go, but will it do anything to the anti-CH powers of psilocybin / psilocilin? Also, has anyone tried this personally?
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ave
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Re: MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin
« Reply #1 on: Feb 16th, 2003, 6:58pm » |
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Generally the take on this is that for shrooms to work for you, you have to be MED FREE.
If a psychotrip is all you care about, you can' t be suffering fom clusters much.
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MidnightObsidian
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Re: MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin
« Reply #2 on: Feb 16th, 2003, 9:52pm » |
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I'm sorry; I probably wasn't very clear with what I was asking. >= \
I'm not on any medications right now, and I've been seriously considering using psilocybe mushrooms as a cluster headache treatment. Before I jump into anything as far as medicine goes, I make an effort to learn as much about the particular medicine as I can. Unfortunately, the only real sources of information on psilocybes comes from drug websites such as Erowid.org. It was there that I found out that consuming half of the amount of psilocybin that you normally would along with a dose of lithium will make the experience seem exactly the same as if you were to consume your normal amount of psilocybin.
When Flash originally posted about his shroom therapy, he said that taking about one quarter of a recreational dose would be enough to kill off his headaches for about six months. I want to stay as true to the medicinal nature of this treatment as possible, and consequently, I want as few shrooms as possible to last me as long as possible so that my contact with dealers is extremely limited. If I could take a dose of lithium and 1/8 of a recreational dose, $10 worth of shrooms could last me for quite some time, assuming it works at all. (As I mentioned before, I am a chronic sufferer, so I'll most likely have to redose a few times for the relief to be semi-permanent.)
Sorry for the confusion; I know you guys look down upon the recreational use of psilocybe mushrooms here, and I definitely coincide with your stance.
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Marc
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Re: MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin
« Reply #3 on: Feb 16th, 2003, 10:21pm » |
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Edward,
Are you still self-diagnosing, or have you seen a competent Neurologist yet?
You may want to re-think taking Lithium without your Dr.'s help. Lithium poisoning should not be taken lightly. Blood work is required to determine how individuals handle it.
Be careful..........
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MidnightObsidian
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Re: MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin
« Reply #4 on: Feb 16th, 2003, 10:28pm » |
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Yeah, I have been very concerned about the lithium poisoning, which is why I was looking for some personal experience with this before I'd consider trying it-- unless I got stellar reviews from some people here, I don't think I'd bother with it. Even then, things vary from person to person, so I'd have to be careful.
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tanner
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Re: MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin
« Reply #5 on: Feb 16th, 2003, 10:58pm » |
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my friend... the only thing i can add to this thread are warnings so please indulge me. have you ever done shrooms recreationally? i remember them to be quite intense! have ya tried lithium yet? not something i would take lightly, and thats from personal experience. and the street dealer thing is not good at all....
please don't mix and match, don't take the chance of procuring something from the wrong source, and take enough time to try all the "healthy stuff" first.
be careful!!! tim
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I AM THE MASTER OF MY MIND, MY BODY, AND MY EMOTIONS...
it's just my head that sucks...http://www.centerforlit.com/
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MidnightObsidian
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Re: MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin
« Reply #6 on: Feb 16th, 2003, 11:36pm » |
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Thank you for all of the responses; I really appreciate them, and a definitive answer like this is exactly what I was hoping to hear from you all.
I haven't ever used shrooms recreationally, but I've researched the hell out of hallucinogenics and used dextromethorphan on all of the plateaus other than Sigma. From all that I've read and heard from other people, the higher plateaus are extremely similar, and the lower plateaus aren't anything for which you need to be particularly prepared.
Considering what you said, I'm going to play it safe and avoid mixing medicines. Thank you for your responses!
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Pinkfloyd
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Re: MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin
« Reply #7 on: Feb 17th, 2003, 1:44am » |
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on Feb 16th, 2003, 10:58pm, tanner wrote:
please don't mix and match, don't take the chance of procuring something from the wrong source, and take enough time to try all the "healthy stuff" first.
be careful!!! tim |
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Tim,
What on the list of "prescription" drugs do you consider "healthy stuff"?
Maybe I'm misunderstanding your post, but....there are reports of people that died from too much WATER. 
Take ten times the prescribed dosage of 02 and it'll be a race to see if you go blind before your lungs cease to work. Not to mention what happens to your brain from the decreased blood flow. Wanna discuss "meds?"
Take ten times the 1/4 recreational dose of mushrooms and you'll have a 5 hour conversation with your sofa. I guess you could discuss all the previous damage you've done to your body and mind with years of prescription drugs. The sofa would probably be more sympathetic than your doctor. 
Midnight,
I know you said you were going to play it safe and not mix 'em but......just in case... 
Starting from scratch on the treatment you're describing, you have way too many different factors involved to even think about trying to "boost" the shrooms with Lithium.
You have no idea how potent the mushrooms you get will be. Even the same strain will change potency from batch to batch and that doesn't even consider the age, how they were stored, or how you will react to even a small amount. Just like "prescription drugs" we all react differently to an equal dose.
Add the fact that not only will you not know how you will react to the shrooms, you won't know how you react to an undetermined dosage of lithium. Some people report that they have the best results by using very small amounts of mushrooms.....a fraction of the 1/4 recreational dose.
I don't know anyone that even suggests starting with something from an unknown source. If the treatment doesn't work after a few doses, was it the "product" you purchased?
Too many questions left unanswered.
I suggest you start growing your own so YOU can control all aspects of the treatment should you decide to go with it. If you're worried about costs, $50.00 will pretty much get you a lifetime supply.
If you do try this treatment, please fill out the survey on the treatment, good or bad.
You are a chronic sufferer and you're just now thinking about asking your doctor for a prescription? ???
BobW
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MidnightObsidian
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Re: MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin
« Reply #8 on: Feb 17th, 2003, 11:07am » |
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No doctors wanted to believe that I am suffering from cluster headaches. With the statistics, I can understand their reasoning, but there was a lot of evidence that showed that that's what I had. They put me through absolutely everything that they had (other than something like Verapamil): elavil, celexa, neurontin, trazodone, hydrocodone, oxycodone, zipraisadone, kava kava, pseudoephederine, prozac, etc. I've been working on treating these headaches for years, and we've eliminated just about every other possibility. Now that I have the information on this website backing me, I'm going to go in there tomorrow and ask for a prescription for Verapamil, an O2 tank, and maybe some Imitrex for when I'm out or when the O2 won't work.
I'm going to grow my own mushrooms when I can; I'd rather take those every once in a while than take meds every day (assuming they work). I don't really want to get any from dealers, but I'm not ready to grow my own until I've experienced either some success or some enjoyment. I'm already prepared to construct the facilities that I'd need, but I'm very hesitant for some pretty obvious reasons.
I'm probably far too enthusiastic about this... it's just that I've been dealing with these for quite a while (considering my age) and I'm just really anxious to find some form of relief.
Thanks again for your input!
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firebrix
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Re: MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin
« Reply #9 on: Feb 17th, 2003, 2:55pm » |
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Greetings MidnightObsidian
I understand where you're coming from - Mopar is chronic too - and relief is what you want.
BUT
I believe it would be better for you to bite the bullet a little longer and just wait until you can grow your own. Its easy.
Here in NZ some friends attended a party where a lady arrived saying she'd just eaten some mushrooms she'd acquired from a mate. She was dead by midnight. The shrooms she ate had a few ink caps in the mix and she died. It is for this reason I would never score on the street. There are shrooms and shrooms and also toadstools and some of 'em will kill you. Street dealers usually want to make money and are not too particular about the quality of the product they sell.Its safer and there's more involvement in growing your own.
As for adding MAOIs to the mix - well, WHY?? It has already been stated that smaller doses work - why not start with small (<2.5 to 4 gram) doses and see how you go? We are using psilocybin as a med here and I cannot imagine why anyone would want to mix meds for the first attempt at relief.It might just muck you and the treatment up! I do not know of anyone who has mixed them, Or needed to, but I am often wrong!!
Have you read the Buster's FAQ page? Whatever you do, please read everything you can first. Let me know if I can be of any assistance. There are chronics who have found relief from psilocin treatment!
Hang in there.
firebrix
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MidnightObsidian
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Re: MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin
« Reply #10 on: Feb 17th, 2003, 3:07pm » |
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on Feb 17th, 2003, 2:55pm, firebrix wrote:| As for adding MAOIs to the mix - well, WHY?? It has already been stated that smaller doses work - why not start with small (<2.5 to 4 gram) doses and see how you go? We are using psilocybin as a med here and I cannot imagine why anyone would want to mix meds for the first attempt at relief. It might just muck you and the treatment up! |
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Yeah, you're right. I suppose there really isn't any reason for it. I just read about the lithium on Erowid and my mind started going off on whether it'd extend the duration of cluster relief without ever really thinking why I'd need to anyway, seeing as how inexpensive this all can be. Heh... sorry for being a bother.
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Pinkfloyd
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Re: MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin
« Reply #11 on: Feb 17th, 2003, 11:28pm » |
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on Feb 17th, 2003, 3:07pm, MidnightObsidian wrote:
Heh... sorry for being a bother. |
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Hey, not a bother. The more we all discuss it, the more we all learn.
bobW
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Karla
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Re: MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin
« Reply #12 on: Feb 18th, 2003, 9:28am » |
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I tried 4g of shrooms and tripped and had 4 -5 months pain free. I went off all my meds and was completly med free at the time I dosed. I went 5 days with no meds before the shrooms and 5 days after the shrooms. I then tried twice 4g of shrooms on my meds (lithium 900mg, effexor (antidepressent) 300mg, and geodon 60mg (antiphycotic)). I never tripped and I did not get any pain free days out of it.   I would recommend if at all possible to go without meds when you dose. That was my experience. Good luck 
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Karla
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firebrix
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Re: MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin
« Reply #13 on: Feb 18th, 2003, 3:04pm » |
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Not a bother MidnightObsidian!! Never! Pleased to meet you, and ditto to what Pink said!
Good luck with whatever you decide to do. Hope you get some peace soon, and I do know where you're coming from! Sure have thought some strange things about all meds myself from time to time and this sure is the place to discuss that. Keep us posted and
PFDAN to you
firebrix
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deadheadrob
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Re: MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin
« Reply #14 on: Feb 18th, 2003, 6:09pm » |
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wow, haven't been here in awhile. I was a chronic for 20 years and have tried every med available. Now i'm going on 2 1/2 years of only minor shadows and full nites of sleep. ergot compounds have always worked best for me if i use them sparingly. Since i am still a grateful dead fan i was exposed to hallucinogens at an early age. ha's started at 9 years old and got worse with age. I do agree with pink and flash on shroom treatment. Do be careful in obtaining them especially if you live in california. growing them yourself is always best, but can be tricky(make sure you wear long sleeve shirts when dealing with mycelieum) any large strain of cubensis are best producers so you only have to make one batch. On the contrary, however, i did notice pure LSD was much better for stopping cycles. I know you guys don't like rec. drugs but if it works what have got to lose? I was experienced in tripping and as long as you're ok with the REAL you, no need to worry. do stop all meds for one week prior. I got sick of these things again in aug. 2000. i did a major dose of especially good LSD, took a valium, sat back and watched the show. as usual i had interesting perspective of the REAL me. to my delight i have not been bothered since, except for a few shadows as weather patterns change. these treatments should only be considered if you can get a reliable dose. Amsterdam you can obtain lysergide legally from sandoz. don't bring any back! as for lithium- if you're really crazy keep taking it- if not forget it. putting light metals like lithium and aluminum in your brain can increase chance of alzheimers- bet your doc didn't tell you that. always remember that docs get kick backs for prescribing certain meds so do your own PDR research. hope your experience will be fun and productive. THINK GOOD THOUGHTS AND EVERYTHING WILL BE COOL.
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pinksharkmark
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Re: MAOI / Lithium & Psilocybin
« Reply #15 on: Feb 19th, 2003, 5:15am » |
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on Feb 16th, 2003, 4:11pm, MidnightObsidian wrote:
Question: I know that taking an MAOI Inhibitor or Lithium will increase the power of a psilocybin trip as far as the psychoactive effects go, but will it do anything to the anti-CH powers of psilocybin / psilocilin? |
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I don't know, and I know of no one who can say for sure. It is possible that whatever helps the CH is a separate mechanism from whatever produces the high. If this is the case, then it is possible that a drug which boosts or blocks the psychoactive effects might have no effect whatsoever on the cluster-busting effects.
Quote:| Also, has anyone tried this personally? |
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There was one report from a poster who tried it deliberately and had an extremely intense trip, but also killed his headaches for a while. I am so sorry, but I can't find the link to his post at the moment -- I know it was on the old messageboard and it was from an infrequent poster. Karla's experience was the reverse, although it is unknown whether it was the lithium or the other meds that blocked the psychoactive effects of the psilocybin.
I have to go with the majority here and recommend leaving lithium out of the mix.
pinky
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