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Topic: Shrooms: The EA Experience (Read 11465 times) |
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rick
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #75 on: Jul 30th, 2002, 2:06am » |
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on Jul 29th, 2002, 11:25pm, Bob P wrote:
Maybe psilocin has a 2 day half life. Works great for the first couple of days and gradualy wears off. Like prednisone is used to break a cycle, maybe the break for a couple of days is what one's system needs to get itself back in order. Maybe psilocin and pred both supply this needed break in order for our system to get itself back into normal operation and kick the CH cycle.
Just thinking and guessing here. |
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Interesting, and it makes sense. I don't know about two days, but I would have a pain free week, and then start feeling shadowy again on days 6-9, anywhere in there. I'd take another dose, and feel, great again.
 R
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eyes_afire
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #76 on: Jul 30th, 2002, 6:35pm » |
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It seems that CH gets aggravated for about 24 hours following shroom dose, then fades away until around day 6. Yesterday I had no CH symptoms at all. This morning I had strong shadows, but nothing else for the rest of the day.
BobP:
You have good ideas.
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rick
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #77 on: Jul 31st, 2002, 1:28am » |
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on Jul 30th, 2002, 6:35pm, eyes_afire wrote:
BobP:
You have good ideas.
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Bob... you rock, dude. Give him a hug, Eyes.
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steColor
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #78 on: Jul 31st, 2002, 8:09am » |
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I agree with Rick and Eyes,
BobP,
Very interesting concept, and does make great sense.
STEC
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Bob P
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Thanks, But ...
« Reply #79 on: Jul 31st, 2002, 8:58am » |
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still just grabbing at straws.
Flash / Pinky - any status on the shroom survey? If erowid has any problems with it, my offer to host it still stands. I just need the questions as the Beta site of the survey is not there anymore.
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eyes_afire
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #80 on: Aug 4th, 2002, 6:17pm » |
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I'm glad to say the shroom dosing has reduced my CH attacks down to about 2 per week, but the past 3 CH attacks have been particularly nasty and resistant to oxygen. For anyone trying to break a CH cycle with shrooms: it requires tons of willpower (I've been a good shroom pupil and have avoided imitrex for the past month). Last night at around 11pm I got one of the worst CH attacks. It was horrible. The pits of hell. It came and went until around 3:30am. At that point I gave up on trying to sleep and since by that time it was Sunday, I decided to dose with 3 grams (BTW, its very, very hard to function enough to prepare a dose while being attacked by CH beast). That was the first time I ever dosed while under full scale assault by the CH beast. The 3 gram dose tripped me harder than I was expecting probably due to lack of food and lack of sleep (and perhaps a particularly strong specimen). But once the trip started, I was absolutely thrilled that the dose had totally eliminated this persistent CH attack. During this trip I experienced some interesting auditory effects... such as voice distortion and a 'strobe-like' effect on sounds from the TV. Damn, I really hope this cycle ends soon... I don't ever ever ever want to experience CH like that again. I was extremely desperate with banging head and at one point became concerned that I was going to injure my eye from pressing ice cubes onto it.
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Not4Hire
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #81 on: Aug 4th, 2002, 6:40pm » |
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Damn son ......I gotta say y'all got some brass *pelotas* there.... this is confronting the MOFO on HIS territory..... I respect that to the nth degree...... and I'm right behind ya..... in truth.... I hope it works....you may be breakin' trail here... keep us updated and I SINfuckinCERELY hope you bust his/her ass down to little pissant pieces...... just be careful: what seems *reasonable* under the influence can be hard to deal with the *next day*......... as ever I gotcher back.....stay in touch bro.... Steve
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Flash
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #82 on: Aug 5th, 2002, 6:23am » |
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BobP - The survey is still up and functioning on the EROWID website as far as I am aware... just that nobody has bothered to use it for some time.
The theory that hallucinogens calm the system long enough for things to settle down (a bit like an anti-inflamitory - I mean that metaphorically), is another squint on Pinky's long standing tube radio theory. I agree that the 5-7 days relief is probably more than coincidental. Some of us are obviously lucky enough to get our systems settled first time around.
Months ago I posted something, and now I am even more convinced of it's value:
Many of the people that have tried hallucinogenic treatment are those among the worst affected by CH or the most desperate. Thus we are seeing a lot of chronics and people with lengthy episodes posting on this topic. These people are likely to be harder to treat, requiring several attempts. Just look at their verapamil doses!
In my opinion an episodic taking a level 1-2 dose of psilocybin midway between episodes is likely to skip the next episode quite comfortably. This is certainly the case for me.
From that it would appear that our body chemistry is slowly and constantly drifting out of synch until a certain threshold is crossed resulting in a CH episode. The CH itself and subsequent hiding doled out to the body probably shocks the body back to normality after a certain amount of abuse - unless the person enters the vicious cycle of being chronic (this may even occur during the very first episode).
Taking a hallucinogen between episodes appears to reset the clock. Taking the hallucinogen during the episode does the same thing but it's much harder. Another metaphor is hicups - in my experience those are also much easier to prevent than to abort LMAO! Once they get started it takes a lot of effort to stop that diaphram from bouncing.
Many of us have discovered that treating the body with respect during an episode helps a lot. Trying to get enough sleep, but being careful not to sleep too much. Trying to stick to a regular sleeping pattern. Not drinking. Eating small meals at regular intervals. Avoiding eating anything that may aggrivate the system in any way whatsoever (I don't believe in triggers as such, but I do know that it's best to keep the diet well balanced and bland during an episode). Not watching TV too long. Avoiding smoky places. Avoiding flashing lights/bright lights. Avoiding getting dehydrated. Avoiding stress. All these things done togther help make an episode more bearable.
Likewise dosing at regular 5 day intervals, and dosing in moderation IE quantities necessary to reach level 2 probably helps set the system on an even course. The hallucinogen probably does provide 3-5 days a placidity.
When someone gets acid indigestion they take an antacid. If they follow up by eating and drinking to excess the indigestion comes back. If they eat and drink in moderation, and chew on another antacid anytime the symptoms return then gradually the stomach calms down and sorts itself out. The way hallucinogens act on the head feels similar.
Hope this helps. Don't take my analogies to hicups, indigestion etc too literally. I do fully understand that they haved no relationship whatsoever with CH.
Anyone episodic and reading this between episodes then my advice is grow some shrooms and take a level 2 dose well in advance of your next anticipated episode. Repeat at the same point in each cycle. I'd be very surprised if you got any significant CH symptoms. If the gap between your episodes is long then take the dose 3-6 months prior to the next anticipated episode. Remember to feedback. Don't be too surprised if you get the odd twinge or shadow - that's perfectly normal.
Flash
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unclfuzzy
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #83 on: Aug 5th, 2002, 6:43am » |
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I have to say that I'm inclined to agree from my very limited experience (I'm hoping against hope it's true anyway). As I posted elsewhere, I've been having episodes every two years for the last 22 years. I'm in one now, but two and a half years ago I had a weak mushroom tea while visiting Amsterdam and I completely skipped that years episode. Until I discovered this site last month I had completely forgotten about the mushrooms, and probably would never have considered trying them again since they didn't do anything for me at the time but taste awful. I'm committed to growing my own pharmaceuticals now, and I really believe this may be the last episode of CH I'll ever have to suffer through. If only the damn things would grow fast enough to help with this round!
Thank you all so very much for giving me this last best hope and what I believe may be a "cure."
Matt
I hate feeling competitive, but how do you deal with a loved one who has sympathy for you based on his own experience with migraines? Here's hoping the shrooms cure us both!
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rick
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #84 on: Aug 6th, 2002, 1:12am » |
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on Aug 5th, 2002, 6:23am, Flash wrote:
Many of us have discovered that treating the body with respect during an episode helps a lot. Trying to get enough sleep, but being careful not to sleep too much. Trying to stick to a regular sleeping pattern. Not drinking. Eating small meals at regular intervals. Avoiding eating anything that may aggrivate the system in any way whatsoever (I don't believe in triggers as such, but I do know that it's best to keep the diet well balanced and bland during an episode). Not watching TV too long. Avoiding smoky places. Avoiding flashing lights/bright lights. Avoiding getting dehydrated. Avoiding stress. All these things done togther help make an episode more bearable.
Likewise dosing at regular 5 day intervals, and dosing in moderation IE quantities necessary to reach level 2 probably helps set the system on an even course. |
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I believe that living a healthy lifestyle might lend a hand to the effectiveness of this therapy. If our systems fall out of rythym every so often in the form of a cluster cycle, then it only makes sense to do what we can to keep the system in rythym as best we can.
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rick
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #85 on: Aug 6th, 2002, 1:20am » |
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on Aug 5th, 2002, 6:43am, unclfuzzy wrote:| ... migraines? Here's hoping the shrooms cure us both! |
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I have suggested to a few friends who are migraineurs that they also give this therapy a chance. I believe the results will be quite positive.
Peace to all Heads,
-Rick
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Tom
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #86 on: Aug 13th, 2002, 6:10am » |
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Sorry, but I only could find Australian providers in the internet...may be that you can get addresses of NZ providers by e-mail from: webmaster@entheogen.com
I myself found the following Australian providers:
http://www.ethnobotany-australia.net
http://www.shaman-australis.com/
±free psilocybe prints:
address:
AFSR
PO Box 2227
Kardinya 6163
Western Australia
e-mail address : seedfreak@seedfreak.zzn.com
ATB ! Thomas
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Cry-or-die
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #87 on: Aug 14th, 2002, 2:09pm » |
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Well, I sent an email to seedfreak. Thanks for the link tom. I suppose I should try and find a local elf for the time being although freshness may be questionable???
any thoughts on that? I have used them recreationally in my younger days but only a few times...so long ago I dont even remember when it was....hehehe...I do also have a current affinity for MJ...so sweet and yummy, but has no effect on ch 
This looks like the route for me tho...organic, no side effects, and it works...yyyyyaaaaayyyyy...kudo's to whoever it is that figgered that one out!
No wonder it is a scheduled drug...it gets in the way of pharmaceutical profit margins and can be grown nearly for free...as opposed to the $300/week I am currently spending on pharmaceuticals to treat my CH's....shit, I am sooooo broke, can't even afford to eat properly...THAT is a crime!!!!
No wonder they are taking thier time on the R&D...they're making a killing on selling padded gloves for our beast instead of looking for the cure...albeit that there are some dedicated researchers that are looking for answers, but I think that all of those guys end up dead when they figger it out...it's all a money game. Just like making the removal of mercury containing fillings that cause poisonous bioaccumulations in us UNETHICAL...it's unethical to leave them in!!!!
But that is another thread...lol
(I did a big rant in the circadian rhythm thang strang I posted about that)
sigh,
Thanks for listening...gotta go...beast is knockin'.
Cry
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Tom
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« Reply #88 on: Aug 14th, 2002, 4:01pm » |
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Hi Cry,
I would try to e-mail the » webmaster@entheogen.com «, they are collecting web addresses of spore providers in AUS (and may be also in NZ), as far as I know.
Wish you ATB!
Thomas
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| « Last Edit: Aug 14th, 2002, 4:03pm by Tom » |
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Cry-or-die
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #89 on: Aug 14th, 2002, 7:24pm » |
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Thanks for the well wishing Tom,
I live in a place where mushrooms grow aplenty in the rainy season and since I won't be having clusters, I'll be there at 4am on my belly like a reptile and scopin the ground for them so I can get some good spore prints for my fellow sufferers.
trubble for me is...it's not for another 2 or 3 months...so until then I'll keep trying FSP sites.
Thanks again Tom!
Cry
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Shelley
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #90 on: Aug 14th, 2002, 7:48pm » |
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Good grief Cry.
Collect them. If dried properly they'll keep for up to a year.
And/or have a dose of fresh. You might find that you skip the next cycle.
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Cry-or-die
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #91 on: Aug 16th, 2002, 10:44am » |
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hehehe shelly, I would stock up on them but the dried variety is illegal...further, I couldn't send them to anyone in the US (or many other countries) because it is a schedule 1 controlled substance (actually the controlled part is the psylocin/psylocyben which is the part we need for the treatment) and I wouldn't want to go against the US Feds...or any other fed for that matter.
Spore prints are NOT illegal tho because they have no controlled substances in them.
I have ordered some spore prints and will culture my own and will send a free spore print to any CH'er that wants one when mine are ready ;D
In regard to potency, I read that the time of harvest is very important, they are most potent when they are small and the veil is closed or just opening. Bigger is not better in this case.
Apparently the psylocin/psylocyben is very close in molecular structure to serotonin, close enough to fool the receptors to think that is what it is.
I have noticed many people take them at 5 day intervals, is that how long it takes for the body to use all of the chemical? Pinky? Do you know? I also read that overdoing it may have the opposite effect...has this happened to anyone?
I'm curious.
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tommyD
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #92 on: Aug 16th, 2002, 12:30pm » |
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Cry-or-die --
Here's what the five-day thing is about: psilocybin (and LSD) is "self-limiting" (for lack of a better term), meaning that once you take it and it takes effect, it will have no further effect (or at least much less effect) if you take more. You must wait four or five days for this self-limiting characteristic to wear off. This is why it is next to impossible to become addicted to such indole-ring hallucinogens.
While some have had success with a single dose, shroom therapy seems to wotrk best if two or more doses are used. For episodics, two doses may keep one pain free for many months, even years, as a treatment can prevent entire cycles.
For chronics, things are a little more difficult. Some have found they get relief for a few days or a week, then must repeat a dose, and this once-a-week dosng may have to be repeated several times, or indefinately, before long-term relief sets in.
There seems to be some evidence that over-doing it could be counter productive; on the other hand, many chronics, and episodics trying to stop a cycle in progress, have found a larger dose more effective -- go back and read the very beginning of this thread.
-tommyD
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eyes_afire
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #93 on: Aug 16th, 2002, 8:22pm » |
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Personal update:
After the dose early on 8/4/02, I had one of the 'most painfree' weeks in a long time. I experienced major shadows on Wednesday (8/7/02) and a CH on Saturday evening (8/10/02)... those were the only 2 CH events for that entire week.
Unfortunately this current week hasn't been quite that good. I dosed again early Sunday morning (8/11/02). I had minor CH attacks on Tuesday (8/13/02) and Thursday (8/15/02) and significant shadows today (8/16/02), plus numerous shadows throughout the week.
Regardless, shroom doses have made things much more manageable (only 3 CH attacks per week is incredible considering that I'm not taking any government drugs).
Basically I'm locked in a draw with the beast:
I dose early Sunday morning (around 3:30 am, about 3 grams), get strong shadows on Sunday, get about 2 not-so-strong CH attacks during the week (plus shadows throughout the week), then get clobbered with a strong CH attack Saturday evening, then I dose again early Sunday morning, etc.
Time marches on. Dose #7 will be early Sunday morning. Unfortunately, I will become chronic around Sept 5. My current cycle started mid-september 2001.
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| « Last Edit: Aug 16th, 2002, 8:23pm by eyes_afire » |
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gills
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #94 on: Aug 16th, 2002, 11:21pm » |
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WOW
This method scares the crap out of me. Hope you havent got a gun in the house. I was thinking about trying it, but I am too scared of what I might do now. What if the beast gets through? I wouldnt trust myself.
Gills
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tommyD
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #95 on: Aug 17th, 2002, 6:55am » |
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Gills --
There's really nothing to be afraid of, BUT--- This is a serious psychedelic drug...if you fear it, do not take it, as the fear could control your experience, and it won't be pretty. Shrooms are contraindicated (love those big medical terms) for those with some kinds of mental illness or emotional instability. What Kinds of mental illness? Who the hell knows? (that was a serious question, anybody seen any research on this?)
Once, at trip level 2, the beast visited briefly (20 min. or so) at KIP 5. I too was concerned about what an attack would feel like while tripping. It wasn't a heavy trip or a heavy attack, but it really didn't bother me any more than a KIP 5 while sober.
There are a wide range of experiences with the shroom therapy. In the middle of a very long cycle, I used two very small doses, one week apart, and got relief for two months. These were small doses, too, only enough for a trip level one. Many others have found you don't need to "trip your brains out" (as we used to say in the early 70's) for this to work for you.
Then again, last treatment I used a more potent species and inadvertantly reached a level 2.5 to 3. Unexpected, but not unpleasent, and it has kept the beast at bay for 8 months now. What's that prove? Nothing. Could have been that my cycle endeed naturally sometime after that last treatment.
Shrooms seem to work best when doing at the first sign of the onset of a cycle, or if your are an episodic with predictable cycles, at the mid-point between cycles. Many only need to take enough for a "two-beer buzz." We need controlled research. It could be that a larger dose may help some, but only up to a point.
EA -- Seems like you took 5 or 6 grams for that first big trip, and last dose you used three. What trip level did you reach on three grams?
I've rambled enough...
-tommyD
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eyes_afire
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Re: Shrooms: The EA Experience
« Reply #96 on: Aug 17th, 2002, 12:13pm » |
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Hi TommyD. I estimate the 3g doses have been yielding trip level 3. The stash from my initial harvest is as potent as ever after 5 weeks of storage. I submit as evidence:
Obvious visual distortions/hallucinations - watching TV I see faces growing out of faces, american football players melting upon contact with each other, fat distorted blobby people on TV, auditory hallucinations (peoples voices becoming fast or slow), strobe-like auditory effects, and time-passing extremely slowly. Plus of course intensely bright colors, patters, and visual blurring and warping.
Dosing has become rather relaxing for me plus I know the CH beast can't touch me while tripping. A recent dose actually stopped one of my worst CH attacks, cold in it's tracks. The CH beast has tried to breakthru while under the influence but could never quite manage.
All of those above effects sound rather intimidating, but they are not (at least to me anyways... I have had much more fearsome nightmares). Tripping at level 3 is not even close in intensity to tripping at level 4 or 5. The Trip Scale is exponential, not linear. But TommyD is right: If you fear, then don't partake. I HATE HATE HATE CH beast, so even if I didn't enjoy the trips, a 5 hour trip once a week would still be worth it.
Coping with trips:
1. Plan ahead. Get comfortable. Pillows are good. Take a pee first. Arrange to have ambient music or video images... nothing with a 'heavy', deep, or intense storyline. Set aside time where you will have no responsibilities.
2. Check your mind. Realize and convince yourself that what you are about to do will cause perceptual distortions.
3. Have confidence. While tripping, trust in the preparations you have made. Sometimes I have thought: 'do I have to go to work soon?', but then I tell myself that I have planned well and that shouldn't be a concern.
4. Remain passive. During trip, don't make any important decisions, don't perform any weighty actions. Don't leave your home, just stay there. If you start getting agitated, dismiss negative thoughts and surrender to the trip. Enjoy, it will soon end anyway and everything will be normal.
5. If you fear, then don't partake. Shrooms amplify emotions and perceptions during trip:
EA (during trip): "Sis, is it going to rain?"
Sis: "I don't know, let me look out the window."
(Sis looks out the window)
Sis: "Nope, doesn't look like it."
(5 minutes pass and it starts raining)
(EA smiles)
My perceptions were enhanced, I could detect the slight decrease in ambient light due to impending rainstorm where others could not. Also my sense of smell is greatly heightened.
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