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Topic: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo (Read 8116 times) |
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notseinfeld
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Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« on: Mar 27th, 2002, 1:14am » |
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Look at me still feeling creative 
The scoop: My shrooms are just not quite ready yet and in desperation (7 full months, multi-daily no breaks) my gal and I sucked up some unknowns from Seattle. Rumor was they were potent and wrapped in on gram foil.
I boiled 2 grams for 10 minutes at 8:30 this evening and from it made 2 cups of tea. Since I had not ingested hallucinogens in 10 years or so I wanted to err on the side of being somewhat straight.
Got the upset stomach, then some discomfort, but it was worth it. This lasted for about 1.5 hrs and the following 3-4 were smooooothe and comfortable.
Then: I got an ATTACK! That's right, the cluster headache was in full swing as I cleverly detected from Horner's syndrome which always accompanies mine. Amazingly, it was relatively innocuous with only some very minor pain. It lasted for maybe 15 minutes and was gone. My nostril cleared up after 30 minutes and I've been fine ever since.
I believe that the pain was due in part to the apprehension of forthcoming pain and not the immediate head tightening. Either way, it was the most glorious attack I've had in better than half a year. It should be noted that any time I'm hit, it's always cripplingly hard/intense. Not so this time.
Out on the porch I did see some unsettling clouds of older men that didn't look happy which were followed by a complete change of mood to mini-giggles and gently breathing flora.
I'll be redosing on just one gram of this same strand on Saturday if needed b/c it's all I have left. Fortunately, I feel confident I can handle 2 grams so when my harvest arrives, I'll do this proper-like 
Will be posting throughout the week on changes in patterns of frequency or severity.
Thanks for your ears--nots
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rick
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #1 on: Mar 27th, 2002, 8:42am » |
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Sounds pretty close to what I've been experiencing the last few days after a couple of solid doses. The beast trying to hit you full throttle, yet unable to do it's job. Feels like we're able to punch it back in the mouth for once, eh? Beautiful thing. About your short supply: remember, Flash has stated that even after some doses of psilocybin, remission might take a little time to kick in. So you may have enough to do the job, and I'll be praying for you/ knocking on wood/ keeping my fingers crossed, etc..- Rick
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Ueli
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #2 on: Mar 27th, 2002, 9:33am » |
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Congrats nots for your success! ;D
However, one point the big shot experts will probably not like is the boiling for 10 minutes, it can destroy much of the psilocybin.
Have a look at The Pink One's Kickass Mushroom Tea Recipe.
Good luck for your next charge,
Ueli
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notseinfeld
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #3 on: Mar 27th, 2002, 8:22pm » |
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Update Day 1:
Arose with the normal morning headache but again, it was waaaay diminished. Faded out after one cup of coffee and 20 minutes as opposed to the usual Pot and a half with +/- 2 hours. I'm *very* encouraged.
Been pain free the entire day since and it's currently 9:20 PM EST.
Strangely my head 'feels' better though is of course unscientific. Even to the neophyte eye, something has changed for the better.
Thanks for the link ueli and glad to be sailing along w/ya rick.
Let's document as much as we can.
seizure,
nots
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rick
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #4 on: Mar 27th, 2002, 10:18pm » |
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We are on the same page, Nots. I've had NO PAIN all day today. I worked a ten hour shift bartending with no break and a good amount of nasty cigarette smoke in my face. I haven't worked a day this long in months. Sending you a virtual high-five.
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nancyc
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #5 on: Mar 27th, 2002, 10:34pm » |
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Nots and Rick..fantastic news...please keep us posted on your progress....sure made me smile.  ps..last shrooms i did, i just mixed them in koolaide and drank them...did not do the tea that time..sort of felt like the old Woodstock days..lol
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notseinfeld
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #6 on: Mar 29th, 2002, 1:42am » |
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Update Day 2-3
Thirty straight hours no attack. Slept all night and arose without a shred of pain.
Was hit with attack today at about 6:00 PM but was tolerable enough that I didn't need any meds. Slight shadow here or there.
Still planning on the redose Saturday.
Things are looking up.
nots
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notseinfeld
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #7 on: Mar 31st, 2002, 5:42pm » |
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Saturday's Dose Down the Hatch!
Awoke with no pain this (sunday) morning. Free and clear all day.
It has been better than 5 days since I've taken any meds and I'm feeling great.
Will post update at the end of this week.
Folks, this is worth a try.
nots
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rick
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #8 on: Mar 31st, 2002, 9:03pm » |
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NOTS-I just wanted to compare notes: I've also taken no meds as far as abortives go since I started the therapy. Well, I took two Aleve about a week and a half ago the day after the first big dose, but I don't think that made much difference. I'm still having some attacks, but they are diminishing in severity each time. Today's was a level 2 that lasted about ten minutes. BEAUTIFUL!!!!! They come on like they're going to pop me hard, then they fizzle out and die before they even get going. No need for meds. Anybody else experience this during therapy? Also, I've felt really fatigued still, even after being off Depakote for nine days and Doxepin for five. Anyone know if this is atypical from going off these meds? A result of psilocybin in my system? My assumption is that my body is feeling the effects of being on meds for four straight months.-RICK
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| « Last Edit: Mar 31st, 2002, 9:04pm by rick » |
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pinksharkmark
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #9 on: Apr 1st, 2002, 2:07am » |
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on Mar 31st, 2002, 9:03pm, rick wrote:| Also, I've felt really fatigued still, even after being off Depakote for nine days and Doxepin for five. Anyone know if this is atypical from going off these meds? A result of psilocybin in my system? |
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It is not unusual to feel fatigued the day after a large dose of psilocybin, especially if you didn't get a lot of sleep that night. Best thing to do after a big dose is to sleep at least 10 hours if possible.
But if you are still feeling fatigued, that is not from psilocybin in your system. All traces of psilocybin, psilocin, and their metabolites are gone from the body within 24 hours. Some people report feeling detached or serene or peaceful or "unmotivated" for a few days after a big dose, but that is not the same as being fatigued. This serenity usually lasts at most three days or so, since it is an attitude change brought on by the psychedelic experience and is hard to maintain for long.
pinky
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Ted
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #10 on: Apr 1st, 2002, 2:35am » |
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Pink, as we surmise it's worked for me. As I'm guessing my time is up with it working and I'm looking for some back-up to go with my gram in back-up. I'm as scarily and painfully back where I was when I did them last summer. I sit here praying it wasn't a major coincidence in timing and I will get to keep my life by doing it again (If not, I'm renting the movie Charlie... I think that's the one about the retarded guy who takes the medication and becomes normal and then it wears off and he becomes retarded again, completely destroying him for having to go back to how he was?). Anyway, we think it might be what worked for me and I'll be trying it again. I'm only lost on something you said here that just doesn't match up with logic. You said that psilo lasts no longer than 24 hours in the system but yet some people feel the "peacefulness" or detachment and unmotivatedness for 3 days. Why, if it's gone from the system in 24 hours? Bear in mind, I'm not asking from some moralistic or upset-they-didn't-work-for-me view, both which you've had some recent resistance on. But I am asking from a question of how that can be synthesized.
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pinksharkmark
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #11 on: Apr 1st, 2002, 3:41am » |
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on Apr 1st, 2002, 2:35am, Ted wrote:| I'm only lost on something you said here that just doesn't match up with logic. You said that psilo lasts no longer than 24 hours in the system but yet some people feel the "peacefulness" or detachment and unmotivatedness for 3 days. Why, if it's gone from the system in 24 hours? |
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This effect is a psychological rather than a physiological one, and is found only when someone takes a BIG dose... enough to produce a "mystical enlightenment" experience. It happens with big doses of LSD and mescaline as well, but it is by no means a universal reaction.
This psychological "readjustment" is similar to that induced by fasting or meditation or sensory-deprivation tanks or other consciousness-altering techniques, and just as transitory. The change in attitude is a result of looking at life in a different manner rather than any actual chemical reaction. As the memory of the enlightenment grasped during the experience inevitably fades, so does the mood of serenity.
I imagine it is analagous to the mood experienced by those who have experienced a religious epiphany.
pinky
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Ted
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #12 on: Apr 1st, 2002, 4:08am » |
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on Apr 1st, 2002, 3:41am, pinksharkmark wrote:
This effect is a psychological rather than a physiological one, and is found only when someone takes a BIG dose... enough to produce a "mystical enlightenment" experience... This psychological "readjustment" is similar to that induced by fasting or meditation... |
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OK. That I can relate to.
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Flash
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #13 on: Apr 1st, 2002, 4:39pm » |
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I've had the serenity thing even with small doses. It seems to coincide with when I haven't taken any hallucinogenics for a long time. It is very distinct from fatigue, and ususally lasts 1-3 days. According to EROWID metabolates of psilocybin and LSD can still be detected 3-4 days after dosing. This kind of ties in with the shutting the door effect. I have never tried the drugs exactly 3-4 days apart, but I can vouch that 1-2 days don't work and 5-7 days does.
It is possible to have a profound experience on even small doses of hallucinogen, it all depends on the context and setting. I will concede that profound experiences become manditory from level 3 onwards.
Ted - don't worry. It's too much of a coincidence. Very few people haven't been helped by hallucinogens. Just make sure to detox first... as you'll be aware it is well worth the extra grief. I should add that it's best to dose when in remission, this will postpone the next attack for some time, and is significantly more effective based on my own personal experience.
Rick - my guess is the fatigue is due to being on other medications for so long. Hallucinogens are such a low dose that they are unable to affect anything other than your 5-HT receptors.
Flash
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MikeE
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #14 on: Apr 1st, 2002, 6:43pm » |
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Quote:| I should add that it's best to dose when in remission this will postpone the next attack |
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Flash you and pinky are great for all the info you have provided in this area. I thought I had seen where a episodic should dose at the first sign of the next cycle. Do you agree with this or are you saying one should dose on a PF day just to keep the PF days comming. respect your opnion I am 3 days PF at the end of 6 week cycle. Going to try this for first time next bout with the beast. thanks MikeE
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Ted
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #15 on: Apr 2nd, 2002, 2:54am » |
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[quote author=Flash link=board=meds;num=1017213301;start=0#13 date=04/01/02 at 16:39:13Ted - don't worry. It's too much of a coincidence. Very few people haven't been helped by hallucinogens. Just make sure to detox first... as you'll be aware it is well worth the extra grief. I should add that it's best to dose when in remission, this will postpone the next attack for some time, and is significantly more effective based on my own personal experience. [quote]
I'm all detoxed. Meds just don't happen to do shit for me so I've been off them for quite some time. So, their is no extra grief from me going there. I also get no remission, so there is no postponing of a next attack. there is only slowing them down some. For a chronic not medically episodic, that's good enough. Two attacks a day, maybe skipping a day? That is managable. That is something where I can have my life back and presumably not get hit at work, often. that is the most beautiful thing I can think of. Episodic? Hell. That's a pipe dream. getting them as described above is the most wonderful way I can think of them.
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Ted
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #16 on: Apr 2nd, 2002, 3:05am » |
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on Apr 1st, 2002, 4:39pm, Flash wrote:| Ted - don't worry. It's too much of a coincidence. Very few people haven't been helped by hallucinogens. Just make sure to detox first... as you'll be aware it is well worth the extra grief. I should add that it's best to dose when in remission, this will postpone the next attack for some time, and is significantly more effective based on my own personal experience. |
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I'm all detoxed. Meds just don't happen to do shit for me so I've been off them for quite some time. So, their is no extra grief from me going there. I also get no remission, so there is no postponing of a next attack. there is only slowing them down some. For a chronic not medically episodic, that's good enough. Two attacks a day, maybe skipping a day? That is managable. That is something where I can have my life back and presumably not get hit at work, often. that is the most beautiful thing I can think of. Episodic? Hell. That's a pipe dream. getting them as described above is the most wonderful way I can think of them.
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notseinfeld
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #17 on: Apr 4th, 2002, 8:36am » |
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Terrifice Ted---I see some similarities with our conditions.
Will be taking 3rd and final next week. Here's how it stands:
Been medication free since last Tuesday, the time of Dosage 1.
Been attack free since Saturday, the time of Dosage 2.
Currently I'm experiencing mild annoyance pain immediately upon waking up in the morning, but only every 'other' day. This is quite odd.
During waking hours it sometimes feels as though the CH is trying to get me but just can't. There has been clear and marked improvement both times and I believe D3 will put this bastard to bed for good. It's great to have a life back!
nots
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Not4Hire
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #18 on: Apr 4th, 2002, 1:36pm » |
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From one "Not..." to another:
I am a newbie to the list but not to CH. Had ny first CH in'96 and then yearly-mostly in the Spring-and lasting from 5-8 weeks. Was diagnosed on my second cycle and directed to O2--works for me as abortive. I might add that my Beast goes from *ambient* Kip3-5 then almost instantly to K8-10. O2 works at 11-12/lpm for 15-20 mins, but I feel like its getting less effective. Used to be gone in 10 minutes or less. I am going through 2-3 *S* tanks (154 cu.ft.) of O2 per week and this is pretty xpensive.($25/tank)
Some background on the meds I am currently taking:
--Indomethacin for arthritic knees(@75mg/day in time release cap)
--Atenolol/Chlor100/25-Subst, for Tenoretic(Tenormin) 100/25 (for high blood pressure-@1/day
--Norvasc @5mg/day for high blood pressure
--Zoloft @100mg/day for depression.
None of these was prescribed for CH, but I see that some people do take them for CH. My whole story would take a long time to write, but I am VERY interested in the shroom treatment.
Now I don't want to go to the "What's Your Excuse" thread as far as maybe the info is available elsewhere, but I have diligently searched w/o any luck in answering this question:
Do I need to detox from the above listed drugs before I try shrooms? If so, for how long?
Thanks in advance for any info or a push in the right direction.
Best...Steve
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pinksharkmark
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #19 on: Apr 4th, 2002, 2:55pm » |
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on Apr 4th, 2002, 1:36pm, Not4Hire wrote:Some background on the meds I am currently taking:
--Indomethacin for arthritic knees(@75mg/day in time release cap)
--Atenolol/Chlor100/25-Subst, for Tenoretic(Tenormin) 100/25 (for high blood pressure-@1/day
--Norvasc @5mg/day for high blood pressure
--Zoloft @100mg/day for depression.
None of these was prescribed for CH, but I see that some people do take them for CH. My whole story would take a long time to write, but I am VERY interested in the shroom treatment.
Do I need to detox from the above listed drugs before I try shrooms? If so, for how long? |
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See the thirteenth post in this thread:
http://www.clusterheadaches.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=general;acti on=display;num=1015619804
"Recreational" users of psilocybin mushrooms commonly report that Zoloft will greatly lessen the effects of the psychedelics. Wean yourself of the Zoloft before dosing with mushrooms. You should have no Zoloft at all for a few days before dosing, in my opinion.
I think it unlikely that Indomethacin will make a difference, since it is an NSAID, but that is just a guess.
Atenolol is a beta blocker. Other beta blockers such as propanolol have been reported by recreational users to INCREASE the effects of psilocybin. Not a good idea to have any in your system before taking mushrooms.
Norvasc is a calcium channel blocker. It may or may not interfere with psilocybin. My guess is that it won't, but that is just a guess.
Again, it must be noted that there are no clinical studies on the interaction of psilocybin with ANY of the meds you have listed. My advice is just that... advice. I am not a physician, or even a pharmacist.
As has been pointed out on numerous occasions, the folks who have the most success with psilocybin are the folks who are COMPLETELY free of all other meds. If it were me, I would at least taper off and stop the Zoloft and Atenolol.
pinky
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Not4Hire
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Thanks to Pinky
« Reply #20 on: Apr 4th, 2002, 3:52pm » |
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Yep--that's what I needed to know. I thought I had read all of the shroomery pages, but I missed that one. I never wanted to start the Zoloft in the first place, but I was having a lot of trouble not bursting into tears spontaneously at times. For example, 9/11 just kicked my ass. Couldn't leave the house for a couple weeks afterwards.
I can live with the tinnitus (ringing in my ears) that is an effect of my high blood pressure long enough to give the treatment a try. Now to deal with the actual mechanics of The Cure. I'll stay in touch and I'm contacting Myco Environment Bag folks.
Stay in touch and many thanks. Best...Steve
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Tom
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #21 on: Apr 7th, 2002, 6:51am » |
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Hi Pinky,
a comment to your following remark regarding the tapering of drugs before ingesting shrooms:
"I think it unlikely that Indomethacin will make a difference, since it is an NSAID, but that is just a guess" - yes, it's true that indo i s "only" a NSAID, but it's also n o t true, because indo is an INDOLE derivative, too, which is a very interesting fact ! Its chemical formula is:
1-(4-chlorobenzoyl)-5-methoxy- 2-methyl-1-H-INDOLE-3-acetic acid.
Unlike in the hallucinogenic indole derivatives, the indomethacin's nitrogen in the position 1 of the 4-C part of the indole's double ring is s u b s t i t u t e d, a feature you never find in hallucinogenics, as far as I could observe. Nevertheless, indo easily can provoke acute psychoses in patients with a history of a psychotic desease !
Thus, I guess that indo w o u l d interact with psilo with a high probability in some way - but I certainly can not predict if increasing or decreasing the psilo effect as I don't know whether it attaches at serotonin receptors or not.
Eventually an interesting puzzle: Does indo work for CPH because of its indole structure ?????
Questions over questions...
And for Steve: Be careful, stopping blood pressure medication
abruptly may cause a rebound with extremely high
pressure peaks !
Thomas
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| « Last Edit: Apr 7th, 2002, 8:04am by Tom » |
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pinksharkmark
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #22 on: Apr 7th, 2002, 9:45am » |
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on Apr 7th, 2002, 6:51am, Tom wrote:| Unlike in the hallucinogenic indole derivatives, the indomethacin's nitrogen in the position 1 of the 4-C part of the indole's double ring is s u b s t i t u t e d, a feature you never find in hallucinogenics, as far as I could observe. |
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I was not aware it was an indole-based compound. It does indeed have indole as part of its core structure, but due to the substitution at position 1, I cannot see how it would bind to any subclass of 5-HT receptor site. It bears little resemblance to the tryptamines or phenethylamines. Here is a molecular diagram:
http://www.home.duq.edu/~harrold/Chem3D/indomethacin.jpg
Quote:| Nevertheless, indo easily can provoke acute psychoses in patients with a history of a psychotic desease ! |
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I knew there was a risk of psychosis in elderly patients, particularly those with senile dementia (Alzheimer's disease), but have there not also been some studies using it to ALLEVIATE Alzheimer's?
Quote:| Thus, I guess that indo w o u l d interact with psilo with a high probability in some way - but I certainly can not predict if increasing or decreasing the psilo effect as I don't know whether it attaches at serotonin receptors or not. |
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Perhaps one of the metabolites of Indomethacin is capable of binding to a 5-HT site? Thanks for the information. This reinforces the wisdom of detoxing from ALL other meds before trying psilocybin.
Quote:| Eventually an interesting puzzle: Does indo work for CPH because of its indole structure ????? |
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Or is the relief actually achieved by one of the breakdown products (metabolites) instead? Envision, for example, the remaining molecule after a cleavage at the nitrogen atom. Much closer to the typical tryptamine/phenethylamine configuration.
Thanks again for this information, Tom. It is very valuable and thought-provoking!
pinky
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Not4Hire
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #23 on: Apr 7th, 2002, 10:05am » |
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regarding Indomethacin/other meds on: Today at 6:11am
I sent this message(IM) to Tom this AM but thought maybe it should be here, too. The question still stands--how long?
And you guys are so far past my ken--(....a cleavage of the nitrogen atom....sheesh! is THAT what's goin on in my head?)
I'm sending this due to the fact that y'all are kinda talking about me. I have no problem detoxxing from my meds when I can get/cultivate some shrooms, but I can't find out how long to stop before I actually do the deed. Can you push me in the right direction or do YOU know how long?
Acute psychosis sounds pretty ominous altho I do NOT have a history of psychosis. I'm just naturally a bit crazy, y'know?
Thanks for the feedback in any case...
Best...Steve
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Re: Notseinfeld's Notes on the Mushroom Mambo
« Reply #24 on: Apr 7th, 2002, 12:27pm » |
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Pinky and Steve,
thanks for your replies !
Steve, I'll try to give you some more informations about your meds in about 5 hours because I have to leave now, so long !
Thomas
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Thomas/Munich
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test rss