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Jarvis
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The french and Germans
« on: Mar 25th, 2003, 10:53pm » |
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France: Chirac has said that france should play a large part in rebuilding postwar Iraq. He says that the beligerant americans and brits should not have such a large role. . Germany: The german people are boycotting american products. Coca-cola is one. The cola is bottled and distributed in germany by the german people. So are most products on the boycott list in some way made in germany. Maybe we should boycott chrysler, volkswagen or alcatel and put tens of thousands of americans out of work too as the germans own a large share of them. ........................................................................ ...... It never ceases to amaze me as to how people arrive at conclusions. Its a world economy now folks. Any boycott by any country will invariably hurt their own in one way or another. What I dont understand is why none of the countries ever boycott the billions of dollars in aide packages that the US gives out. I wish I could stop the payments. Turkey thought about it then changed their mind for a measly 70 million or so. Gives me a headache. Mideast countries just last year alone recieved over 15 billion $. They dont like us. Why give? The combined world maket for spices, frankinsence and mir maybe 700 mil$. Oil trillions. We and the coalition are their economies, their contractors, their producers. They all need to give us a hug and say thankyou. Just rambling.
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cootie
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #1 on: Mar 25th, 2003, 11:08pm » |
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I hate protestors and boycots so I am boycoting all protesters......and protesting people that boycot. Pam-Coots-anti-boycot-anti-protester
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sailpappy
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #2 on: Mar 26th, 2003, 8:54am » |
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;D ;D I asked a friend of mine who is in his 80's who was in the Korean War and World War II to give me a little history lesson and his thoughts today on War. I am sharing this because it is a different look at the War. It is not my opinion just thoughts from an honorable man that lived through two Wars and that I have a great respect for. Thoughts to think about:
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I'm not going to get into a history lesson. The short, short version is that the League of Nations (established after WW I to prevent wars) failed to stop Mussolini's Italy from invading and conquering Ethiopia. It failed to stop Japan from invading and conquering Manchuria and much of China. Their committees wrung their hands spoke in platitudes but did absolutely nothing to stop war.
At France's coaxing Britain's prime minister Nevil Chamberlain met with
Adolph Hitler in Munich and surrendered the Sudetenland to Nazi Germany in
the interest of "peace in our time." The French and British watched as Germany took Austria, Czechoslovakia, Yugoslavia. They all had committee meetings and wrung their hands and talked of peace.
World War II erupted when Nazi Germany invaded Poland. Britain had a mutual defense treaty with Poland so they couldn't escape. They declared war
on Germany. Germany had a mutual defense treaty with Japan so Japan declared war on Britain. France wet their pants and surrendered to Germany as fast as they could and gleefully shipped all the Jews they could find to death camps in Germany to prove to Adolph that they really were on the side of Germany.
Japan attacked the United States and, because of Japan's mutual defense
treaty with Germany, Germany declared war on the United States.
Up until December 7th and the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor, a large number of our people were wringing their hands and saying, "Appease Hitler. He is really a good guy who just needed a little more land for his expanding population. The dear man just wants peace. And World War II was in full swing leaving better than 50,000,000 people dead including about 450,000 American soldiers and sailors.
Three cheers for the League of Nations!
After World War II it was decided to do the whole thing all over again.
This time we would call it the United Nations and we will have committee
meetings and hand wringing parties and make sure peace prevails throughout
the land.
While that august body wrung hands the Soviet Union split Germany, invaded Poland and Yugoslavia, Rumania, Hungary and Bulgaria along with Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia. The peaceful world saw Korea with 37,000 American soldiers killed, over 1,000,000 South Korean soldiers and civilians killed and the country nearly destroyed.
Since then we have had over 50,000 American soldiers killed in Vietnam
and have fought wars in Somalia, Herzegovenia, Panama, Granada, plus the Gulf War when Iraq invaded Kuwait.
We should have gone into Baghdad and taken out that evil regime then but the United Nations would have no part of that. All they would allow was for us to chase the Iraqis out of Kuwait, then peace would prevail.
Now, here we are with Saddam violating all 17 United Nations resolutions while he has massed poison gas and bio weapons.
He is frantically trying to develop a nuke and his buddy, Kim Jong-Il of North
Korea may give him a few. (It was the United Nations who prevented us from
taking North Korea when the war was hot and we had the means to do it.)
Peace!!!!!!!! Sure.
France is wetting their collective pants in fear that the United States will take Saddam out and along with him, France's 60 billion dollar contracts with Iraq. Russia hedges because Iraq owes them 6 billion dollars that they sorely need.
In answer to your question....... hell yes we should go to war with Iraq. We should have done it six months ago. We should also get out of the United Nations. Can you believe that the United Nations has appointed Iraq and Syria to head up the United Nations Disarmament Committee? Can you believe they have appointed Libya to head up the Human Rights Committee?
All three of these countries are on the UN List of Terrorist States.............Absolutely unbelievable.
Just don't get me going. Throughout recorded history the only time peace has prevailed is when the good guys have militarily whipped the bad guys. Who are our best friends in the world? Japan because we whipped them. Germany because we whipped them. Italy because we whipped them. Britain because we whipped them.
This is one opinion, on the War but this is the eyes, ears and heart of an American Veteran... Pappy
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| « Last Edit: Mar 26th, 2003, 12:27pm by sailpappy » |
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brain_cramps
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #3 on: Mar 26th, 2003, 9:29am » |
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Pappy:
I realize this is not your opinion, just thoughts from an honorable man that lived through two Wars and that you have a great respect for.
I'm also glad that you're not going to get into a history lesson.
In general, most of what your friend said made sense, but...
I really hope that neither you nor your friend believes the following to be true:
on Mar 26th, 2003, 8:54am, sailpappy wrote:| France wet their pants and surrendered to Germany as fast as they could and gleefully shipped all the Jews they could find to death camps in Germany to prove to Adolph that they really were on the side of Germany. |
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BarbaraD
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #4 on: Mar 26th, 2003, 11:03am » |
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Today, I'm staying home from work because of a CH and watching the damn war. At least when I go to work I can get away from it for a few hours.
Viet Nam changed all of us who are old enough to have lived through it. I lost friends, family and spent a lot of sleepless days and nights during those awful years. The boys that came home I greeted with open arms and tears, but they've never been the same and neither have I. I was against that war from the beginning and never saw any reason for it. I've still never seen a reason for it.
I feel the same way about this new war. I don't think there's anything in the mid-east worth one american life. We're losing our kids over there and there's a lot of mothers in American losing sleep and I just don't think it's worth it. The Arabs have been tending to their rat-killing for over 4000 years without our help and I just feel they can keep right on tending to it. We need to tend to our own country and leave the rest of the world alone.
As far as the UN is concerned - all they do is talk. Let them. I'm more worried about Ms. Smith down the street from me who can't afford to eat and buy her medicine at the same time. I'd lot rather see our tax money spent on her than on some dictator in a country that has a lot of oil. Get rid of the envirolmentilist lobbies and drill our own oil and forget about those people's oil. Let them go broke.
As far as the Germans and French are concerned. I've lived in both countries and, trust me, the French didn't like us 40 years ago - what makes you think they would like us now. As far as the German's go - we've got troops all over Germany so yes, we're putting money into their economy ((France kicked us out). They have an opinion and are stating it, no unlike a lot of people here. I have a German exchange student (a kid who lived with me for a year) that I talk to frequently. He doesn't hate Americans, but is opposed to the war. We discuss it openly without hostility, so I have no hard feelings against the Germans because they state their opinion. They think we're wrong for being in Iraq - I agree with that one. It's not against the normal American - it's against our President and Congress.
Right now, my heart goes out to the mothers of the kids who are in the mid-east fighting for something that I think history will prove to accomplish nothing. I think 100 years from now, Iraq will still have a dictatorship (not Saddam, but maybe someone worse). And I just hope George Bush is losing as much sleep as those mothers are right now.
But that's just the opinion of a mother and this is America and I'm still entitled to an opinion whether it's popular or not. I've just seen too many wars and what it does to people. Let's all just pray that our kids come home safe.
Hugs BD
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sailpappy
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #5 on: Mar 26th, 2003, 12:22pm » |
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;D ;D Your right as I stated this is from an 80 year old Man that still has the Old school attitude. But you can read the history books and varify the stuff he said, I will bet you that he is pretty darn close to right on the money, he has a very sharpe memory and is very well educated, was the CEO of a large company for a life time and he knows of what he speaks.
As far as the French go, they would be chomping at the bit if that had been the Eiffel tower that got slammed by one of those Jet planes, or if they had unleashed some poisonous gas in the subway, or dropped a plane into the Louve. Again they started the Viet Nam war and I don't know why we got involved there, I think it was to try to stop communist china from over throwing that part of the country.
But this Iraq situation is a different thing all together, If we don't stop this terrorist mentality now you can kiss this top of the Line life style good by and we will be living like the res of the world where 10 year olds carry automatic weapons to stay alive! Crack was a bad problem but you just don't turn your back on terrorism! Someone has to stop it and our country has the resolve to do it! JMHO Pappy
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Slammy
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #6 on: Mar 26th, 2003, 3:47pm » |
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I agree....
When I got over the initial shock of 9/11, I stated that our world, and the way we view it, has changed monumentally forever. This Iraqi crisis, and our foreign policy, are just a few examples of it. Prior to 9/11, we would have continued to exhaust political avenues prior to engaging in war. We would have never thought of splitting NATO, as well as the Security Council of the UN.
Our Nation's tolerance for third world leaders like the Taliban, Saddaam, Kadhafi, Arafat, etc., that continue to support those that terrorize the United States, here and abroad, has significantly diminished. Our arrogance may have contributed to their hatred of the United States. But it is the same arrogance that will not allow diplomatic impotency internationally, to allow such hatred to turn to terrorism, and fester until another 9/11 act occurs.
Slammy 
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WendyHowe
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #7 on: Mar 26th, 2003, 7:00pm » |
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"Who are our best friends in the world? Japan because we whipped them. Germany because we whipped them. Italy because we whipped them. Britain because we whipped them."
Did I miss something? When did the USA whip Britain?
Wendy
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Not4Hire
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #8 on: Mar 26th, 2003, 7:25pm » |
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.....uh, sorry Wendy, but we *bloody colonials* DID win our War of Independence over jolly ol' England...... ;D ;D ;D
....but it's all better now,.... and I, for one, thank Mr. Blair and your brave warriors for their contribution to the fight.....
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Jarvis
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #9 on: Mar 26th, 2003, 7:27pm » |
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"The british are coming the british are coming". we wupped the brits back in the 1700's. 1775-1786 The revolutionary war if I remember right. When we gained our independence. July 4th 1776 independence day. No hard feelings. we still play well together.
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| « Last Edit: Mar 26th, 2003, 7:29pm by Jarvis » |
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WendyHowe
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #10 on: Mar 26th, 2003, 7:31pm » |
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F..k, forgot about that one! It's kind of important too!
Should have listened more in history.
It's so good when our kids grow up to be bigger than us though.
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WendyHowe
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #11 on: Mar 27th, 2003, 6:27pm » |
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Apologies again about forgetting that we used to oppress you.
To make amends, saw a great documentary this evening on UK TV. This may seem very trivial but at the time it wasn't and it is something else to bash the French with.
Did you know that the French and Germans have throughout history blamed the USA for starting the Flu epidemic in the World War that killed over 50 million people (really, honestly - it killed nearly as many people as the war itself) They claimed that when the USA joined the war, their servicemen came armed with guns and this virus and therefore should have stayed away.
Well, this documentary had pretty good proof that it was the French who started it at their camp in Etaples because they kept pigs there and the virus mutated through the pigs to humans.
I'll go away and stop drivelling now.
Wendy (Je n'aime pas les grenouillles)
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Aussie
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #12 on: Mar 27th, 2003, 6:45pm » |
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Wendy
Quote:| French who started it at their camp in Etaples because they kept pigs there and the virus mutated through the pigs to humans. |
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Always thought that the French were swines !!
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Mark C
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #13 on: Mar 27th, 2003, 6:54pm » |
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It appears France will be a Muslim Nation soon anyway...
"For the first time, a single nationwide organization officially recognized by the French government will speak for the country's 5 million Muslims."
Click here for story
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sailpappy
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #14 on: Mar 27th, 2003, 8:05pm » |
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;D ;DWendy,
Your right on top of things, that Flu epidemic killed people, so fast here in the US that they could'nt bury the victims fast enough.
People were dying buy the truckload everyday, and yet we sacraficed to go defend freedom in the mist of that too.
I don't mean to bash anyone, just a little odd that the nations that have been helped so much by the cost of freedom hesitate to step up to the plate and help end a pleague that will consume us all if left unchecked.
Obviously the people here laying in the street pretending to be dead bodies haven't a clue of the stupidity in that action.
We live such a pampered life here that many don't understand what its like to have commando's storm into your home at their will and take the boys of any age to fight or face having their whole family being executed.
God Forbid we should have to sit at a stop light for 5 minutes or allow another person in a hurry to cut infront of us in traffic, these curtosies seem so silly in the over all scheme of things, Go to the library and check out some video's(National Geographic's) on 3rd world countries and take a look, I will bet you will see children with automatic weapons in most of them, Gee I wonder why?? Sorry for the sermon, wish we could all just get along for the good of the world and share the good things. until we are invaded by aliens from another world that will never happen, only then will we have a common enough bond to put aside all the hostilities and try to save our planet. Pappy
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| « Last Edit: Mar 27th, 2003, 8:35pm by sailpappy » |
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WendyHowe
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #15 on: Mar 27th, 2003, 8:10pm » |
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I'm with you Pappy
The only difference between us is I do mean to bash now. I'm fed up with being polite. I even defended the French on here a while ago.
I am beyond furious with them now and hope we never get into a situation where our soldiers die for them again. they don't fu..ing deserve it.
Wendy
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Jarvis
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #16 on: Mar 27th, 2003, 9:12pm » |
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The post by Mark C. made me curious as to the muslim populations in the U.S. The state department estimates 6 million muslims in the us. 77% are imigrants from all parts of the world. The muslim population through conversion not including immigration and births, is expected to increase in the area of 17 - 20 thousand per year and by the year 2010 the faith of islam will be number 2 in the US behind christianity. The jewish faith will be #3. Does this have relevancy to anything? Dont know but it is one of our basic rights, freedom of religion showing through.
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| « Last Edit: Mar 27th, 2003, 9:21pm by Jarvis » |
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Mark C
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #17 on: Mar 27th, 2003, 9:43pm » |
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on Mar 27th, 2003, 8:05pm, sailpappy wrote:| until we are invaded by aliens from another world that will never happen, only then will we have a common enough bond to put aside all the hostilities and try to save our planet. |
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BORG
;D
Just playing around Pappy......good stuff you have offered.
PFDAN's
Mark
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Slammy
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #18 on: Mar 28th, 2003, 11:27am » |
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on Mar 27th, 2003, 8:10pm, WendyHowe wrote:
The only difference between us is I do mean to bash now. I'm fed up with being polite.
Wendy |
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Go for it, Wendy..... Fuck them! They never liked us anyway! ;D
Slammy
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WendyHowe
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Have I just f..ing heard right.
We have just had a news bulletin where Fleischer, your White House Press spokesman has said that when questioned, Chirac has 'declined to say which side he hopes will win'.
I am so f..ing furious now I can't find anything other than swear words which will be censored.
Bleeping badgerwank. What is that a..hole on?
Wendy
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TomM
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #20 on: Mar 28th, 2003, 12:37pm » |
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on Mar 27th, 2003, 8:05pm, sailpappy wrote:| We live such a pampered life here that many don't understand what its like to have commando's storm into your home at their will and take the boys of any age to fight or face having their whole family being executed. |
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Pappy--you write so eloquently and yet hold the truth close to your heart. I truly enjoy reading your posts. Please continue.
TomM
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sailpappy
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #21 on: Mar 30th, 2003, 9:04am » |
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;D ;D First I'd like to say thanks to MarkC for the emphasis on what I meant by what it will take to unite the world "The Borg" Humorious, yet tittilatingly poinient, Science Fiction now, but just look at the Old Comics from the 60's It won't be too long to "Beam me up Charlie!!(Not Scotty- I'm including our clan)" then it will be Captain Ueli to the Bridge!
Secondly, I would like to Thank Tom M, for your comment's, you can't imagine how much that meant to me at this juncture im my life!
This is what I love about cyberspace, even an Ill-tempered Old Codger(52) with a GED and a Degree from Purina Brand Pet foods(Just Joking) can level out the playing field and voice an opinion with highly educated people and not feel too out of place, Thanks everyone for allowing me to be a part of this Family.
For those of you that know all the facts about me and my illnesses, well--Thanks for making my life so rich here in the last quarter! I Love You All! Even you Jonny!
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Pappy
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| « Last Edit: Mar 30th, 2003, 9:12am by sailpappy » |
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kissmyglass
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #22 on: Mar 30th, 2003, 9:52am » |
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Escargot fuck yourself
Kev
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jonny
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #23 on: Mar 30th, 2003, 1:51pm » |
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on Mar 30th, 2003, 9:04am, sailpappy wrote:| I Love You All! Even you jonny |
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LOL.....You got me to smile, Pappy ;D
.............................jonny
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Jarvis
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Re: The french and Germans
« Reply #24 on: Mar 30th, 2003, 2:39pm » |
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The greatest education comes from the school of life Pappy and you appear to hold a PHD.
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