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Topic: This is messed up! (Read 1398 times) |
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nani
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Re: This is messed up!
« Reply #25 on: May 2nd, 2008, 6:14pm » |
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on May 2nd, 2008, 3:33pm, Paul98 wrote:
It is also a cultural practice. Dosen't make it right.
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My point exactly. Value judgements can be dangerous though.
Think of the genocide of the natives of the New World. Savages according to those who judged, and then conquered them.
Or the Jews in the hands of the Nazis.
Or more recently... was the impetus of the 9/11 attacks a value judgement made by some about Western culture?
Shaky ground, I say.
True liberty means that I can choose to participate in my cultural or religious traditions without judgement by others, and choose not to without judgement by my own.
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Brew
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Re: This is messed up!
« Reply #26 on: May 2nd, 2008, 6:18pm » |
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So it's just as wrong to make a value judgement about what European settlers did to Native Americans or what the Nazis did to the Jews?
We make value judgements all the time. Whether it fits the mold or not, some things are right and some things are wrong - all of the time. I don't care whether or not they are defined by someone's culture.
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LeLimey
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Re: This is messed up!
« Reply #27 on: May 2nd, 2008, 6:19pm » |
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And sometimes NOT making value judgements is as bad.. we made a value judgement stopping Hitler, stopping Ethnic cleansing in Romania etc and we have made plenty of value judgements in and on other cultures too.
Value judgements are what some government agencies such as Child Protective Services are all about.
We all make value judgements about others every single day, it's human nature.
Without a doubt, some of the ones we make are trivial - but some ARE wrong and using "culture" as an excuse doesn't validate it.
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nani
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Re: This is messed up!
« Reply #28 on: May 2nd, 2008, 6:23pm » |
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Where did I say it was wrong?
Shaky ground means shaky ground.
It means sometimes it's good, sometimes it's not.
Me? I like to look inward when something bothers me. Really examine it and my feelings.
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Yorky
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Re: This is messed up!
« Reply #29 on: May 2nd, 2008, 6:28pm » |
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on May 1st, 2008, 2:21pm, Paul98 wrote:call me suspicious.....but ....they may be
trying to perfect a bouncing bomb ?
(and before anyone gets on mi case....it was a joke)
pftuall 
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Brew
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Re: This is messed up!
« Reply #30 on: May 2nd, 2008, 6:41pm » |
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on May 2nd, 2008, 6:23pm, nani wrote:Shaky ground means shaky ground.
It means sometimes it's good, sometimes it's not. |
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The way I see it, there's nothing shaky about condemning that which is wrong. I'm on solid ground saying that Hitler was pure evil. I'm on solid ground saying that it's wrong for a woman to be stoned to death for allowing her veil to fall away from her face.
There are plenty of absolute cases of right and wrong. I'm not seeing where making a judgement about them is "shaky ground."
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Paul98
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Re: This is messed up!
« Reply #31 on: May 2nd, 2008, 7:00pm » |
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on May 2nd, 2008, 6:14pm, nani wrote:
My point exactly. Value judgements can be dangerous though.
Think of the genocide of the natives of the New World. Savages according to those who judged, and then conquered them.
Or the Jews in the hands of the Nazis.
Or more recently... was the impetus of the 9/11 attacks a value judgement made by some about Western culture?
Shaky ground, I say.
True liberty means that I can choose to participate in my cultural or religious traditions without judgement by others, and choose not to without judgement by my own. |
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Perhaps I am reading your post wrong but are you saying that the rest of the world should have stayed out of WW2 because we should not have judged the Nazis and what they thought was "right"
Some cultural practices are just wrong! Moraly, socialy and biologicaly. The practice of canibalism was a cultural thing and it was leading to the extinction of a society that practiced it because of Kudu. FEmals circumsision is cultural but is mutilating a human being.
-P.
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Racer1_NC
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Re: This is messed up!
« Reply #32 on: May 2nd, 2008, 7:17pm » |
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on May 2nd, 2008, 6:14pm, nani wrote:| True liberty means that I can choose to participate in my cultural or religious traditions without judgement by others, and choose not to without judgement by my own. |
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To be honest, I would define liberty differently. I'd start by replacing the word "judgement" with "interference" in the above statement.
We all make judgement calls everyday. Some trivial, some life altering.
It shouldn't matter to anyone if they are judged while lawfully pursuing life, liberty, and happiness, It only matters if they are interfered with while doing so.....or interfere with someone else doing the same.
Bill
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andrewjb
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Re: This is messed up!
« Reply #33 on: May 2nd, 2008, 7:23pm » |
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female circumcision is about denial. these babies being droped, are being endowed with a greater presence here on earth. theres a difference. andrew.
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Brew
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Re: This is messed up!
« Reply #34 on: May 2nd, 2008, 8:22pm » |
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on May 2nd, 2008, 7:23pm, andrewjb wrote:| these babies being droped, are being endowed with a greater presence here on earth. |
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What?
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Charlie
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Re: This is messed up!
« Reply #35 on: May 2nd, 2008, 9:45pm » |
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I'm a product of western civilization. I like it. It spreads quickly when cultures allow for differences of opinion. It drives those cultures that do not, nuts.
Charlie
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LeLimey
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Re: This is messed up!
« Reply #36 on: May 3rd, 2008, 4:01am » |
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on May 2nd, 2008, 7:23pm, andrewjb wrote:| ..these babies being droped, are being endowed with a greater presence here on earth... |
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on May 2nd, 2008, 8:22pm, Brew wrote:
I think you'll find he means a greater surface area 
Anyway, you know what? others have a point. If we let these cultures wipe themselves out then think of the money our countries will save in foreign aid
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Kirk
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Re: This is messed up!
« Reply #37 on: May 3rd, 2008, 1:12pm » |
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Congratulations Mahmoud you are the father of a healthy bouncing baby boy!
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andrewjb
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Re: This is messed up!
« Reply #38 on: May 3rd, 2008, 5:32pm » |
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on May 2nd, 2008, 8:22pm, Brew wrote:
sorry for the delay. the video says. " they beleve it will improve their childs health and make them strong ". andrew.
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Brew
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Re: This is messed up!
« Reply #39 on: May 3rd, 2008, 9:22pm » |
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on May 3rd, 2008, 5:32pm, andrewjb wrote:
sorry for the delay. the video says. " they beleve it will improve their childs health and make them strong ". andrew. |
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O-tay. As long as I know that wasn't YOUR opinion.
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Paul98
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Re: This is messed up!
« Reply #40 on: May 3rd, 2008, 10:06pm » |
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on May 3rd, 2008, 1:12pm, Kirk wrote: Congratulations Mahmoud you are the father of a healthy bouncing baby boy!
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LOL Kirk! Just about sums it up! just think if it was a female.........catch cloth would not be there! Life is cheap in some parts of the world.
-P.
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