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wanna_swap_brains
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hows your brain deal with pain
« on: Mar 15th, 2008, 4:16pm » |
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this is hard to explain,i know its me that this is happening to,but when its done its thing its like its not me its happening to but someone i know??after talking to my girlfriend about it she said the same thing happened to her during the birth of our daughter,kinda like your brain is not registering the pain as not to remember it later on.just wondering if anyone else has this or another explaination for it?stuart
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Ray
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #1 on: Mar 15th, 2008, 4:58pm » |
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I'm not a psychologist or anything, but I did take a few classes. I think our minds wish to protect us from further "harm" from the pain but letting us detatch from it. We tend to remember there was pain, but not the actual sensation of the pain to keep us from reliving it.
With CH, though, I've had that painful experience so many times over the years that I can describe the pain I experience and actually "feel" it in my mind.
I don't know if this makes any sense, but I tried!
Ray
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You have my prayers and compassion-I'm right there with you.
Dum tempus habemus, operemur bonum
*While we have the time, let us do good*
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Annette
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #2 on: Mar 15th, 2008, 6:47pm » |
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Yes, its called "denial" and its a powerful coping mechanism for anything too unpleasant for the mind to deal with, be it physical pain or emotional pain.
Whatever works 
Painfree wishes to you.
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Mediocrity knows nothing higher than itself; but talent instantly recognizes genius.
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coach_bill
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #3 on: Mar 15th, 2008, 8:15pm » |
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stuart, i wish i could forget, but i remember every single headache i had, and the 2 minutes i have before the hit actually starts, the panic!! the racing heart, the feeling of ice being shoved up my nose into my brain, i can remember all of it!! but what puzzles me is i cant descibe it too others to where they can understand it, or compare the pain of this shit to anything eles i ever felt, i have had surgeys, broken bones, even pulled a tooth without novacaine, but nothing compares to it. the closest i can think of, it feels like when im getting a tatoo, when the gun is working, times that by about 50, and do it on my eyeball and brain, hope that helps, coach bill.
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| « Last Edit: Mar 15th, 2008, 8:19pm by coach_bill » |
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boy i cant wait till it's my turn to give him a headache. paybacks a bitch
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George_J
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #4 on: Mar 16th, 2008, 2:05am » |
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on Mar 15th, 2008, 4:16pm, wanna_swap_brains wrote:| this is hard to explain,i know its me that this is happening to,but when its done its thing its like its not me its happening to but someone i know??after talking to my girlfriend about it she said the same thing happened to her during the birth of our daughter,kinda like your brain is not registering the pain as not to remember it later on.just wondering if anyone else has this or another explaination for it?stuart |
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Hi Stuart, and welcome.
You can turn this to your advantage.
I'm a long-timer--learning to cope with a hit has helped me more than any single thing. I've posted the stuff below before, but not for a year or so. It seems timely, given your present post. Hope it's of some use:
"Learning to cope with a hit is as valuable as any medication.
No matter what medications or treatments you use, sooner or later you're going to face a hit with nothing but your naked brain. It's common for a CH'r to panic at times like these, and to act in ways that--while not increasing pain, increase the effects and the perception of pain.
Like anything else in life, experience counts. Most of us who've had these for a long time have had to learn how to cope with a hit on our own. I hope that what follows may be of use, and may quicken your ability to take a hit with some measure of aplomb. Try these things--if they work for you, good. If they don't work--well, what have you lost?
First a couple of caveats: This will most likely not shorten a hit, nor will it decrease the actual pain--only the perceived pain. It probably won't work with anything higher than a Kip 8--the intensity is just too high to concentrate on what you're doing.
There is nothing mystical or spiritual about this--it's simply a way to calm yourself and to decrease your perception of pain.
First, accept that you're getting a hit. Denial won't help, and struggling won't help. Go to a quiet, dark place so you can concentrate. You want everything in your visual field to be fuzzy and diffuse. Sharply defined objects can serve as a metaphor for the focus of pain. Although many clusterheads are not light-phobic, darkness helps.
Sit upright. As you know, it's not possible to lie down. Don't pace, don't fight. Extremely difficult to do, I know, but it's worth it. Sit quietly.
Begin to breathe slowly, rhythmically, and deeply, whether or not you're using oxygen. This will serve to calm you, and will increase the oxygen content in your blood.
Consciously relax the individual muscles in your face, scalp and neck, one by one. Continue to breathe slowly and deeply.
Inside the pain, there is a focal point--a knifepoint--most likely behind your eye. Focus your attention on it, and locate it.
Got it? Now gradually shift the focus of your attention to an adjacent area on the headache side where the pain is less intense. My personal favorite is just under the skin on the forehead. Your attention will shift back to the knifepoint again and again, but don't let that upset you or discourage you. Focus your conscious attention away from the knifepoint.
Next and last, begin to move in some rhythmic manner. I turn my neck slightly to "click" over the knot that forms at the base of the neck, over and over. Others rock back and forth. One person I know of on this board hits his leg with his fist.
Be calm. Don't think about much of anything, and above all, don't worry.
The result is a trance-like state where the pain still exists, but your attention is less focused on it. Sooner or later, the hit will end. You know this. Remember. There is life between the hits.
Again, this won't end a hit, nor is it a cure--simply a coping technique. I think of CH hits as if they were storms. There's nothing I can do about them, so I've learned to get through them as best I can. Learning to cope has allowed me to build a crude little shelter out of burlap and sticks where "I" can hide from the worst of the weather.
Talk to Charlie about "Dr. Wright's Circulatory Technique" as well."
All the best,
George
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Ah! The foreigners put on such airs
Wearing the tangerine suits
And their harlequin eyes.
The pain they inspire
Draws in harmonica melodies
And the feathers of birds
Which flame up at their touch.
It all comes to light in the sheer
Debonair.
(Ellen)
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wanna_swap_brains
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #5 on: Mar 16th, 2008, 6:15am » |
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thanks for replies,first thing is i never said i forgot about the pain and dont think i ever will,i think the denial answer is more like it.as im still a novice to all this i dont really know when its gonna be full on or not,i just know when it is full on its time to use an injector and walk round the house for 5-10 mins till its gone,so to georges reply,wow hats off to you mate if you can do that,i dont think i could stay in control that much,and im probably not alone on that one.thanks again,its good to read how others try to deal with it.stuart
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sandie99
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #6 on: Mar 16th, 2008, 7:54am » |
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I recall that the pain was horrific, but when the new hit comes, I'm still bit surprised how horrific it was again... Denial, maybe. Self protection - oh yes!
Sanna
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CH happends, Live anyway! PF days to us all!
"Do what you can and let God take care of the rest. Leave your heart wide open and always wish for the best" (Sanna Hillu)
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BarbaraD
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #7 on: Mar 16th, 2008, 8:25am » |
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You "remember" you had pain but your brain won't "reenact" it so that you actually "feel" it upon remembering it.
My grandmother said you have a baby a minute before you die (the pain is that intense), and the rest of your life you remember that it hurt like hell (and it's something you can throw up to you child) but you don't actually feel the pain over and over thru the years - you just remember it hurt.
Same with the headaches. You remember they hurt and when a new one is about to hit - you KNOW what you're in for, but .... it's a whole new ball game every time.
And we can't describe the pain cause is indescrible. Unless someone has experienced childbirth (the old fashioned way) they don't have a clue about the pain involved in 12-20 hours of "hard labor". Same with CH - unless you've spent 15 min -1 hour in the grip of CH pain there's no way you're gonna understand the pain regardless of how well someone describes it.
My 2 cents...
Hugs BD
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What don't kill ya, Makes ya stonger!
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wanna_swap_brains
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #8 on: Mar 17th, 2008, 12:07pm » |
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good replies thanks,my gf agrees with the bit about what your granny says too bd. stuart
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LivingBarometer
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #9 on: Mar 19th, 2008, 7:12pm » |
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I can't remember the pain either I forget it very fast after the attack.
But the second a premenition(shadow) comes up I'll relive it instantaniously.
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Qazpur
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #10 on: Mar 20th, 2008, 1:27pm » |
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greetings all, i can definitely relate to the sensation of detachment after an attack. its almost like the frazzled brain decides "that was just a little too much pain to deal with, don't think i'll be taking notes this time". imbalanced serotonin levels during a hit may also play havoc with the brain's ability to create memories of the event. q
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wanna_swap_brains
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #11 on: Mar 20th, 2008, 2:04pm » |
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hi,good to read all different answers,i guess like everything else to do with this condition/madness theres no rule book to anything anyone has a question about.ill go with the denial one though. thanks stuart
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Barry_T_Coles
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #12 on: Mar 20th, 2008, 9:41pm » |
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Thanks George; thats the best read I've have had in a long time, it was as good as reading my own mind.
What I have done to your post below is not pulling it apart but high lighting the key points people need to get themselves to the mental stage of being thier own master.
on Mar 16th, 2008, 2:05am, George_J wrote:
You can turn this to your advantage.
"Learning to cope with a hit is as valuable as any medication.
Like anything else in life, experience counts. Most of us who've had these for a long time have had to learn how to cope with a hit on our own.
There is nothing mystical or spiritual about this--it's simply a way to calm yourself and to decrease your perception of pain.
First, accept that you're getting a hit. Denial won't help, and struggling won't help.
Be calm. Don't think about much of anything, and above all, don't worry.
Remember. There is life between the hits.
I think of CH hits as if they were storms. There's nothing I can do about them, so I've learned to get through them as best I can. Learning to cope has allowed me to build a crude little shelter out of burlap and sticks where "I" can hide from the worst of the weather.
Talk to Charlie about "Dr. Wright's Circulatory Technique" as well."
All the best,
George
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Once again thank you for a valuable & great read.
Regards
Barry
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George_J
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #13 on: Mar 21st, 2008, 1:39am » |
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Thanks for your kind words, Barry.
It truly is possible to learn how to cope with a hit with some measure of success.
I don't think it's possible to exert much control over the hit itself, since it seems to originate from the autonomic nervous system--but we can control how we react to it, and that enables us to cope.
It isn't easy, (probably one of the hardest things I've ever learned) but it's worth it. Removing fear and panic is often the difference between a kip 8 and a kip 10, IMHO.
All the best,
George
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Ah! The foreigners put on such airs
Wearing the tangerine suits
And their harlequin eyes.
The pain they inspire
Draws in harmonica melodies
And the feathers of birds
Which flame up at their touch.
It all comes to light in the sheer
Debonair.
(Ellen)
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jon019
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #14 on: Mar 21st, 2008, 2:06am » |
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What George said, and I owe him my weak ass version (later). And Barry, nice follow up.
There is more to this than anyone can possibly understand (yet). I know this is not exactly on topic, but I think (I hope) it relates in a way (my apologies if it is too weird a tangent).
I personally experienced, what at the time, seemed miraculous, or God's hand, or mind over matter, or willpower. I don't know, doubt I ever will.
About 3 1/2 years ago my 89 year old Mom was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer. Now, this was a lady (old farm girl) who was healthier and could walk faster than me. When I was home and she said, "I think I'll go get the mail", I used to run to the window to watch her march out and back like a soldier on parade. Damn, it was a sight, and I can still picture it.
Anyway, that's the setup. Since my brother was out of state, and my sister had her own family to take care of, I became the nurse. Absolutely no hesitation or qualms or reluctance, you do what you gotta do for the ones you love. NOTHING easy about watching this unfold AND I was in the MIDDLE of a brutal cycle.
I prayed like I've never prayed before and I talked to that bastard CH. "I can do this or I can deal with you, but I can't do both. You CAN'T have ANY of the precious time we have left together".
For the next 3 1/2 months (from diagnosis to death) and a month following to settle affairs, I didn't even experience as much as a shadow. Even chancing a beer now and then. My O2 tank got dusty and my zomig got misplaced. Call it stress, endorphins, adrenaline, divine intervention (that's my bet) OR, it could very well have been a version of what George so eloquently described.
Shortly thereafter, I was back in cycle, and shortly after that I became chronic.
I hope this has made some sense, I know I’m struggling to make the point, but what’s important is that while we may have a crack in our brain, there is way more there to be tapped than has yet to be realized.
“Ya gotta believe” Tug McGraw
Regards,
Jon
Added in response to George's follow up (while I was writing this): Control vs reaction to, I don't know, but I wonder, based on the above experience.
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| « Last Edit: Mar 21st, 2008, 2:11am by jon019 » |
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"The beginning of wisdom is to call things by their right names." (that's cluster headache doc)
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George_J
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #15 on: Mar 21st, 2008, 2:30am » |
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on Mar 21st, 2008, 2:06am, jon019 wrote:
Added in response to George's follow up (while I was writing this): Control vs reaction to, I don't know, but I wonder, based on the above experience. |
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I wonder as well, Jon.
As you said, we do what we gotta do--and sometimes, somehow, we manage to do it.
Powerful story. It gives me much to think about.
All good wishes,
George
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Ah! The foreigners put on such airs
Wearing the tangerine suits
And their harlequin eyes.
The pain they inspire
Draws in harmonica melodies
And the feathers of birds
Which flame up at their touch.
It all comes to light in the sheer
Debonair.
(Ellen)
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Annette
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #16 on: Mar 21st, 2008, 3:51am » |
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Just one thing I would like to add, not all of us have the same power of the mind. For some its possible to learn meditation and diversion of concentrate and it works, for other temporary denial is all they can muster.
We are made up of an unique personal history based on events that have happened to us, on our individual genetic make up and on the different environments we live in. Depends on the combined effects of all these factors, we can or cant do certain things at certain times in our lives.
While we all strive to be better, do better and learn new skills, we shouldnt beat ourselves up too harshly if at times we fail.
When it comes to some tremendous pain like CH pain, we each cope in our way, and whatever works.
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Mediocrity knows nothing higher than itself; but talent instantly recognizes genius.
Arthur Conan Doyle
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wanna_swap_brains
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #17 on: Mar 21st, 2008, 5:03am » |
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one more bit to add about devine intervention,iam not religious but have shouted for god and jesus to stop it ??? and as for mind control over pain i agree with annette everybodys different. stuart
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Sandy_C
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Re: hows your brain deal with pain
« Reply #18 on: Mar 21st, 2008, 12:58pm » |
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First of all, George, your post on coping was right on. This is exactly how I coped early on, with no meds, no oxygen, no nothing. And, I survived, when all I wanted to do was die.
For me, it was not meditation, divine intervention, or anything like that. It was trying (a huge struggle), to sit upright as calmly as I could, and rock back and forth, while applying pressure with my fingers to the most painful points. I refused to get out of that chair and pace, however this worked only up to about a K8. Anything higher, I was pacing, screaming and rolling.
I focused on that pain... put my whole body and soul in to looking directly at that pain. Breathe slowly and regularly, do not panic because you KNOW it WILL end. I still had the pain, still had the hit for as long as it lasted, but once I learned to work with it instead of against it, at the end of the hit, at least I was not exhausted because I had not tried to combat it.
Don't fight it. It is what it is. Try to conserve your energy because there is no use in wearing yourself out physically when the outcome of the hit is going to be the same thing. It ends.
Sandy
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Lean on me when you're not strong
And I'll be your friend
I'll help you carry on
For it won't be long
Till I'm gonna need
Somebody to lean on
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