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Topic: Smoking (Read 1677 times) |
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sms119
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Clusterf***ed
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Hey Everyone,
Its my first time writing on the board. I started getting CHs 6 years ago when I was 21. I started smoking when I was about 20 and in reading about the affliction read that smoking exacerbated it. I'm in the process of quitting smoking. To be honest, the prospect of ending or even slowing the CHs was the main impetus to quit above and beyond the long term health benefits. I was just wondering if any of you who quit smoking after getting CHs had any significant change in the frequency or intensity of our headaches?
Spencer
P.S. I have been reading the site for a couple of hours now. I have to say that one of the worst parts of CHs is trying to explain to those around you what you're going through. Its so hard to be taken seriously. Its nice (well not nice, but you know what I mean) to be able to discuss this with people who understand how miserable it all can be. This is a wonderful forum filled with positive people. I'm very, very glad I found it.
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Bob_Johnson
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #1 on: Jun 22nd, 2007, 1:55pm » |
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While medical literature warns against smoking the informal polls here--at least the folks who respond to this question--seem to tend to, "no effect".
I assume that doc believe that the toxins from smoking make blood vessels more sensitive, contributing to pain, during an attack. (There are abundant reasons for giving up smoking regardless of the impact on CH, one hardly need say.)
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Headache. 2006 Sep;46( :1246-54.
Cluster headache: clinical presentation, lifestyle features, and medical treatment.
Schurks M, Kurth T, de Jesus J, Jonjic M, Rosskopf D, Diener HC.
Background.-Cluster headache (CH) is a rare but severe headache form with a distinct clinical presentation. Misdiagnoses and mismanagement among these patients are high. Objective.-To characterize clinical features and medical treatment in patients with CH. Methods.-We established a cohort of 246 clinic-based and non-clinic-based CH patients. The diagnosis of CH was verified according to International Headache Society (IHS) criteria. We used standardized questionnaires to assess associated factors as well as success or failure of treatments. Results.-The majority (75.6%) was not treated before at our clinic-77.6% were males; 74.8% had episodic CH, 16.7% had chronic CH, in the remaining patients, the periodicity was undetermined because they were newly diagnosed. Cranial autonomic features were present in 98.8%, nausea and vomiting in 27.8%, and photophobia or phonophobia in 61.2% of CH patients. Most (67.9%) reported restlessness during attacks and 23% a typical migrainous aura preceding the attacks. The rate of current smoking was high (65.9%). Half of the patients reported that alcohol (red wine in 70%) triggered CH attacks. Eighty-seven percent reported the use of drugs of first choice (triptans 77.6%, oxygen 71.1%) with sumatriptan subcutaneous injection being the most effective drug for acute therapy (81.2%). The most frequently used preventive medications were verapamil (70.3%) and glucocorticoids (57.7%) with equally high effectiveness. Conclusions.-Apart from the IHS criteria additional features like nausea/vomiting and migrainous aura may guide the diagnosis of CH. A large number of CH patients do not receive adequate treatments. (Headache 2006;46:1246-1254).
PMID: 16942468 [PubMed]
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Curr Pain Headache Rep. 2003 Apr;7(2):144-9.
Epidemiology of cluster headache.
Finkel AG.
Department of Neurology, University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill, 3114 Bioinformatics Building, Chapel Hill, NC 27599, USA. finkela@glial.med.unc.edu
Cluster headache is rare, occurring in less than 1% of the population. Studies suggest that, in addition to the pain and associated autonomic disturbances recognized to be characteristic of the syndrome, patients also may experience nausea, photophobia, behavioral agitation, or restlessness. A decreasing male:female ratio also has been noted, perhaps attributable to lifestyle trends adopted by more women that were previously associated with men, such as tobacco use, alcohol consumption, and working outside of the home. The relationship between cluster headache and hormonal events does not appear to be strong. Hormonal influences on the chronic form of cluster headache in women are a subject of investigation. The emerging understanding of the genetics of cluster headache increasingly suggests a genetic component, with familial transmission now recognized to be more common than previously appreciated. Head trauma, coronary artery disease, and migraine appear to be present in more patients with cluster headache than can be explained by chance alone. Ethnic and racial differences in prevalence are less well understood.
Publication Types:
Review
PMID: 12628057 [PubMed]
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Bob Johnson
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michael
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #2 on: Jun 22nd, 2007, 1:56pm » |
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Hi Spencer.
Glad you found us although sorry you had to.
I started with CH at 14 and I am now 54!
I have been a smoker since I was 16, ie after the clusters started.
I have had many attempts at giving up - once I managed 4 years, why I started again after that is another story.
My clusters have not been changed by any of my attempts to stop, not even for that 4 year period.
I think you will find that smoking or not has no real effect on CH. However, that is no reason not to try to stop.
Mike
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Rosybabe
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #3 on: Jun 22nd, 2007, 2:10pm » |
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Hi Spencer!
Welcome aboard!!
I am a sufferer since I was 12, now I am 35 and I am not a smoker but my father, and Grandmother(on the family side) smoke. Smoke is a trigger for me, just the smell of it. So I do try to stay away from those who smoke. I am sure quitting with help you not only with the CH's but also your health in general and the health of those around you.
Good Luck Spencer and I am glad you found this site!
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Redd
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #4 on: Jun 22nd, 2007, 4:23pm » |
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I commend your commitment to quit. I happen to be one of the rare cases I guess. Although it went misdiagnosed for 18 years, I have been chronic for nearly 24 years now. It was almost 4 years ago that made an attempt to quit smoking. Cold turkey. Was going great for about a month when my CH went into a high cycle from hell, and I finally got correctly diagnosed. My headache specialist explained that quitting smoking has major effects on seratonin levels, and it is known that seratonin plays a role in CH as well. Figuratively speaking...quitting smoking pissed off the beast.
Before the final word on the diagnosis I stated again when "brain tumor" was mentioned. I spent almost a week waiting for the MRI. I figured to myself if I'm dying of a brain tumor, then my lungs be damned. Now, with my chosen regimine of preventive treatment that is working quite well indeed, I'm considering possibly trying to quit again. Am i scared I'll piss the beast off again? Yes I am.
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I saw an act of faith today. A man was on his knees, not in a pew in a Church, but in a garden planting seeds. ~~Unknown
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sms119
New Board Newbie
Clusterf***ed
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #5 on: Jun 22nd, 2007, 5:33pm » |
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Thanks to everyone who replied. I hope I didn't make it sound like the effect of quitting on my headaches was going to be the determining factor. I AM quitting. I was just thinking that if I knew that it was going to help my CHs it would just be that much more incentive you know?
Redd. God I feel for you, man. To have the negative reinforcement of thinking that quitting may make the headaches worse must make the idea of quitting that much harder. I know its easy and probably naive to say as a 27 year old but I know that I have been really active since quitting and that has helped dull the cravings significantly as well as give me a much needed endorphin rush. I'm not 100% sure that seratonin and endorphins are related but it will make you feel good, even if it makes you initially, if you haven't exercised much, like crap. I'm pulling for you man. Let me know if you ever decide to quit. I'm guessing it always helps to know someone else in the world is giving those bastards up as well.
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GrandPotentate
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mmmmmmmmmm
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #6 on: Jun 23rd, 2007, 12:04am » |
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Everybody is different.
I find doing any significant lifestyle change while in cycle is a bad idea, but some moderation helps.
The worst headbangers I had were following a business trip while in cycle, enduring two 25 hour trips in planes, airports and cabs - all smoke free. Nicorette got me through the travel but the rebound was sheer hell.
I quit AFTER a cycle several years ago, had heard a couple anecdotes that it can help. I had 4 years relatively PF, and milder cycle (peaks at 4ha/day, kip 7) since.
My best o you, whatever you choose.
Jon
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Jon
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Buzz
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I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #7 on: Jun 23rd, 2007, 1:39am » |
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I stopped smoking for 4 years and had no respite from the headaches. 
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seasonalboomer
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #8 on: Jun 23rd, 2007, 5:34am » |
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never really noticed any drastic effect on CH from quitting smoking 10 years ago. But, I will tell you quitting smoking ranks up there as one of the best things I ever did for MYSELF in my whole life. Keep it up and keep the faith -- you can beat it.
I will add that when I quit smoking I ended up becoming more engaged in healthier activities and getting myself in better physical condition. This focus HAS, I believe, helped me manage my CH better as I have better mental stamina and endurance to deal with CH when cycle comes around. So, in a roundabout way, it helped.
Scott
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seasonal boomer
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horsegirl
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Cluster Headaches
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #9 on: Jun 23rd, 2007, 7:23pm » |
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i was getting headaches 2 xs a year and when i was 22 i think ,having had cluster ha sense 15,anyway i moved to california from iowa and quit smoking i didnt have my ha for two years climate or qiting,dont know,i did notice the pain of my ha wasnt as savier in cal .and by the way i only quit for 6 months,i plan on quiting soon before my ha arnt the only reason i need o2 but not tell my ha are gone there not much injoyment these days,im depressed as it is,tackle one thing at a time.Id go back to cal but my husband wont leave iowa,love is worth it.i guess.
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puppetonastring
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #10 on: Jun 24th, 2007, 12:17pm » |
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Spencer,
I'm a smoker as well. CH's started when I was about 19, been smoking (non-socially) since I was about 20.
I've not "quit" for an extended period of time, so I can't really comment on whether or not it helps mitigate the severity of CH attacks or not over the long term.
I've cut smoking out a couple of times in cycle (specifically high cycle) as it seemed to be a "partial" trigger. Other than being a trigger, I diddn't notice any impact on severity.
However, the last coupe of cycles it has not been a trigger. As usual CH has a canny ability to morph both within cycle and (for episodics) from cycle to cycle.
Scott's comment:
"I will add that when I quit smoking I ended up becoming more engaged in healthier activities and getting myself in better physical condition. This focus HAS, I believe, helped me manage my CH better as I have better mental stamina and endurance to deal with CH when cycle comes around. So, in a roundabout way, it helped. "
seems the best reason to try and quit period. It's really about being able to best manage the CH -
Don't let it run the show!
(All else aside - and I keep telling myself this - quitting smoking would be a GOOD thing to do)
Martin
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ClusterChris
New Board Old Timer
Damn Head!
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #11 on: Jun 24th, 2007, 5:01pm » |
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It's sad of me to say this but, smoking is one of the only things that helps me get through a long hit. 
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nosslived
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #12 on: Jun 24th, 2007, 8:50pm » |
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Clusters is a vascular headache which, as most of you probably know is caused by dilation of the blood vessels. I read also that nicotine causes the blood vessels to constrict. There seems to be a contradiction here. I just quit smoking and I have chronic clusters so I guess I'll see what happens. It's been about 10 days since my last attack (which happened while I was in class...that is the worst) and I quit about 7 days ago. It is a waiting game.
On a more longitudinal note, I started smoking when I was about 14 (I'm 23 now) and I was attacked by my first cluster when I was 21. So it might not be related to smoking at all, but as was mentioned before it is based on individual differences.
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| « Last Edit: Jun 24th, 2007, 8:54pm by nosslived » |
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JohnM
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #13 on: Jun 26th, 2007, 6:30am » |
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I started smoking when I was about 12 years old. By 16 I was a regular smoker. I first started to try and give up smoking in my early 20s because of a smokers cough. I cut down slowly, missing the first of the day, then only after 10am, then only from the afternoon, then evenings only, until I was on only 2 or 3 an evening for several years. I finally quit totally (except for a very rare cigar on festive occasions) when I was 28 and have hated cigarette smoking with a passion ever since.
I started with a few headaches in junior school and migraines in high school. The yearly CH pattern started in my 20's. For the next 30 years I still got yearly CH despite not smoking.
I think smoking is despicable, like many ex smokers, but I doubt it will stop your CH unfortunately. Give it up anyway if you can for general health reasons.
I am now 55 and I am starting my 7th year of "almost" total remission, which I put down to a regular 6 monthly detox 2 week diet which I started in May 2001. I had a 10 day bout of CH over Xmas 2003 when I got cocky and missed doing my detox in the previous October.
John
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Moderation in everything; including moderation!
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Redd
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #14 on: Jun 26th, 2007, 9:10am » |
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I applaud anyone who can/has quit smoking.
Something that holds a curiosity for me is that some professionals contend that smoking and Clusters may have a connection due to an addictive personality. I beg to differ. There may addictive qualities, but I would hypothosize that it is due to a positive reinforcement connection.
Nicotine is a powerful vaso-constrictor. Many of us CHeads who smoke find comfort sometimes during or just after an attack in smoking. It is logical to make a connection between the vaso-constrictive nature as positive reinforcement for continueing to smoke.
Just a hypothosis of mine.
Back to your regularly scheduled programming.
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I saw an act of faith today. A man was on his knees, not in a pew in a Church, but in a garden planting seeds. ~~Unknown
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Wayne
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #15 on: Jun 26th, 2007, 1:10pm » |
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Nicotine is a powerful vaso-constrictor. Many of us CHeads who smoke find comfort sometimes during or just after an attack in smoking. It is logical to make a connection between the vaso-constrictive nature as positive reinforcement for continueing to smoke.
I couldn't agree more! Before I was properly diagnosed I was told by a Doc that my smoking was agravating my sinus and that's what was causing my horrible headaches, That really inspired me to stop. I quit for 3 weeks and it had absolutely no positive effect on the CH but I was twice as miserable because of the withdrawal and cos I'd lost my crutch. Eventually I actually thought they were getting worse, started smoking again and have ever since.
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A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.
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Redd
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #16 on: Jun 26th, 2007, 1:32pm » |
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There in lays the rub, Wayne. Smoking, in and of itself, is harmful to the body. We know this.
However, to postulate that the vaso-constrictve properties of ciggaretts is, if not benificial on a physical level, at least an emotional one, would fly in the face of all the lobby's to curtail smoking, short of making it an illegal substance, and the medical/insurance companies at the root of the movement.
I'm not saying that quitting smoking would not improve overall health in may areas. Only that to admit to the positive benefits nicotine has, the quickness of administration by smoking to acheive speedy vaso-constriction, would be counter productive to the "stop smoking cause". Thereby rendering any attempts at study on this fruitless, and certainly not un-biased.
edit: because I had forgot a key phrase.
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| « Last Edit: Jun 26th, 2007, 1:34pm by Redd » |
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I saw an act of faith today. A man was on his knees, not in a pew in a Church, but in a garden planting seeds. ~~Unknown
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Patrick_A
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #17 on: Jul 3rd, 2007, 5:34pm » |
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I quit smoking 2 years ago. I have been CH free for 4 years now. I don't know if nicotine affects CH, but it didnt seem to affect me after I quit smoking.
Patrick_A 
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agonymum
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #18 on: Jul 3rd, 2007, 6:12pm » |
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hi ,
just do it anyway , i quit 16 months ago , it was the best thing i have ever done to help myself in so many ways .
( it hasnt stopped the clusters but im sure that i am more patient and less stressed on the whole so that must help a bit )
good luck !
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UN solved
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I quit smoking a couple of times  Once, I quit for a year and it happens to be the worse year I've had since having clusters.  I smoke now and it does not seem to be a trigger.
I wanted to ask: can some people actually smoke during a hit ? I know I sure can't smoke while being stabbed in the eye ! @\/@ 
Quitting smoking can only help your health !! Do yourself a favor and quit today !! Or you can wait til you get bronchitis, emphasemia, and COPD ... like I did !
Goodluck
UNsolved
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michael
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #20 on: Jul 4th, 2007, 4:02am » |
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No. Never been able to smoke during a hit
Mike
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Wayne
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #21 on: Jul 4th, 2007, 6:11am » |
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I do smoke during the walkabout phase of a hit, actually chain smoke but its more to try and destract myself than for any beneficial effect.
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A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.
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E-Double
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #22 on: Jul 4th, 2007, 8:11am » |
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Whattup fellow NYer!
Many reasons for quitting smoking and all here are valid.
Of course health is the most important.
Though some find ill effect in trying to quit whether it be due to an increase in vasodialtion or drastic changes in sertonin levels(??) Some may find it beneficial because they are more responsive to treatment and they feel better overall (eventually)
I have helped quite a few people quit yet I am stumped and struggle myself.
As far as the psychological aspects of smoking behavior
and why we may continue to do so,
we can look at in basic learning principles:
Positive reinforcement: presentation of a pleasnt event that increase/strengthens a behavior
Negative reinforcement: removalof an aversive which increase/strengthens a behavior
Both individualized
For smokers at least those who are addicted and dependent there is a combination:
*We like the high= positive reinforcement
*Do we seek Comfort = positive reinforcement
or
*Do we seek the removal of anxiety = negative reinfocement
It is a combination of both with both socially mediated postives and negatives as well as automatically reinforced behavior
Lesson complete
Quit!
We'll see if I can do it as well
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I can't believe that I have to bang my
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But the blows they have just a little more
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Gonna take a breath and try again.
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midwestbeth
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #23 on: Jul 4th, 2007, 8:56am » |
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on Jul 3rd, 2007, 7:48pm, UN solved wrote:I wanted to ask: can some people actually smoke during a hit ? I know I sure can't smoke while being stabbed in the eye ! @\/@
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I could never even think about smoking during a hit. Can't even be in the same room as a smoker.
Beth
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cluster
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Re: Smoking
« Reply #24 on: Jul 5th, 2007, 5:50am » |
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Quote:
Eleven cluster headache patients with no prior tobacco use history were identified at the Michigan Head-Pain and Neurological Institute over the past 1 year. A history of parental smoking was obtained. A history of head trauma, another recognized risk factor for cluster headache, was also ascertained. Seven men and four women were identified. Three of the men had a history of head trauma prior to cluster headache onset and were not included in the analysis. The remaining eight individuals (four males, four females) all had parents who smoked and each stated they were exposed to significant tobacco smoke during their childhood. For five patients both parents smoked. All developed episodic cluster headache. Ages of onset were 14, 16, 18, 19, 21, 22, and 50 years.
This observation suggests that prolonged exposure to second-hand tobacco smoke from parents could lead to the development of cluster headache. The age of onset of cluster headache in these individuals appears to be earlier than that described in the literature (average age above 27 years).4 The number of patients identified was small but women were as frequent as men. Cluster headache is recognized as a male disorder but recent evidence suggests that the number of women with cluster headache is increasing.5 The reason for this surge is unknown. Exposure to second-hand tobacco smoke could be hypothesized as one of the possible causes of this trend. The true role of cigarette smoking in cluster headache pathogenesis is unknown but this severe headache syndrome maybe another consequence of exposure of children to tobacco smoke.
Todd D. Rozen, MD
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Source: Todd D. Rozen MD (2005)
Childhood Exposure to Second-Hand Tobacco Smoke and the Development of Cluster Headache
Headache: The Journal of Head and Face Pain 45 (4), 393–394
Any non-smoking CH patients here, which were or were not exposed to second-hand tobacco smoke during their childhood?
pf wishes,
(the "marlboro man" who started smoking when he was 14 and who was very likely exposed to second-hand cigarette smoke during his childhood and who developed CH at the age of 37.)
Friedrich
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