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Topic: Do I need a psychiatrist?? (Read 2172 times) |
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SteveR
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Do I need a psychiatrist??
« on: Nov 16th, 2007, 6:48am » |
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 Hi to all I am a completely new member so please bear with me.
The demon started last xmas and hasn´t let up for 1 day. Took months to diagnose (for a long time I was accused of being an alcoholic or drug addict!!), until finally I was sent for an MRI scan. I have been taking anti-epileptic & "vascular" drugs for months with no success and am now using Imigran (I think you call it Imitrex) and Zomig Nasal Sprays like there´s no tomorrow. Just returned from my Family Doctor (to get mountain of prescriptions which I owe my pharmacist) and he informed me that they may refer me to a psychiatrist as they dont know anyone who has suffered with CH as long as me!!!! I have appointment with Neurologist Monday 19th Nov. and am now wondering what he is going to say. During the times I´m between attacks I am active, sociable and love life. It´s only the pain which brings me down to earth. I can´t believe that this pain is something I imagine!! Because I too do the dance, head bang, scream, cry etc. etc. Has anybody else ever been "accused" of exaggerating or imagining this evil evil demon?? Any comments gratefully received. Good luck to all and thank you for being there. SteveR (I am English but live with my wife in Spain)
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jimmers
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #1 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 7:23am » |
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Steve,
Be careful when using the Imigran. It sounds like you use it a lot and using it to often can cause re-bound headaches. Arm yourself with info from this site when you see the neuro. Better yet, see if he will visit this site and get some information for himself.
Sounds like a preventative may be in order for you, hopefully he knows about these headaches and will try to find something that works for you.
Glad your here, but I'm sorry you have to be! Stick around, there are many people here with tons of experience dealing with these things.
One word of advice though, don't dissapear on us if your HA's subside for a while or we will hunt you down and beat you with the oar your given 
Good luck at the doctor and let us know what happens.
Jimmers
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Annette
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #2 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 7:26am » |
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Try oxygen first, if that doesnt work, then consider the psychiatrist.
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Kevin_M
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #3 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 7:38am » |
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on Nov 16th, 2007, 6:48am, SteveR wrote: The demon started last xmas and hasn´t let up for 1 day.
Just returned from my Family Doctor (to get mountain of prescriptions which I owe my pharmacist) and he informed me that they may refer me to a psychiatrist as they dont know anyone who has suffered with CH as long as me!!!! |
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He is not showing a lot of knowledge so far of clusters, there are many of us here in the same boat, Steve, it's called chronic clusters.
Quote:| I have been taking anti-epileptic & "vascular" drugs for months with no success and am now using Imigran (I think you call it Imitrex) and Zomig Nasal Sprays like there´s no tomorrow. |
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It sounds like the preventatives he gave you weren't working or not prescribed in an effective dosage. Those two abortives you use are different triptans and shouldn't be mixed. Jimmers mentioned that overuse seems to increase frequency of hits. Your doctor did not prescribe oxygen as Annette posted.
Quote:| I have appointment with Neurologist Monday 19th Nov. and am now wondering what he is going to say. |
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This is one good idea. Maybe the neuro can straighten all this out for you.
Quote:| During the times I´m between attacks I am active, sociable and love life. It´s only the pain which brings me down to earth. |
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Nothing at all unusual about that. No need for a psychiatrist, especially not for this:
Quote:| Has anybody else ever been "accused" of exaggerating or imagining this evil evil demon?? |
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It looks like doctor shortcomings are putting blame on you so far.
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| « Last Edit: Nov 16th, 2007, 7:44am by Kevin_M » |
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lorac
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #4 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 7:49am » |
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Steve Sorry to hear you are hurting..... go for the oxygen if you can. It works for most. good luck at the doc's lorac
let us know how it goes. 
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BarbaraD
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #5 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 8:17am » |
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What anti-epileptic drugs were you using? And what dosage.
O2 works for most of us as a FIRST resort. Also caffeine at the beginning of a headache (coffee or Red Bull energy drink). The Imigran will cause rebound headaches if used too often (as will most everything - be careful).
Ice packs (or heat - we all react differently - your choice) sometimes help on the neck. Hot showers (or cold) help some people.
And yes, there are a lot of us who have CH daily without let-ups. We're known as Chronics.
Good luck with a doc who knows something about CH. Keep us informed.
Hugs BD
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schaan
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #6 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 8:53am » |
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i am relatively new at being diagnosed myself
i use a combination of ALOT of caffine ( i calll it my mud mixture with various otc pain meds ( not good for the stomach though ) at the beginning of an attack) Im fortunate that i only have a cycle 3 or 4 times a year for 3 or 4 weeks.
also i find that cool to cold air breathing it in is a big help.
Im franticaly working with neuro and iins CO. to get on O@ as it seems to be miraculos.
I feel a physicyatrict never "hurt" anyone, but as far as needing one for your CH I doubt it, just need the right treatment as im learning myself HERE ........ course you might need one from the effects and aftermath of ch
Good Luck
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| « Last Edit: Nov 16th, 2007, 8:54am by schaan » |
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Gator
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #7 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 9:00am » |
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on Nov 16th, 2007, 7:26am, Annette wrote:
Try oxygen first, if that doesnt work, then consider the psychiatrist. |
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If oxygen doesn't help see a psychiatrist? What the fuck kind of advice is that? Should everyone else here for whom oxygen doesn't work get their head shrunk as well?
Chuck was put in a fricking loony bin because doctors didn't believe anyone could suffer as much as he does. Jonny was chronic for 30 years. BarbD, Donna, Pegg, and many others are chronic. I've been chronic since day one (primary chronic) and haven't had a break of much more than a day or so since it started. Many, many others here with the same story. Should we all get fitted for straight jackets?
ICHD, 2nd edition, page 45, section 3.1.2 - Chronic Cluster Headache:
Quote:Comments:
Chronic cluster headache may arise de novo (previously
referred to as primary chronic cluster headache)
or evolve from the episodic subtype (previously
referred to as secondary chronic cluster headache). Some
patients may switch from chronic to episodic cluster
headache |
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It seems that the doctors that actually know headaches already have encountered primary chronics to the point that they specifically mention them in the classification guide.
I also see nowhere in this document that chronics or people who don't respond to oxygen should seek psychiatric help.
Grrrrrrrr 
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thomas
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #8 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 9:00am » |
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Great post, Kevin.
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Religion and sex are powerplays. Manipulate the people for the money they pay. Selling skin, selling God, the numbers look the same on their credit cards. Triptans cause rebounds. Learn it, believe it, live it. I use triptans as the absolute LAST RESORT when treating my CH.
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Ghost
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #9 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 9:31am » |
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NO! get treated for what you have and anyone that cant or dont want to believe how bad it is offer a suggestion to them... open car or truck door place eye against latch bolt, have friend jump at full force against door slamming head in the door with eye against latch bolt, then they cannot complain about the pain.....
God I HATE YES HATE A55 PLUGS that dont know what they talk about.
after they do that offer them 1 asprin. and tell them to do that 4-5 times a day every day for a year. lets see if they want to play anymore.
See the neuro and get real treatment also get o2 you will thank the gods for it.
Mike
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vietvet2tours
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #10 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 9:34am » |
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on Nov 16th, 2007, 7:26am, Annette wrote:
Try oxygen first, if that doesnt work, then consider the psychiatrist. |
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Karla
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #11 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 10:20am » |
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I am chronic as well. I used to get 8 hits a day lasting for 1 1/2 hrs each and all most all were level 10's. These ha are nicknamed suicide ha for a reason I think. I know that my quality of life was greatly affected by ch and I felt very suicidal because nothing was working to stop the pain as a preventative and I could no longer function. I was refered to a shrink who helped me over come my depression by putting me on an antidepressant. It made a lot of difference to me. At least I wasn't suicidal anymore and I had someone to talk to here about the chronic pain issues. This is a wonderful support network. But as far as seeing a shrink because they think it is in your head that is nuts! I would be looking for a new dr.
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Karla
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sandie99
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #12 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 10:26am » |
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Steve, welcome to ch family!
I'm glad that you found us. It's great that you have a neuro appointment coming up; read lots of info before you go - knowledge is power. Find out more about treatments - then you'll know what to talk about with your neuro.
Having ch is not the end of the world; it makes life challenging at times, but there is life between hits. Whenever you'll need any advice whatsoever, your ch family is here for you, 24/7.
Wishing you lots of PF time,
Sanna
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Guiseppi
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #13 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 10:33am » |
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Welcome to the club! The good news is there is lots of information on this board. The bad news is it is now your job to learn as much as you can about this condition and educate your physician. They get about 5 minutes of headache training in doctor school. Since this condition doesn't kill us and no big stars have started any telethons on our behalf it's a very overlooked malady!!!
As far as the shrink, I encourage everyone on the board to have a close friend who monitors them. We all spiral down into mild depression over these things. Hell, they hurt....a lot!!!! Just make sure you have someone that'll nudge you into seeking help if it looks like you're not dealing well with it.
Welcome to the club, I really hope we can get you pointed in the right direction and get you some rlief soon!!
Guiseppi
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nani
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #14 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 10:34am » |
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on Nov 16th, 2007, 7:26am, Annette wrote:
Try oxygen first, if that doesnt work, then consider the psychiatrist. |
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Hi Steve. Except for the above comment, you've gotten some good advice. Many of us have been accused of being drama queens and exaggerating our pain, but we know the truth.
Arm yourself with info, and get some informed treatments from the neuro.
pain free wishes, nani
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Rosybabe
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #15 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 11:35am » |
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Hi Steve! Welcome aboard!!!
Guys already gave you good info and I am just going to add a little more, stay away from the good Rioja and the great Cheese and the absolutely delicious smoke meats from that wondeful country you are in. Some of them are triggers and you are basicaly sorrounded by them, not to mention the constant Cigar smoke.
When I was traveling Spain, I got some of my worst hits out of season for me  , now I am more convinced that all the food and the smoky ambience and the great wine, brought those to me. I had a great time before and after the hits of course. It is just MHHO.
Good Luck and don't let the docs treat you like a freak because you are not.
Pain free wishes for you and say HOLA to your wife!
Rosy.
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artonio7
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #16 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 12:43pm » |
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Day after day of unrelenting pain....that is more than enough reason to see a psychiatrist... just the stress alone is enough to break anyone.
If you are prescribed o2 at 15-25 lpm and use it at the first onset of a cluster attack and use it properly with a clustmax and if this does not work to abort a ch... see a psycho therapist and another neurologist.
When using o2 "PROPERLY" to abort a cluster headache... it works. The key is to use it correctly and to start using it at the proper time.
We do have a member here... Chuck who was put in a mental health facility early in his history with ch and wouldn't ya know it... they put him there without ever considering offering him o2 first and showing him the proper way to use it. That in my opinion was criminal. Chuck is a chronic sufferer and has many attacks a day all year round. Before he began using o2 his life was intolerable... now that he's using o2 properly we rarely see him in here as he is out working round the clock.
It's also interesting that lithium and depakote are used to treat cluster headaches... and these drugs are often prescribed by psychiatrists.
with warm regards,
Tony
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| « Last Edit: Nov 16th, 2007, 1:16pm by artonio7 » |
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Linda_Howell
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #17 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 1:42pm » |
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Hey Steve...I am laughing very hard at this statement your family Dr. made. You've had clusters since Dec. and he says you need a shrink cause
Quote:| they dont know anyone who has suffered with CH as long as me!!! |
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I've been chronic for 21 years. Some people here..longer. Last December is a drop in the bucket and CERTAINLY no reason for you to see a shrink. Really.
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Jill
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #18 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 1:52pm » |
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Hi there...
I think that many of us chronics have, at one point, been told either by a doctor or someone else that we are exaggerating or saying that it is worse than it is. I think that some doctors find this an easier excuse than to admit that they do not know everything.
I also think that psychologists can be helpful when it comes to coping with chronic CH as it affects daily life in a huge way. But I do not think that you have to see one just because you have had CH for a year - I have had mine for five years and they have never let up.
As to the comment that two have made regarding oxygen and needing to see a shrink - well that is so not right. I have tried oxygen numerous times with all kinds of masks and I have done it the ''right'' way and it does not work for me. It worked at one point and then stopped. That does not mean that I need to see a shrink or anything like that. While oxygen might be a great help to many, it does not work for others - just like every other medication out there.
I was hesitant to write this hear but that kind of statement really bothers me. It is hard enough dealing with being chronic and having your life altered in many ways.
Just my thoughts.
Jill
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ski2k
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #19 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 2:58pm » |
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Welcome to the nut house, Steve!!
While O2 doesn't work for all of us, I'd say it does work for the vast majority. So it is certainly worth trying! It's fairly inexpensive, and has virtually no side effects (when used correctly).
If your (sounds like) Chronic Ch is getting you down, than by all means, go see a shrink and talk about it! If you seem to be dealing with it pretty well without seeing one, then save your money. It's NOT all in your head! Well... the pain IS in your head, but you're not imagining it... You know what I mean!
This web site alone, in MY OPINION, is just as good as any shrink. Well... except we/it can't offer prescriptions when needed. But it's a super place to come and vent, ask questions, share experiences, and just talk.
Also wanted to back up the energy drink/coffee idea. I use an energy drink with Taurine and caffeine in it, and that seems to knock the beast out within minutes! Drink it quickly at the first sign of an attack, and it just may help you too! Others use strong coffee, but I just don't care for it, so I use the E-drinks.
Are you using the Imitrex (Imigran) nasal spray? Many people here find the injections work much better than the pills or spray. Just something else to keep in mind.
Best wishes, and keep us posted! We'd like to know how things turn out!
Adam
P.S. Give your wife a big "thank you" for being there, and helping you cope with the pain. Our supporters suffer right along with us! Just think of how helpless she must feel when she knows you're hurting and can't do anything to make it stop!
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Annette
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #20 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 5:15pm » |
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Steve
The reason I thought you may consider seeing a psychiatrist is not because I believe you need one nor because the pain is only imaginary.
From what you wrote I noticed 2 things:
1- You have been suffering for a very long time ( 11 months ) without even 1 day painfree. This can frazzle anyones nerve. Stress and chronic pain can compound on top of CH and make everything worse. Seeing a psychiatrist to check to make sure that psychologically you are still strong is worthwhile.
1- You doctor doesnt doubt that you have CH, he just isnt quite that experienced with it. He has tried to prescribe you as much medications as he could from anti-epileptic to vascular drugs to sprays. You have used these for months without a result. He has started to wonder if there is underlying psychological problems that may aggrevate your headaches and he wanted you to see a psychiatrist to rule this out. This is not unreasonable.
One of our friends here was misdiagnosed and was referred to a psychiatric hospital before being diagnosed with CH and treated for CH. However, that was more than 20 years ago before people were more aware of CH. I dont think drawing parallel with that here is fair. You already have a diagnosis of CH, your doctor was just wondering why you have had 11 months of daily hits and wants to rule out other factors. Its not like you go to a psychiatrist now and suddenly your diagnosis will change from CH to something else.
I also noticed that you havent tried oxygen. Its first line treatment for CH and it works so well for many. You need 100% oxygen at high flow rate and a non rebreather mask. You should try it because it may be just the answer for you.
However do consider seeing a psychiatrist or even a psychologist at some stage. You may discover some stressful issues that may or may not have contributed to the situation now and gets help for it. If not you have proven to your doctor that there isnt anything else he needs to worry about and concentrate on finding the right combination of meds for your CH. Its good either way.
Although CH is not a psych condition, it is well known that underlying or additional psychological problems do make it worse in some people. Prolonged stress going undetected and untreated can make CH worse. Depression and anxiety are very common in CH, as in other chronic pain syndromes.
People often get worried about seeing a psychiatrist because of the stigma attached to it. They hesitate because they think seeing a psychiatrist means that they are crazy or somehow what they are experiencing is not real. That is not true at all, many people here do see psychiatrists and many find antidepressants along with other CH meds very helpful.
Going to see one doesnt mean you need one, its simply ruling out possibilities.
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cash5542
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #21 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 7:57pm » |
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I am a supporter for my 22 yr old daughter. My first support job was for her severe asthma that really turned awful at 18. Psychiatric consults went hand in hand with the medical treatment. She worked on biofeedback and learned how to breath her way through an asthma attack while waiting for ER care. We learned how to stay calm when she wasn't able to breath!A few years later she developed CH. Her doctors were amazed how well she coped. I have no doubt it was what she learned from her psychiatrist as well as the support this board gave her. We have done family counseling too. Looking back at the last 5 years the purpose of all of the visits were to help us all deal with change in my daughters health. We hardly go now but when she is in a very high cycle (and she is chronic) it sure is nice to go in and cry my eyes out to him. He doesn't have CH but he does know how to counsel a person dealing with an adult child with not one, but two chronic illnesses. Family suppport at this time is so helpful. Just make sure when choosing someone they are empathetic to your needs. Good luck and go find some o2!!!
Charlotte
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Jonny
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #22 on: Nov 16th, 2007, 9:06pm » |
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Quote:| Do I need a psychiatrist?? |
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Yes, now stop talking to the voices in your fucking head and go see one!
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Charlie
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #23 on: Nov 17th, 2007, 2:28am » |
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Welcome aboard Steve. I'm glad to meet you but sorry it has to be because of this horror. Seeing a neurologist makes sense. It did for me. In the mean time......
Quote:If oxygen doesn't help see a psychiatrist? What the fuck kind of advice is that? Should everyone else here for whom oxygen doesn't work get their head shrunk as well?
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I'm with Gator. The guy's an idiot
Here is a technique that I learned from my neurologist....worked for me and some others:
Dr. Wright’s Circulatory Technique:
I am not sure what mechanism is triggered by this but whatever it is, at least indirectly helps kill the pain. I do know that this technique has nothing to do with meditation, relaxation, or psychic ability. It is entirely physical and takes some work. It involves concentrating on trying to redirect a little circulation to the arms, hands, or legs. Think of feeling your pulse in your hand. Increased circulation will result in a reddening and warming of the hands. The important and difficult part is that it has to be done without interruption through the pain. Do not give up in frustration. It may not work on the first try. Try experimenting between attacks. You will find that it gets easier with practice. Every now and then it will work almost immediately. I lived for those moments.
I was given less than five minutes instruction in the use of method. The doctor, while placing his arm on his desk, showed me that he could slightly increase his arm and hand circulation. After several attempts, I was able to repeat this procedure and use it successfully. I have had about a 75% success rate shortening these attacks. My 20 minute attacks were often reduced to 10 minutes or less. Once proven that I had a chance to effectively deal with this horror, I always gave it a try as I had nothing to lose but pain.
I used to try to imagine I was pushing blood away from my neck into my arm. Use your imagination. There is one man who wrote that his standing barefoot on a concrete floor shortened his attacks. This may be similar as it draws some circulation away from the head. Cold water, exercise, or anything affecting circulation, seems to be worth a try. My suggestion is to not let up immediately when the pain goes. Waiting a minute is probably a good idea. So long as you do not slack off, this has a chance of working.
This technique is very useful while waiting for medication to take effect or when none is available. It costs nothing, is non-invasive, and can be used just about anywhere. It is not a miracle but it helped me deal with this horror. It can be a bit exhausting but the success rate was good enough for me and a cluster headache sufferer will do just about anything to end the pain. It gives us a fighting chance.
Charlie
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There is nothing more satisfying than being shot at without result---Winston Churchill
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purpleydog
CH.com Alumnus
New Board Hall of Famer
Posts: 2240
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Re: Do I need a psychiatrist??
« Reply #24 on: Nov 17th, 2007, 5:40pm » |
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on Nov 16th, 2007, 7:26am, Annette wrote:
Try oxygen first, if that doesnt work, then consider the psychiatrist. |
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This is the most ridiculous advice I have ever heard. Annette, you really need to stop trying to practice medicine here or anywhere else, IMO.
He doesn't need a shrink, he needs a good neurologist.
I am chronic too, and have been for several years now. Not once has my neuro ever told me to see a shrink due to it. Chuck WAS put in the fucking loony bin for a long time, for the same damn reason. They didn't think it was possible for anyone to have CH this long. Do you have ANY idea what that stint in the crazy house did to Chuck? Annette, you have never met Chuck, but he is one of the kindest people I know. Know what else? I can see in his face what it did to him. He gets hit more often and more intensely than almost any other CH'er I know.
Steve... first of all, welcome to the family! Please, before you consider going to see a psychiatrist, read, and print out the info in the tabs to the left. Take it with you to the neuro. There is some excellent info on oxygen, which is a great abortive for most people. Gator has some excellent links on O2, and also for ways to handle the beast that you can print off and take to your neuro. In the tabs to the left, there is a link to the OUCH website, they have great info too, so read as much as you can, and print off what you need to take to your neuro. He may not have that much knowledge about clusterheadaches, and the info may be informing to him too, and may help him to start you on a preventative.
Be careful with the Imigran and Zomig. They are both "triptans", and will abort a headache, but first, never mix them, and don't use one within 24 hours of using the other. Also, the Imigran can give you rebound headaches if you are using it daily, so be careful. Caffeine in high doses, like really strong coffee, Red Bull and other energy drinks, slammed down at the first sign, work as abortives too.
You've gotten some good advice here. Please let us know how it goes. And try not to worry too much. You've been fighting these things for almost a year. Having CH makes you strong, the people on this board are some of the strongest people I know. So, hang in there. And ask questions. We're here for ya.
Chris
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