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Topic: Hotel Rwanda (Read 1175 times) |
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kimmeesue
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Hotel Rwanda
« on: Oct 19th, 2005, 2:41pm » |
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Watched this movie last night and it gave me a whole new perspective on US foreign relations.
The atrocities there were no less than those in the middle east so why did the US not have a presence there? I'm about to jump on the "it's all about the oil" bandwagon.
I have never thought of myself as politically naive, but am beginning to wonder if I just eat up what the media feeds me.
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If I wasn't doing this I'd probably be doing something else.
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Jonny
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #1 on: Oct 19th, 2005, 2:45pm » |
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on Oct 19th, 2005, 2:41pm, kimmeesue wrote:| I'm about to jump on the "it's all about the oil" bandwagon. |
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We are in Iraq for one reason, to protect the donkeys 
Night vision in Iraq
http://www.m90.org/gallery/video/nightvisiondonkeysex0-2262.wmv
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Ghost
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #2 on: Oct 19th, 2005, 2:48pm » |
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we where ask Bill Cliton why we pulled out when he never did and of course he never inhaled either.
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Illigitimus Non Tatum Carborundum
If all men are endowed by their creator, why was mine so short sighted?
***WARNING*** Oxygen will rust your pipes!
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maffumatt
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The UN was in there but the security council wouldn't reinforce the troops there or give them authority to act. Clinton would not act without their go ahead.
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Bondservant
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #4 on: Oct 19th, 2005, 3:22pm » |
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Couple of comments:
I've stayed in that hotel a couple of times. Been to Rwanda several times. We were obligated to help under the 1948 Genocide Convention which we signed.
Madeleine Albright, as UN Ambassador, vetoed UN resolution for an intervention, so of course Clinton had no go-ahead - his own ambassador vetoed any chance of stopping the slaughter.
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Ghost
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #5 on: Oct 19th, 2005, 3:32pm » |
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sad huh? 
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Illigitimus Non Tatum Carborundum
If all men are endowed by their creator, why was mine so short sighted?
***WARNING*** Oxygen will rust your pipes!
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kimmeesue
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #6 on: Oct 19th, 2005, 3:39pm » |
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Oh, man. Man's inhumanity to man knows no bounds. We in the US have no idea what real strife is. I find myself wondering why I haven't done more with my life.
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If I wasn't doing this I'd probably be doing something else.
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The Warden from Hell
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #7 on: Oct 19th, 2005, 6:27pm » |
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Situations like Rowanda make me embarrased to be an American. I have a palistinian (sp?) family for neighbors and everytime I see them I want to appologize to them. I want to tell them I'm sorry Mr. Bush is killing off your sons and daughters. It makes me want to cry just thinking about how many innocent Iraqies and U.S. military troops are being killed. Mankind has got to learn to stop being so power hungry. John Lennon-Imagine The world we should strive for.
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The opposite of war is not peace. It is creation. -RENT by Johnathan Larson
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thebbz
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #8 on: Oct 19th, 2005, 6:56pm » |
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Truly our government sucks. But I have to look at the fact Sadam Insane in fact as a dictator was an active weapon of mass destruction. He slaughtered millions. Not to mention what he did to the environment. I lift my head and am proud our government had a lead in removing him from power. Too bad we couldn't look right at genocide going on right now in places other than Bagdad. 
BB
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It wasn't me I didn't do it
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Jonny
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #9 on: Oct 19th, 2005, 7:14pm » |
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on Oct 19th, 2005, 6:27pm, Dads angel wrote:| Situations like Rowanda make me embarrased to be an American. I have a palistinian (sp?) family for neighbors and everytime I see them I want to appologize to them. I want to tell them I'm sorry Mr. Bush is killing off your sons and daughters. It makes me want to cry just thinking about how many innocent Iraqies and U.S. military troops are being killed. Mankind has got to learn to stop being so power hungry. John Lennon-Imagine The world we should strive for. |
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Im gonna give you a pass on this....only cause I love ya and your cute.
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It is up to YOU to educate yourself and then help your doctor plan your treatment. If you just sit down in front of your doctor and say "make me better" you are setting yourself up for a great deal of pain.
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maffumatt
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Damned if you do Damned if you dont...............
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Charlie
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #11 on: Oct 19th, 2005, 10:33pm » |
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Incredibly rich Republicans are making billions of dollars selling weapons to kill an enemy that doesn't much value life by borrowing from the Chinese which means
that our kids will be paying back a Communist country with compound interest.
Charlie
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There is nothing more satisfying than being shot at without result---Winston Churchill
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rumplestiltskin
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Since I read and listen to alternative sources...ie non commercial...i was aware of the atrocities and who and why we were looking the other way...and the demonic bigotry that spawned it....it took me a long time to get to the point where i could watch that movie. Sounds like you were touched in all the right places by the film...
Your discomfort is refreshing.
It is far easier to accept the corporate amerikan party line...be spoon fed by Clear Channel...and scream "my country right or wrong"...far easier...than seeing the truth of what our gov't is actually doing to the rest of the world...to it's own...Our minds don't want to believe that our youth are being slaughtered...taught to torture...all in the name of power and greed....flying the flag of "freedom"...draping coffin after coffin with the rationalization of "freedom"....cause....we cannot handle the discomfort of the shame and guilt.
Don't believe me?
Just watch...
Wage peace
den
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Bondservant
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #13 on: Oct 20th, 2005, 2:57pm » |
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Rumplestiltskin: Just returned from the Middle East a couple of weeks ago. Every one of our soldiers, sailors, airmen, marines and civilians there are doing eveything they can to stop the senseless slaughter of Iraqis by Zarqawi and other terrorists. Each is a volunteer and committed to the cause. They are prepared to die to protect your right to call them torturers and demean their sacrifice. It grieves me that you think so little of them, yet are willing to take advantage of the freedom they are fighting to be so critical. NONE of our soldiers are beheading Iraqis, dragging and mutilating their bodies or setting them aflame. You seem confused about who is doing what to whom over there.
So we are clear, while I fault the Clinton administration for not intervening in Rwanda, they are not responsible for the killing. The Hutu militias and Hutu power government did that.
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Jonny
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #14 on: Oct 20th, 2005, 3:10pm » |
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on Oct 20th, 2005, 2:57pm, Bondservant wrote:Rumplestiltskin: Just returned from the Middle East a couple of weeks ago. Every one of our soldiers, sailors, airmen, marines and civilians there are doing eveything they can to stop the senseless slaughter of Iraqis by Zarqawi and other terrorists. Each is a volunteer and committed to the cause. They are prepared to die to protect your right to call them torturers and demean their sacrifice. It grieves me that you think so little of them, yet are willing to take advantage of the freedom they are fighting to be so critical. NONE of our soldiers are beheading Iraqis, dragging and mutilating their bodies or setting them aflame. You seem confused about who is doing what to whom over there.
So we are clear, while I fault the Clinton administration for not intervening in Rwanda, they are not responsible for the killing. The Hutu militias and Hutu power government did that. |
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I like this new Dude
Welcome aboard!!
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| « Last Edit: Oct 20th, 2005, 3:11pm by Jonny » |
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It is up to YOU to educate yourself and then help your doctor plan your treatment. If you just sit down in front of your doctor and say "make me better" you are setting yourself up for a great deal of pain.
- Guiseppi
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maffumatt
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ditto
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Bondservant
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #16 on: Oct 20th, 2005, 11:08pm » |
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Pleased to be here!
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floridian
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on Oct 20th, 2005, 2:57pm, Bondservant wrote: NONE of our soldiers are beheading Iraqis, dragging and mutilating their bodies or setting them aflame. You seem confused about who is doing what to whom over there.
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No, we are only burning the bodies of Afghanis and then taunting the villagers over loudspeakers. Just a minor violation of the Geneva convention, something that we found deplorable in Fallujah, but which we do ourselves in other places.
http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5478,16988322%255E6 63,00.html
And President Bush, who hasn't vetoed any bill to date, is threatening to veto John McCain's law banning torture should it pass. Why in the name of Abu Graib would President Bush be opposed to laws that made torture a crime??
http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/editorial/outlook/3397077
And then there is the American soldier who is suffering permanent brain damage he incurred while he was stationed in Guantanamo bay. He was told to put on a prisoners uniform for a training exercise. A few of his fellow freedom loving humanitarian soldiers beat the living shit out of him, not stopping until they ripped his jump suit and saw the US uniform underneath.
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/nationworld/iraq/bal-te.gitmo19jun19,1, 3124172.story?coll=bal-iraq-headlines
No sir, no cannibalism in this man's navy.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/guantanamo/story/0,13743,1479069,00.html
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Jonny
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #18 on: Oct 22nd, 2005, 5:22pm » |
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on Oct 22nd, 2005, 4:55pm, floridian wrote:
And then there is the American soldier who is suffering permanent brain damage he incurred while he was stationed in Guantanamo bay. ] |
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LMAO....I sued three people and got 30 grand.....I wasent even hurt.....weak, Flo.....dude is just looking for a payday.
As for the prison....you call that torture?.......LMMFAO
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It is up to YOU to educate yourself and then help your doctor plan your treatment. If you just sit down in front of your doctor and say "make me better" you are setting yourself up for a great deal of pain.
- Guiseppi
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kimmeesue
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #19 on: Oct 24th, 2005, 4:00pm » |
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on Oct 20th, 2005, 2:57pm, Bondservant wrote:
So we are clear, while I fault the Clinton administration for not intervening in Rwanda, they are not responsible for the killing. The Hutu militias and Hutu power government did that. |
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I realize we weren't responsible. Neither are we responsible for what goes on in the rest of the world. My concern is what motivates us to intervene in one place and not another. The US can't be the savior to the entire world at such a great cost to our own people. And I am not just speaking politically.
Exactly who appointed us God?
Certainly not a new idea, just one that has troubled me more of late.
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If I wasn't doing this I'd probably be doing something else.
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Charlie
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #20 on: Oct 24th, 2005, 7:40pm » |
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Quote:Exactly who appointed us God?
Certainly not a new idea, just one that has troubled me more of late. |
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It's just that since WWII, we've had the wherewithall to be pretty fuckin' obnoxious. 
We'll get over it some day.
Charlie
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| « Last Edit: Oct 24th, 2005, 7:53pm by Charlie » |
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karma
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #21 on: Oct 25th, 2005, 10:36am » |
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Quote:| LMAO....I sued three people and got 30 grand.....I wasent even hurt |
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From the same dude that has a problem with the court system giving illegal, workers benefits.
I guess the sytem only works when your ripping someone off.
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seasonalboomer
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #22 on: Oct 25th, 2005, 10:58am » |
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okay, I'm back from vacaction...
As Rwanda and the movie Hotel Rwanda, I will first say that I haven't wept at a film before in my life until this one. Sure a tear in the eye for every sad movie, but this one I was weeping.
Now, before everyone thinks, oh, what a wanker.
The sad thing is not simply that the U.S. didn't follow up on these issues, its that that Israel and the world's Jews stayed silent, inspite of the many who have committed "never again". "Never again to us", I guess. Or that the many other countries, who have had far greater involvement in Rwanda didn't do what they should have. Belgium, France and the rest of the light blue caps that make up the U.N. forces.
As for the repeated testimony by U.S. officials regarding the technical definition between "genocide" and "geneocidal-like-behavior", that is the part that made me isck ot my stomach regarding our (yes, all of our) complicit inaction.
Just sad.
Scott
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Pinkfloyd
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #23 on: Oct 25th, 2005, 11:54am » |
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on Oct 20th, 2005, 1:37am, rumplestiltskin wrote:| It is far easier to accept the corporate amerikan party line...be spoon fed by Clear Channel...and scream "my country right or wrong"...far easier...than seeing the truth of what our gov't is actually doing to the rest of the world...to it's own...den |
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Your famous "take what you need and leave the rest" is good enough for this society (ch.com), but not the world at large?
You advocate taking from here and not trying to make it a better place, just USE it. Just let all the B*llsh*t go on around you as long as you get what you need.
I guess our government is just following your advice. We take what we need and leave the rest according to you. Maybe Bush/Clinton et al got your message.
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"Nothing is so firmly believed as what we least know."
"There is no passion so contagious as that of fear."
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kimmeesue
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Re: Hotel Rwanda
« Reply #24 on: Oct 25th, 2005, 12:09pm » |
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Have we not become the omnipotent moral busybodies to whom C.S. Lewis referred?
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If I wasn't doing this I'd probably be doing something else.
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