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Topic: Explosions In Egypt! (Read 1037 times) |
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cootie
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #1 on: Jul 22nd, 2005, 11:50pm » |
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Ya know.......scarey shit is goin down......and I sit here and wonder WTF do terrorist types 'really want'.......is there anything that could or would be changed that would stop them all and there be peace ? I really really doubt that........guess a terrorist plan is to terrorize even if it is just to make you paranoid in your own skin Pam
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Carl_D
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #2 on: Jul 22nd, 2005, 11:56pm » |
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on Jul 22nd, 2005, 11:50pm, cootie wrote:| guess a terrorist plan is to terrorize even if it is just to make you paranoid in your own skin Pam |
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Exactly!
I say Fuck 'em and as BOC said... Don't Fear The Reaper
CD
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cootie
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #3 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 12:13am » |
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BTW.......last week when I was checkin out my groceries and stuff at the local Walmart I seen something that rally freaked me out........this lady came walking in all dressed in floor length flowy black outfit and was compleltey cover'd except her eyes.......dam it was hot out too and to have to dress like that !!!!! Was hot material like stuff and I about turned to stone when she walked past me......big lady too in all ways. Now WTF are them types doin in my town ? I mean somewhere in this town is a husband that has that sort of rules to make her continue to dress that way around here......is he my dentist, my doctor or pharmacist !? (just useing those occupations to make a point here).......there's so many in this town from over there and, yeah......I suppose I am feeling "terror-in-them" Pam
Most that ran the stores and all have disapear'd.....closed up or whatever and alot dress differently now since 911. But I still WONDER. Now most run small gas stations I noticed and there NOT very freindly !!! I jus dunno.......are we watching them close........esp any that go back and forth home ??
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Gator
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #4 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 12:42am » |
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World War III was the Cold War. We are now in the midst of World War IV - the war against radical Islamic Terrorism. This is one we can't afford to lose.
Batten down the hatches, it's going to be a bumpy ride.
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burnt-toast
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #5 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 1:48am » |
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on Jul 22nd, 2005, 11:38pm, Carl_D wrote:
In this type of war who/what/where do you attack?
How do you fight a global Holy War that has no specific objectives other than to cause terror through shocking attacks that lack strategic purpose.
How can you utilize milatary and technological superiority when there are no battle lines or battle fields for that matter and attacks will most likely be in metropolitan areas.
With backing from the U.S. (and other nations) Islamic fundamentalists broke the bank of Russia because it could not afford to continue fighting this very type of war. What makes the U.S. immune to the same financial disaster? Nothing - the growing national debt and incrasing trade deficits have the U.S. on a fast track to the same disaster.
While this Holy War goes on - how can we afford to deal with China - the last vestage of large communistic govenment that:
- is rapidly displacing U.S. manufacturing capabilities.
- is buying up U.S. debt faster than we can grow it.
- is ramping up its military - both in numbers and technology using U.S. dollalrs.
- has created steel and oil gluts by ramping up its manufacturing capabilities and stockpiling for its military buildup.
Allowing and promoting this makes no sense but we have "Global Corporations" owned by/funding our political leaders who are reaping huge profits from lopsided "free trade" *NOT FAIR TRADE* agreements that fuel China's power.
The only interest nations have in the Middle East is oil. The only wealth and power Middle Eastern nations have is oil. Technoligies to dramatically decrease dependence on oil and render the Middle East a non-issue exist - but are not being developed.
Allowing this makes no sense but we have global oil companies owned by/funding our political leaders who are reaping huge profits from the endless demand for oil.
If anyone thinks this is a Bush/Republicans issue guess again Democrats own significant stakes in these oil companies too. Finally, regardles of the administration - Democratic or Republican in the last few decades these problems have escalated.
Globalization, greed and attempting to change foreign cultures to conform to some ideal global model is the problem. History has repeatedly proven that no Nation -regardless of its power can conquer or police the world. We've learned nothing from history and if we don't change course soon we are going to repeat it.
Tom
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| « Last Edit: Jul 23rd, 2005, 1:50am by burnt-toast » |
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Lizzie2
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #6 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 1:58am » |
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It makes me worried that some people have an extreme reaction and now feel differently about all muslims, even to the point of treating them quite differently.
My nextdoor neighbor family is from India - they are Muslim. They do practice some traditional culture, but as far as the 4 in that family, all of them dress in normal attire on a daily basis! They're a very very nice family.
Lubaina is probably in her residency now - she went to med school in Philadelphia. Tasneem is planning to go to dental school.
Their father used to be an engineer for Amtrak until he got laid off several years ago - not sure what his job is now.
At any rate, I just feel bad that all muslims now suffer because of the extreme radicals. 
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LeLimey
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #7 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 2:35am » |
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on Jul 23rd, 2005, 12:13am, cootie wrote:| ........this lady came walking in all dressed in floor length flowy black outfit and was compleltey cover'd except her eyes.............big lady too in all ways. |
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And you were quite certain this was a lady Pam? The trouble with the burka is that ANYONE can be under it. We see alot of "foreign" arabs wearing them here (In London mainly) but our home grown variety wear western clothes. I haven't seen anyone in a burka outside of the shopping districts in the West End of London ever come to think of it. That someone living in the middle of the USA is making his wife wear one makes me wonder WTF he is doing there if he is that determined to keep his culture. Most people when they emigrate do so for a "better" life..
on Jul 23rd, 2005, 1:58am, Lizzie2 wrote:| It makes me worried that some people have an extreme reaction and now feel differently about all muslims, even to the point of treating them quite differently.....At any rate, I just feel bad that all muslims now suffer because of the extreme radicals. |
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Nobody here is treating muslims any differently. We have always had some race crime - where doesn't? BUT there hasn't been any increase reported. I haven't heard of any racial crimes reported lately at all as it goes. I'd like to see where you got your impression that ALL muslims are suffering from though.
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sandie99
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #8 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 2:43am » |
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I can tell that slowly people in here are getting worried: in 2 weeks' time athletes from all around the world are coming to Finland. The news do not mention it directly, but I can tell that every time some terrorism expert is telling opinions the journalists want to know for sure that nothing will happen in here. Finland is very uninteresting country to terrorists (thank God for that) but the world championships make us bit more interesting.
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hdido
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I am less afraid of race crime or terrorists than of governments taking away our basic liberties and civil rights in the name of "protecting" us from evildoers. There are people in prisons in the US, some for years, who have not been charged with anything, have no access to lawyers or the outside world at all because they are "suspected" of having something to do with terrorism. Remember your history, folks-the greatest threat to any nation is its own government, doesn't matter what party. We had a taste of it during WWII with the internment of innocent Japanese (but, interestingly enough, not Germans). If democracies are going to remain democracies, then suspected terrorists should be treated like any other suspected criminal: they should go through the same legal process and have the same legal rights. I think that it is a bit naive to say that people who "look" Middle Eastern or are Muslims are not going to be treated differently-if not by the people then certainly by governments. The French already have had a law for several years making it a crime to be acquainted with someone, no matter how little and even if you have no knowledge of their plans if they later turn out to be terrorists. I see the US and now the UK moving in the direction of establishing more of a police state type government and in the midst of justified fear, the people will go along, but once laws are passed they are difficult to rescind, particularly since all governments, IMO, like to have more control over their populations. Read "1984"....I just think that Orwell may have used the wrong date.
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Topical
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #10 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 8:22am » |
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We made it through the commies and this conflict is nothing in comparison. Remember all those missiles pointed at us that would cause a nuclear winter?
This reminds me of the 70's when hijacking of airplanes was the norm. It came and then it largely went away until 9/11.
The ones who have attacked us do not wear a burka or one of those prayer hats. They wear sweatshirts that say "New York" on them. Increased security is only one way to combat this problem. I am not going to endorse genocide or locking people up en masse as was done in WWII.
We need more friends over there who will turn in these people. That's the only real thing I can think of that will control this problem. There will always be lapses of security. I can guarantee that if people start burning down mosques it will only get worse, much worse.
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burnt-toast
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #11 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 10:20am » |
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on Jul 23rd, 2005, 8:22am, Topical wrote:We made it through the commies and this conflict is nothing in comparison. Remember all those missiles pointed at us that would cause a nuclear winter?
This reminds me of the 70's when hijacking of airplanes was the norm. It came and then it largely went away until 9/11.
The ones who have attacked us do not wear a burka or one of those prayer hats. They wear sweatshirts that say "New York" on them. Increased security is only one way to combat this problem. I am not going to endorse genocide or locking people up en masse as was done in WWII.
We need more friends over there who will turn in these people. That's the only real thing I can think of that will control this problem. There will always be lapses of security. I can guarantee that if people start burning down mosques it will only get worse, much worse. |
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Don't underestimate the potential for disaster this type of war presents.
We haven't survived Communism - in fact our economic policies are helping build the industrial and ecomomic power of the largest Communistic Nation left - China. China is only beginning to build its military capabilities with U.S. dollars and flex its new power but it is already a frightening force to contend with that simply ignores any human rights and economic treaties it agrees to.
Hdido is right - free nations are using our new fear as a means to implement laws that eliminate basic human rights and restrict freedoms within their own populations. Establishing police states in the name of combating terrorism is not protecting freedom.
Nations are spending hundreds of billions of dollars and sacrificing countless lives to combat terrorism and bring democracy to nations/people that have no interest in living in democracies. Our milatary actions are fueling hatred and only feeding a Holy War that is costly and can't be won.
Without secure borders carrying the Holy War to the U.S. is an easy task. Yet our borders remain wide open and in fact our government is more intent on passing ligislation like the "Patriot Act" to create a police state than proactively stoping potential terrorists. What should we make of this policy?
We have no Friends over there - NONE. Saudi Arabia is the closest thing to friend - and they openly discuss the need to destroy America and "crush our skulls" on their national TV. We're even hated in Kuait - what does that tell you?
Middle Eastern nations have been at war with one another since the dawn of time. The only thing uniting these nations in Holy Wars throughout history has been their willingness to oppose any outside interference with their cultures. Read your history books - every nation attempting to change these cultures paid dearly fighting the same type of war being waged against ours and other nations today. Russia's involvement in the Middle East in an attempt to control oil reserves is the most recent example of how costly this type of war is. Thank Islamic Extremeists for the U.S.S.R.'s collapse not the policies of democratic nations.
Bad foreign and domestic policies driven by greed have led to the current crisis. Waging wars/policing the globe and eliminating basic human rights is not the solution - it's the problem.
Regardless of how many times this has proven itself over recorded history, greed always leads to bad decisons and dire consequences. Yet we never learn -Someone or Something (in this case corporations) are always attempting to take over the world and using innocent people(s) as pawns. Unless our foreign policies stop being driven by greed the Holy War will never stop and like Russia we will be economically bled to death. This is the primary objective of the Terrorists" and they are achieving their objective.
Tom
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| « Last Edit: Jul 23rd, 2005, 10:21am by burnt-toast » |
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floridian
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #12 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 10:31am » |
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Nothing new in these explosions - the Muslim Brotherhood has been waging a war against the govt. of Egypt for decades. Before, they had to do something major (like assasinate Sadat) to get attention. Now the media is more sensitive to their plight as the Brotherhood is seen al Al Qaeda affiliated.
What's more troubling are reports that the US is prepared to attack Iran (with possible use of nukes) if we get hit by another 9/11 style attack - regardless of whether Iran had anything to do with it. I guess somebody has to be punished - the US certainly wouldn't use terrorism as a pretext. </sarcasm> Can't find the links, but apparently some people in the military don't like the 'contingency plans' being drawn up - would transform WWIV from intermittent battles with an amorphous foe to a major shit-storm across the Middle East.
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Lizzie2
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #13 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 11:37am » |
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on Jul 23rd, 2005, 2:35am, LeLimey wrote:
Nobody here is treating muslims any differently. We have always had some race crime - where doesn't? BUT there hasn't been any increase reported. I haven't heard of any racial crimes reported lately at all as it goes. I'd like to see where you got your impression that ALL muslims are suffering from though.
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Well, there have been several reports of it here ever since 9/11. I know that people do fear things. Right after 9/11, there were quite a few articles about people of middle eastern decent being questioned for all kinds of reasons - held up in airports for no apparent reason, etc. It's often a hot topic of conversation on the news. There were quite a few stories coming out of muslim communities just in this area alone where people's shops were destroyed and other such events after 9/11.
So - that's why I worry from time to time. I know that most people don't act or feel that all muslims are terrorists, but there are those out there who do!
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yikes-another-one
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #15 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 11:41am » |
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You don't have to be Christian
to believe in a higher power,
and to get a personal relationship with it.
The Bible is the source I turn to,
and it promises a
PEACE that PASSES UNDERSTANDING
Take a look around this planet,
with scorpions,sharks, Survival of the fittest,
Hurricanes, Monsoons, Floods and Droughts,
Forest fires, Lack, Fear, Deadly things....
and terrorists.
We are promised, that if we turn to the Creator,
and rely on him,
that no thing will kill us.
That we could eat poison,
walk through firey trials,
and still not taste of the final death.
Somewhere between life and death
we find courage and faith...
and that is where the peace rises up.
When the creator has already won,
and everything that is was crated by him,
there is no place for fear,
there is no time for worry.
This life is a quick joyride,
you blink and a hundred years goes by.
We are not guaranteed
another heartbeat, we are not even
safe from choking on our next swallow....
so just live it all to the fullest,
and know that You are part of soemthing eternal.
He is watching over his creation,
the same way a new cook watches
over a pan of frying eggs, fiddling and
mving it aroudn so it won't burn, but leaving
it over the heat until the egg solidifies
and is "done"
When this earth is done,
who cares.
We might be around to watch it,
we might be onto a new assignment.
It really won't affect my today....
if I am lucky enough to get another today.
Relax and do you best.
That is all that is anyone's job.
Forget about judgement and right or wrong,
just pass on the love and the knoweldge
that you have, make your life a better place,
and let that be the legacy you pass on to the entire world.
It is what it is, right E?
peace does pass understanding.
If you use your ears and eyes
you would dread crossing the street,
camping in the dessert, eating processed food....
everything in life is dangerous,
so what.
My god is more powerful than the poisonous snakes
that pollute the earth.
He will protect me, if he wants to.
It's His will that allows me to live and work and play.
So be it.
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nani
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #16 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 11:43am » |
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Well said, TJ.
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floridian
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #18 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 12:29pm » |
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on Jul 23rd, 2005, 11:41am, maffumatt wrote:
Why?? It's pseudo-scholarly clap-trap. In the end, it lumps all Islam with radical Islam. That's like claiming all Christians are part and parcel of the Christian Knights of the KKK, and that all Christianity is guilty of slaughtering the Indians and enslaving Africans to pick cotton in the name of the cross. But that doesn't square with the Christians I know, or the Christianity they practice.
It also focuses on the scripture of Islam in a way it would never do with Christianity - who was that pro-family 'Prince of Peace' who said:
Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. For I am come to set a man against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man's foes shall be they of his own household. (Matthew 10).
Yeah, if you want to quote scripture, you can portray both Christianity and Islam as violent. But the people I know in both religions are pretty ordinary - they aren't bearing a sword against anyone.
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| « Last Edit: Jul 23rd, 2005, 12:31pm by floridian » |
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Topical
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #19 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 2:25pm » |
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Tom,
If China wants to make money they have to go through us - the free world. It suits their interests to keep us well fed and with money. We are the gasoline that drives their engine. With or without communism it is a country that has so many people that it will always remain a rival to others. The same can be said of India.
I don't know how old you are but the communism of today is not like it was in the decades past. We needed a new enemy and terrorism was it.
Terrorism is a great excuse to limit our freedoms. If it wasn't foreign then it would be domestic terrorism. The government has weaved us into this situation. The problem is there, now how do you think it should be handled?
I hear your complaint against our liberty being taken away. I don't like it either. I suggested we talk and make friends with the arab people. The sooner we do that the better. So what would you do?
What holy war? It was declared by a small number or radicals. If it was a holy war the US would be swarmed over within a few weeks. In a holy war everyone who is muslim would attack. You seem to be buying into fear and hyperbole. If you want a holy war, then burn down mosques and attack innocent muslims.
Saudi Arabia is not our closest friend over there. They asked us to remove our forces and bases. We agreed as they would not allow us to use planes stationed there to bomb Iraq.
"The Iraq war was directed largely from U.S. Central Command headquarters, which had been established in Qatar. U.S. forces also used expanded bases and runways in Oman, Kuwait and the United Arab Emirates."
From 2003: http://www.globalsecurity.org/org/news/2003/030430-psab01.htm
There's four friends, Egypt would be five. They paid the price with the attack today. Indonesia has the largest muslim population. They have radical groups there too. Still, I would consider Indonesia to be an ally or trading partner. Afghanistan and Iraq are potential friends. India has muslims and we just announced that we are selling them weapons. Israel is in the region, I don't know if you want to include them.
"Middle Eastern nations have been at war with one another since the dawn of time...."
Do you think that the western world has not had an equal number of battles even religious based wars? This includes Americans who slaughtered Native Americans to take over the land. We're not innocent, we conquered others for our own needs. Why should they be any different? Why put arabs into some unique category?
Russia went into Afghanistan to get their oil? Do you mean hash oil? You can thank the US government who provided stinger missiles and trained the mujahudeen and other tribes. It was Afghanistans who wanted their country back. We were glad to help them out.
"Bad foreign and domestic policies driven by greed have led to the current crisis."
I totally agree with you here. However, it wasn't only greed, oil is a very important resource to our society. The control of it is very important. We didn't attack because there were terrorists over there. It's an excuse, the same excuse being used to limit our freedoms.
We stirred up the honey pot, what should we do now that we are in this position? I don't recall reading your solution to the problem.
There was a funeral today for one of the people who was murdered in the London bombings. I think these words are very profound.
"These present atrocities and Anthony's death have raised great emotions in us," Auxiliary Bishop of Westminster Alan Hopes told mourners. "We are angry, we are appalled and we are grieving. But as Christians we cannot yield to bitterness, we cannot yield to thoughts of revenge."
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| « Last Edit: Jul 24th, 2005, 7:19am by Topical » |
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Topical
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #20 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 2:34pm » |
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on Jul 23rd, 2005, 10:31am, floridian wrote:Nothing new in these explosions - the Muslim Brotherhood has been waging a war against the govt. of Egypt for decades. Before, they had to do something major (like assasinate Sadat) to get attention. Now the media is more sensitive to their plight as the Brotherhood is seen al Al Qaeda affiliated.
What's more troubling are reports that the US is prepared to attack Iran (with possible use of nukes) if we get hit by another 9/11 style attack - regardless of whether Iran had anything to do with it. I guess somebody has to be punished - the US certainly wouldn't use terrorism as a pretext. </sarcasm> Can't find the links, but apparently some people in the military don't like the 'contingency plans' being drawn up - would transform WWIV from intermittent battles with an amorphous foe to a major shit-storm across the Middle East. |
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So true, it is all because of Israel. Nobody tells us who our friends are though. They can't seem to get the message.
I didn't hear about Iran. I don't see how we can blame another 9/11 attack on them. We probably wouldn't need the nukes but we would need a draft. I don't think they have nukes yet in Iran(hoping). I wonder if Israel is going to launch another attack like they did before. Surprising they haven't done it yet. If they did, it would be a trigger point.
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Kevin_M
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #21 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 3:20pm » |
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on Jul 23rd, 2005, 2:25pm, Topical wrote:| What holy war? It was declared by a small number or radicals. If it was a holy war the US would be swarmed over within a few weeks. In a holy war everyone who is muslim would attack. You seem to be buying into fear and hyperbole. |
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Agree.
Here, we seem to live in peace ok here, interethnically/religiously, despite this city's dangerous reputation. This many so nearby is not even a concern, and one of the least of Detroit's worries. After 9/11, the FBI cleaned house pretty well.
Quote:Detroit is home to America's largest Arab population at more than 300,000. It has more clubs and cultural centers, social service agencies, national headquarters for Arab groups and Arab businesses than any other U.S. city. - Detroit Free Press
August 9, 2004 ... Research Detroit Arab American study portrays a complex population. By Diane Swanbrow News Service ... http://www.umich.edu/~urecord/0304/July19_04/arabamer.shtml |
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The U of MI study shows, roughly 57% are Christian and 43% are Muslim, living within the community together.
Kevin M
*terrorists suck
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| « Last Edit: Jul 23rd, 2005, 3:27pm by Kevin_M » |
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Melissa
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #22 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 4:05pm » |
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on Jul 23rd, 2005, 3:20pm, Kevin_M wrote:
The U of MI study shows, roughly 57% are Christian and 43% are Muslim, living within the community together.
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This needs to be put in bold print at a size 72 font on every single f'ing message board, newspaper, spam emails and TV news station on the entire planet EARTH!!!
Oh, and I ditto K's "terrorists suck" comment too.
mel
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Charlie
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #23 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 7:14pm » |
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Frankly, if I have a choice on how to proceed, (yikes, these incidents bring out some lunatics...what a blog. Just the title page was a pretty good indication of its content. BIG. REALLY BIG) I'll stick with Tony Blair and George Bush. Even Bush has a few roots in reality. He's just not interested in you or me; just his wealthy friends, but he's not insane. Not on Iraq but on dealing with these new attacks.
Another example: A spokesman for a Colorado Congressman thinks we should bomb Mecca. I kid you not.
Yahooism at its peak.
To me, there is a whiff of similarity between-these not very religious killers-and the Baader-Meinhof gang....allbeit convoluted. Lots of homegrown types not all that interested in history.
Charlie
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| « Last Edit: Jul 23rd, 2005, 7:16pm by Charlie » |
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There is nothing more satisfying than being shot at without result---Winston Churchill
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Jeepgun
CH.com Alumnus
New Board Hall of Famer
BOHICA!!!
Gender:
Posts: 3840
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Re: Explosions In Egypt!
« Reply #24 on: Jul 23rd, 2005, 7:42pm » |
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I agree with every point you made in the above post, Charlie. (And because I've agreed with you on a political thread, I'm certain that this must be a sign that the Apocalypse is near. I think I'll go hide in my bathtub with my teddy bear, now.) 
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Her: "Have you ever hit a deer?"
Me: "What, like, in the FACE?"
Her: ..... "WHAT is the MATTER with you!?"
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