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Topic: Lets wake up it is time to get real (Read 2906 times) |
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medic1852
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Lets wake up it is time to get real
« on: Mar 15th, 2005, 6:02pm » |
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Ok let me start with an apology to everyone I am about to offend. But Lizzie put me up on my soapbox and I wont be able to rest until I get this off my chest.
First off to blame a gun on someone’s death is the most idiotic thing I have ever heard of. There have been countless people killed with other things as well. To name a few, hammers, knives, screwdrivers, axes, drills, just to name a few. What do all of these have in common? They are all tools just like a gun.
Yes a gun is a tool; it has been used for years to put food on people’s tables, to protect families, to put clothes on people’s backs.
I was raised with guns, I am not kidding when I say my father let me cut my teeth on a colt revolver. I have been shooting since I was 2 years old. I have been hunting since I was 5. Guns are a large part of my life.
While I was in the Marine Corps I lost a good friend to hand gun accident. It was not the gun that killed this friend. We were all sitting around a table and one of the guys was asking about a handgun that one of my other friends had for sale. It was a Taurus .45 caliber automatic. We all had been drinking most of the day; the gun was unloaded by the owner and laid on the table. It was passed around and about 2 or 3 beers later the owner picked it up, and dry fired it, after all he unloaded it. Except it wasn’t a dry fire, someone had reloaded it. The gun went off and went through the table into my friend’s stomach. Now a .45 makes a nice hole and tears a lot of things up. My friend bled out before the ambulance could arrive. Was it the gun that killed my friend, no it was and accident.
There are hundreds of people killed yearly by automobiles in accidents, plane and train crashes and sinking boats, should we outlaw them as well? I got an idea lets all curl up in a nice little plastic bubble and pretend that it is a perfect world and we will all be safe. It is not the gun that kills people it is people who kill people. Make the criminal pay for his crime not me.
I dare you to come to my house and tell me I can’t have a gun, come get them! 
Respectfully Submitted
Rodger
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Hirvimaki
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #1 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 6:10pm » |
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No argument from me.
I'm a life-time member of the NRA.
Hirvimaki-Isi
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"What makes us discontented with our condition is the absurdly exaggerated idea we have of the happiness of others."
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medic1852
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #2 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 6:12pm » |
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on Mar 15th, 2005, 6:10pm, Hirvimaki wrote:No argument from me.
I'm a life-time member of the NRA.
Hirvimaki-Isi |
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Damn I had you all wrong..I had you pegged as a tree hugging hippy. 
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nani
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #3 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 6:14pm » |
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Hey! Watch it, Rog....I'm a tree hugging hippie... 
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Lizzie2
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #4 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 6:16pm » |
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My guess is that you are also against OSHA, the National Transportation Safety Board, and other efforts out there to improve safety in our society....
When I got stuck with a needle...guess who's fault that was? Technically? If we really want to get technical about it? Mine. I stuck myself with a contaminated needle.
But as it turns out, those lancets I got stuck with are actually recently against OSHA regulations. And yes, public health departments are responsible for complying with OSHA. It just takes one person who got stuck to make one phone call....
If the "dangerous objects" aren't a problem...then why do we have needleless systems in hospitals and all these safety locks to protect needles and needle accidents?
Why not go back to the days where everything was just lying out in the open...and a whole hell of a lot more people got hurt or killed because we didn't know jack shit about safety.
Sue me for thinking we should at least make an EFFORT to educate people about safety and trying to make this world a safer place.
But I guess if it were in your hands, we probably would not have car airbags or regulations about child car seats either, then....
It makes just about as much sense...
It's just that when it comes to guns, people get overly defensive...
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medic1852
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #5 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 6:23pm » |
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Lizzie dont get me started about OSHA and safety. I for one know all about safety standard. I work in the back of a moving ambulance. Not in the nice clean sterile hospital. I have never been stuck in the back of a MOVING ambulance. You would be one of those people who recomend that the lawnmower have the label warning you about the moving blades underneath. So that they dont stick there hands underneath and get them cut off. My point is this..
I will make this as simple as possible and use capital letters so that you can understand.
"PEOPLE NEED TO TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR THERE ACTIONS, NOT ME. GUNS DONT KILL PEOPLE. PEOPLE KILL PEOPLE."
By the way I am not a member of the NRA. I just want everyone to be responsible for themselves. It is not the goverments place to babysit me!
Rodger
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Lizzie2
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #6 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 6:30pm » |
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My roommate is an EMT..worked for the ambulance for years. She will be a flight nurse by the end of her return duty to Einstein Hospital in North Philly for her scholarship here.
Her dad is a state trooper. One of her recent boyfriends was also a state trooper.
Know what? We had guns in this apartment.
I've been in her dad's van when his uniform and gun are right in the back seat.
Diane's take on this would be that children of cops who know how to safely store and protect their guns are not the ones dying. Diane doesn't even know where her dad keeps the gun. I'm pretty sure my own father owns a gun, and I've never found it...although I've found enough to be pretty sure he has one.
It is rediculous to think that a 4 year old child who accidentally shot and killed his mother with a gun should be the one held accountable for her death. I think the people responsible are the family for their improper safety when storing a gun so a FOUR YEAR OLD wouldn't wind up finding it and shooting his mother.
Diane (my EMT roommate who works for the ambulance about 80 hours a week) is the one who told me that OSHA has now banned the use of unprotected lancets in public health settings...ie., hospitals, health districts, and YES even ambulances.
I guess I'll remember next time I discharge a new mom to tell her it isn't really that big a deal if she buckles the safety seat into the back seat of her car with her 2 day old infant in it....
Asking for safety is not unreasonable...and this is done by people being ACCOUNTABLE for safety... Why do we have to wait for the harm to be done? They should be held accountable for not storing the gun safely in the first place...not the child being held accountable once he shot his mom. He didn't even know what in hell death meant!
It's called prevention...and it is NOT a bad thing.
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medic1852
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #7 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 6:37pm » |
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Education in saftey is not a bad thing I never said it was. What I said is that guns are not bad things, cars are not bad things. Stupidity is a bad thing. But it is not the goverments place to ensure that we are not stupid. By the way needless and saftey needles are not the standard. OSHA has not gotten fully involved as of yet, they recomend we use them but do not require it.
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Lizzie2
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #8 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 6:49pm » |
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And had you read through all my original posts, I said that I was not for the government placing a ban on guns. In fact I said that would probably be rather counterproductive...since the ban on illegal drugs has obviously gotten us real far...
What I was SAYING was that my cousin would not have been killed that day if there had not been a gun in his house.
His father chose to buy and own a gun. The kids were able to find it, and although they thought it was unloaded, it was loaded. Stephen's best friend shot him by accident and killed him.
Seriously...his father can own the gun all he wants. I don't care. I'm not asking the government to step in and say he isn't allowed to have it.
But I do think that we should be working much harder to educate people about safety and guns in the home...especially where children are concerned.
It's a fact that Stephen would be alive today if they hadn't had access to that gun.
His father has every right to own one, but had he not owned one...or at least been better about securing it away from children, then Stephen wouldn't be dead!
I'm not saying the government should go in and take his gun away. But I do think that much GREATER effort needs to be made about how to handle guns in the home. That's the responsibility of everyone in society. Maybe his father was being stupid by not protecting that weapon....maybe he doesn't have the knowledge necessary to know how to properly secure a gun....someone needs to be out there teaching people about safety.
I know that my entire job is pretty much geared towards teaching people about basic safety, even when it should be common sense. Sometimes common sense doesn't agree with people...and then really bad things happen.
So I was just trying to say from the start that, yes, Stephen would still be alive if the gun wasn't in the home. However, the government should not ban the gun...but instead, society as a whole should take more responsibility for educating those who choose to own a gun about how to properly take care of it! Yes, my uncle should and does feel accountable for the accident that happened that day. As does the other child who shot my cousin. But, as has been stated...it was an accident....albeit most likely a preventable one if more steps had been taken to ensure basic safety.
Let's not argue about this anymore.... I don't think we are at complete odds of opinions... I'm not saying the government should ban all guns, and you aren't saying that education is a bad thing. It's just that I feel these issues need to be addressed in a form of prevention and not reactionary.
Lizzie
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Redneck
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #9 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 6:52pm » |
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O tay, open mouth insert foot.
wtf does a lancet have to do with a freaking gun? I been in public health for 24 years, I have taken guns away from patients. I ain't never seen anyone shot with a lancet, syringe, vacutainer needle, etc. I have drawn blood on the back of my truck, in a cotton field on a running tractor. I have been stuck with a dirty needle. I still own and use my weapons, and will continue to. Everyone is entitled to their opinion as long as they dont force theirs on me.
I just don't see the connection.
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Lizzie2
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #10 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 7:12pm » |
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on Mar 15th, 2005, 6:52pm, Redneck wrote:O tay, open mouth insert foot.
wtf does a lancet have to do with a freaking gun? I been in public health for 24 years, I have taken guns away from patients. I ain't never seen anyone shot with a lancet, syringe, vacutainer needle, etc. I have drawn blood on the back of my truck, in a cotton field on a running tractor. I have been stuck with a dirty needle. I still own and use my weapons, and will continue to. Everyone is entitled to their opinion as long as they dont force theirs on me.
I just don't see the connection. |
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LOL it's okay and no, Roger and I do not hate each other.  It's okay to have a "heated" discussion once in awhile!
The reason why we are talking about lancets, needles and guns in the same conversation is because I was coming from a standpoint of basic safety...not just about guns, but about anything that could put someone's life/health/etc at risk.
And yeah...contaminated needles can be dangerous... I'll state plainly that because of my incident, I now have to take Combivir (an AZT combination) for a month and today was my 3rd week of appointments for testing/results/counseling, but I still have 4 more appointments to go before I will be "in the clear" so to speak.
My point is that if the health district would spend a penny to invest in safer products, then we wouldn't have to spend thousands to treat those stuck by contaminated needles... Combivir is $150 a week...and that's just taking it twice a day.
Basic safety...that's all I think I was trying to say. It applies to every aspect of life...be it needles, guns, bleach, cars, planes, whatever.
I am in nursing because I believe that "prevention" is the best way to save a life.
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karma
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #11 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 7:13pm » |
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Since cars are so often brought up in comparing death statistics why not make the requirements equeal.
In order to drive a car you must pass a test. This is required to get a license.
In order to license a car you must have insurance and the car must pass inspection. ( note that this does not stop an unlicensed thief from driving an unlicensed car)
Make recreational gunowners pass a safety and practucal test in order to receive a license.
Require recreational gunowners to have insurance for accidental harm or death. (liability)
Require gunowners to submit the licensed firearm and themselves to annual inspections and a user safety test.
This won't stop the illegal posession of firearms but it will cost gunowners enough time and money that they will think twice about exactly why they need a firearm.
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Lizzie2
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #12 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 7:22pm » |
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Yeah.. Karma, that's a good point, too.
Actually, if done correctly, there are a number of clearances and papers that have to be filed and approved before someone can own a gun legally...and there is a waiting period. I'm not sure if that is a state-based law...so in PA maybe we have such strict regulations but maybe not in other states? I'm not sure....
But what we discussed in our nursing class the other day is that gun laws really would only reach people who don't really need gun laws because they already follow them. It's the crazies on the street using guns left and right to kill anyone they don't like who need more strict gun control...but even if we had more gun laws, these people would never abide by them.
So...yeah, in a way...creating more gun laws really is just like putting more and more strict bans on Cocaine. Those who use it are going to use it regardless of the laws out there.
Although hopefully the laws do allow at least some of the population to think before acting!
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Ueli
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #13 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 7:34pm » |
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I'll take over the soap box.
"It is not the gun that kills people it is people who kill people" is about the most idiotic excuse the gunslingers can put forward.
Equally idiotic is the comparison of guns with tool like hammers, knives, screwdrivers, axes, drills, just to name a few. These tool serve a useful purpose around the house, and only in rare cases a mentally deranged uses them to harm others. On the other hand guns are designed for killing, and hardly*) anything else but killing. Therefore, they belong only in the hand of policemen to protect the public against criminals (who have an ample supply of firearms because of the liberal laws) and the military to defend the country against aggressors (but it's wrong if they use them in an aggressive war to steal somebody else's oil wells).
"There are hundreds of people killed yearly by automobiles in accidents, plane and train crashes and sinking boats". True, these useful, and mostly necessary, activities claim their victims. But using that as an excuse for "accidental" gun victims is moronic. Most people need a car to go to work, but he who has a gun in the glove compartment probably needs to compensate for a tiny dick.
You need a gun to protect your family and home? Another lame argument! Does anybody have numbers of burglars killed/driven away versus numbers of accidental shootings of family members and other harmless people?
*) Note, before Jackie gets mad a me again  , there are some acceptable uses of guns, as target practice, a ritualized form of warfare, like an athlete throwing the javelin.
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Jonny
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #14 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 8:08pm » |
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on Mar 15th, 2005, 7:34pm, Ueli wrote:Therefore, they belong only in the hand of policemen to protect the public against criminals (who have an ample supply of firearms because of the liberal laws)
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So what you are saying Ueli....is that we should not protect ourselves from these criminals?
Is it that we should wait for the police to come and we are all dead?
If I carry a gun and some nut starts shooting people....should I not kill him and save lives?
As for having guns in my house......PLEASE try to enter my house if your not invited.....PLEASE!!!!!
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Lizzie2
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #15 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 8:22pm » |
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I carry a MACE combination spray to take to west Philly when I'm working in the health district. Gun deaths out there? At a new rediculous high...every day. The stories on the news are almost desensitizing the community to the fact that gun violence is a BAD thing. We watch the news and then say, "oh...hmm....5 more people got shot to death...just another day in Philadelphia." Something is wrong with that, though!
I'm 5'2" and not more than 120 lbs soaking wet. I am more or less defenseless against anyone who would try to attack me in a physical sense, but I do have my can of MACE. I think the odds of me being able to whip out my gun, load it, and get the safety off and then accurately aim to kill someone who was harming me (without some kind of massive training) are slim to none. If someone comes at me with a gun, providing ME personally with a gun isn't going to do one bit of difference.
So I choose to be very personally aware of my surroundings and of my safety issues. In the city, I really am bothered if people walk within like 3 feet of my personal space when I don't know them. I don't really trust people down here, but at the same time...that's making me safer because I'm aware of what is going on around me at all times. I'm constantly watching.
I have friends who carry guns. More power to them, I guess... They feel it is necessary for their own safety. I don't feel that my personal ownership of a gun would change my personal safety. I think my own personal awareness and taking my safety precautions to the best of my ability is the best I can do for myself. I try my very best not to put myself in any situation that is not safe....
As I've said, I'm currently at a health district which is the worst in the entire city. The population is very poor, often very violent, are victims as well as commit many crimes, carry many virulent diseases, as well as any number of other risk factors I could list....
For 3 weeks prior to coming here, I did home care. I was in the same "neighborhood" as the clientele I currently see. I was basically parking my car against the curb and bringing my bag into people's homes...sometimes I had no idea of what type of situation I would be walking into. We are taught that if something doesn't "feel" right...leave immediately and call for back-up. Do not put your life at risk just because you think you can handle it. No need to be a superhero just because you have to dress the heel ulcer on someone's foot!
There are times when I don't feel as safe as I'd like...but I try to be as aware as possible. I don't feel that owning a gun would make me any more safe than I am right now. But I know it helps some people to have a much higher sense of security.
To each his (or her) own!
L2
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Redneck
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #16 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 10:00pm » |
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on Mar 15th, 2005, 8:08pm, Jonny wrote:
So what you are saying Ueli....is that we should not protect ourselves from these criminals?
Is it that we should wait for the police to come and we are all dead?
If I carry a gun and some nut starts shooting people....should I not kill him and save lives?
As for having guns in my house......PLEASE try to enter my house if your not invited.....PLEASE!!!!!
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Well said bro ! Where I live you will be damn lucky to have a sheriff show up in 30 minutes. Nice to call the police and them show up and save you. But it ain't gonna happen here.
Edit before post. young people and children have access to this. grow up, get real, all you need is to have a friend, loved one, or relative mamied or killed by the scum. Then come talk to me about compassion for the poor criminals.
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notseinfeld
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #17 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 10:38pm » |
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One the few rights we do have as American citizens is the right to own guns. This was embedded in the Constitution not so we could shoot doves or have target practice but so that the people could be protect themselves against an unruly and oppressive government. Who in their right mind would feel safe living in a society where only the gov't and trickle down forces thereof had weapons?
Additionally if I hear someone snooping around my house at 2:00Am that the dog doesn't eat up first I can guarantee that fate would be preferable to the back up plan which would sound something like 'Ka-boom'.
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Charlie
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #18 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 10:39pm » |
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Before anyone hurts themselves; I am not for banning firearms for several reasons. However, I believe guns are almost useless as personal protection. It's hard, very hard to shoot someone and even harder to kill them. It's not the movies.
The comparison of other devices to a handgun is ridiculous. I'd rather any miscreant come at me with a screwdriver or lawnmower than a Beretta. Too, stating that there are (I don't know the figures. This is for illustration only) 40,000 auto crash deaths and only say 2,000 gun deaths as comparison, doesn't alter that 2,000 people were killed and are just as likely to remain that way.
However, if one treats guns as a hobby or for fun....and they can be lots of fun.... great. I have my mother's 410 shotgun. Talk about something useful only for fun, that is probably it.
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| « Last Edit: Mar 15th, 2005, 10:40pm by Charlie » |
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clarence
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #19 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 10:49pm » |
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on Mar 15th, 2005, 6:23pm, medic1852 wrote:| You would be one of those people who recomend that the lawnmower have the label warning you about the moving blades underneath. So that they dont stick there hands underneath and get them cut off. |
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Where the hell was that label when my dad stuck his fingers under the mower and cut off three of them...and then 2 weeks later when I did the SAME thing (though, in some twisted miracle, did not cut off any fingers)?
I know, I'm an idiot.
Casey
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Lizzie2
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #20 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 10:51pm » |
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on Mar 15th, 2005, 10:49pm, clarence wrote:
Where the hell was that label when my dad stuck his fingers under the mower and cut off three of them...and then 2 weeks later when I did the SAME thing (though, in some twisted miracle, did not cut off any fingers)?
I know, I'm an idiot.
Casey |
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Proof that safety labels are, indeed, important!  (Casey, I promise I'm not laughing at your and your father's misfortune...just thought it was ironic that you can relate to that specific example!)
How about that "Do not remove under penalty of law" tag on the mattress? I love that Serta sheep commercial...
Nothing like a good warning label.
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KingOfPain
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #21 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 10:57pm » |
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Colorado
Colorado Statutes : TITLE 18 CRIMINAL CODE : ARTICLE 1 PROVISIONS APPLICABLE TO OFFENSES GENERALLY : PART 7 JUSTIFICATION AND EXEMPTIONS FROM CRIMINAL RESPONSIBILITY : 18-1-704.5. Use of deadly physical force against an intruder.
Terms: statute (§18-1-704.5)
18-1-704.5. Use of deadly physical force against an intruder.
Statute text
(1) The general assembly hereby recognizes that the citizens of Colorado have a right to expect absolute safety within their own homes.
(2) Notwithstanding the provisions of section 18-1-704, any occupant of a dwelling is justified in using any degree of physical force, including deadly physical force, against another person when that other person has made an unlawful entry into the dwelling, and when the occupant has a reasonable belief that such other person has committed a crime in the dwelling in addition to the uninvited entry, or is committing or intends to commit a crime against a person or property in addition to the uninvited entry, and when the occupant reasonably believes that such other person might use any physical force, no matter how slight, against any occupant.
(3) Any occupant of a dwelling using physical force, including deadly physical force, in accordance with the provisions of subsection (2) of this section shall be immune from criminal prosecution for the use of such force.
(4) Any occupant of a dwelling using physical force, including deadly physical force, in accordance with the provisions of subsection (2) of this section shall be immune from any civil liability for injuries or death resulting from the use of such force.
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Since the Make My Day Law came into force, burglary has declined by almost half in Oklahoma. In 1987, there were 58,333 cases; in 2000, just 31,661.
There have now been at least 11 cases where intruders have been shot dead in Oklahoma and the householders who pulled the trigger have escaped any sanction under the Make My Day law.
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Overwhelming support for 'make my day' burglary law
Karyn Miller and Patrick Hennessy, The Sunday Telegraph
Sunday 7 Nov 2004
An overwhelming majority of the public backs the Sunday Telegraph's campaign to give people more rights to protect their homes and families from violent intruders, according to a new survey.
The ICM poll shows that 71 per cent of voters believe that householders should have the "unqualified right to use force, including deadly force if necessary" - against burglars. The wording of the survey question mirrors legislation, introduced in the state of Oklahoma in 1988 and known as the "Make my Day Law", which has halved burglaries.
An even greater proportion of those surveyed - 81 per cent - say that intruders should lose the right to sue for anything that the householder does in self-defence.
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I live in a Make My Day law state.
Come into my house uninvited, you die.
Plain & simple.
I live in America [and a state] where SOME
people's opinion's & thoughts do not risk my safety.
You don't like our laws?
Don't come to America [or my state].
We don't want you.
You want to live? Stay the f*ck out of my house!
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Arrived August, 1999.
We swallow greedily any lie that flatters us, but we sip only little by little at a truth we find bitter.
- Denis Diderot
Real friendship is shown in times of trouble; prosperity is full of friends. - Euripides
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catlind
CH.com Alumnus
New Board Hall of Famer
Taz taught me the cluster dance
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #22 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 11:20pm » |
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on Mar 15th, 2005, 6:16pm, Lizzie2 wrote:Sue me for thinking we should at least make an EFFORT to educate people about safety and trying to make this world a safer place.
It's just that when it comes to guns, people get overly defensive... |
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Ok, I know that I'm going to get flamed for this but I really don't care.
You talk about safety and education and making the world a safer place. In your nursing thread you posted this:
on Mar 14th, 2005, 7:24pm, Lizzie2 wrote:
I had been taking Lortab before, which is a combination of oxycodone and tylenol. It wasn't really working for me, so today he said why dont' I try percocet instead and maybe it will work better. As it turns out, they are the same drug but Percocet is less strong! Ahhhh... If the Lortab wasn't really cutting it, did they really think I was just kinda dumb in prescribing a lesser dose in the form of percocet and would think that would help things better? Or maybe it is just that they can prescribe more amount of percocet because it is less strong. It isn't really like I'm going to need pain meds for long, but I feel like I was tricked behind my back with this one! I hate that!
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I'm not a nurse and I'm not a doctor and I'm not a pharmacist, but everything you can find on the drug lortab and percocet will tell you the same thing. This isn't the first thread you've said that lortab is oxycodone in either, so I doubt it's a simple mistake of typing the wrong thing.
Lortab is hydrocodone and tylenol, and percocet is oxycodone and tylenol. Now according to the pharmacy students, pharmacist and pain doctor, and 3 other doctors I've talked to, oxycodone is stronger than hydrocodone.
You want safety, then start in the profession you are studying and stop worrying about guns. Medication errors kill thousands every year. You regularly discuss medication advice with sufferers here and when I read this comment in your nursing thread, then read your comment here...well sorry, the hypocricy was too much to take. It isn't the first time you've mislabeled lortab as oxycodone.
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A true friend is someone who reaches for your hand and touches your heart
If yer gonna be stupid, ya gotta be tough
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cootie
New Board Hall of Famer
sumday I'm gonna be sumbody........ ..
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #23 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 11:34pm » |
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Don't mind the gun.....beware of OWNER !! I sure the hell got nothin against guns.....we have MANY......most accidents I know of with guns around here jus simply wouldn't of happen'd 'without' the gun. But then.....they wouldn't of happen'd without the person either. What goes around comes around Pam
Yeah percocet and loratab are da same.....I 'think' both come in 5 and 10 mg's. Whatever..........
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Cause and Effect......"Cause is the effect concealed, Effect is the cause revealed"
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Azrael
New Board Hall of Famer
Sometimes... Being good just ain't worth it.
 
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Re: Lets wake up it is time to get real
« Reply #24 on: Mar 15th, 2005, 11:41pm » |
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All'z I know is this... Guns don't kill ppl... Bullets do... Ban bullets now!
PFDAN................................ Drk^Angel
P.S. This has been a public service announcement brought to you by the Biggest Dumbass of the Day Association.
DA
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"Hello police? I would like to report a robbery. Someone stole all my beer while I was drunk."
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