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Topic: Moral high ground (Read 2279 times) |
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marlin
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Moral high ground
« on: Nov 22nd, 2004, 7:07pm » |
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Clinton made a few mistakes. We all do. Now dubya had a mandate?
What's moral high ground?
Is it imposing your will and your beliefs on others ? Is it limiting freedom? Is it outlawing abortion or introducing religion in compulsory school programs?
Not the America I would be proud of.
Fortunately if you examine history all radical swings to the extreme right or left are quickly corrected back toward the center. The moderates generally take control. The supreme court doesn't change quickly and even those with liberal or conservative tendencies will vote toward the center on any given issue.
Dubya's not going to hijack the country. In fact, I doubt he even cares to. America has its faults but the majority of Americans are kind and thoughtful enough to keep it going generally in the right direction...
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nani
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #1 on: Nov 22nd, 2004, 7:11pm » |
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Quote:| Dubya's not going to hijack the country |
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Dubya aside...has the Christian right hijacked the Rebublican party though?
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Jonny
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Here we go....hang on to your seats......LMMFAO 
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Charlie
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #3 on: Nov 22nd, 2004, 7:48pm » |
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Quote:| Dubya aside...has the Christian right hijacked the Rebublican party though? |
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So they think. It's the other way around. The Republicans use them to get elected. They rarely help them out. Fortunately.
The party of moral values deemed that crime pays, shielding Tom DeLay with a rule that someone facing a felony charge can still be a leader.
Janet Jackson's tit on stage! Horrors! Stone her to death!
Marlin's right too. Since its inception, the country zig zags its way to the left. Slowly but surely......
Charlie
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| « Last Edit: Nov 22nd, 2004, 7:50pm by Charlie » |
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nani
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #4 on: Nov 22nd, 2004, 9:00pm » |
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Seems I heard (only a very small part of) a news story about a week after the election that Christian groups were submitting a list of (I forget the exact word but this comes closest-) demands to Bush and Congress. Hmmmm....
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| « Last Edit: Nov 22nd, 2004, 9:01pm by nani » |
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marlin
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #5 on: Nov 22nd, 2004, 9:02pm » |
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on Nov 22nd, 2004, 7:15pm, Jonny wrote:| Here we go....hang on to your seats......LMMFAO |
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nani, who cares? The republicans aren't going to get elected every time. Not even next time. By then they'll be in a panic and will be dumping the hard core bible thumpers like a date that farts in a restaurant. 
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nani
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #6 on: Nov 22nd, 2004, 9:04pm » |
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Marlin- I'm pretty sure that's what we thought last time... 
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don
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If you all had listened to me before the election this discussion wouldn't be neccesary.
I said loud and clear "Al Sharpton is our man!"
Anybody listen?
NOOOOOOOOOOO!
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marlin
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #8 on: Nov 22nd, 2004, 10:23pm » |
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Look, The dems need some serious work. They need to pick a candidate with genuine national appeal. And preferably one that doesn't have "anti viet nam war activist" as his principal crowning achievement if we happen to be in the middle of a conflict regardless how ill concieved... 
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nani
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #9 on: Nov 22nd, 2004, 11:00pm » |
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I'm with you there...I never liked Kerry as "the guy". I personally liked Wesley Clark and Howard Dean was my 2nd choice. But - WOW- that John Edwards is HOT...
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jminmilwaukee
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #10 on: Nov 22nd, 2004, 11:11pm » |
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Beer nuts and deer nuts....botth just under a buck.
Woman, can't live with her....pass the beer nuts.
Bush is what he is. Why stress what it is when your voice doen not matter.
When the majority of the U.S. peoples impose (force) enough of their beliefs onto the "land of the free" I will hop on the fastest boat to England so I may live my life as I choose.
Kinda ironic...don't you think?
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Charlie
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #11 on: Nov 23rd, 2004, 3:37am » |
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To repeat my quote of the day:
"The worst government is the most moral. One composed of cynics is often very tolerant and humane. But when fanatics are on top there is no limit to oppression." ---H. L. Mencken
Quote:| Seems I heard (only a very small part of) a news story about a week after the election that Christian groups were submitting a list of (I forget the exact word but this comes closest-) demands to Bush and Congress. Hmmmm.... |
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Ralph Reed, Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell and their larcenous busybody friends have done this ever since the nauseating "family values" crap became part of politics. The Republicans haven't paid much attention after they won. They do so only close to elections. These groups by their narrow view of the world haven't displayed much in the way of street smarts.
By the way, Jimmi, during the Revolution, loyalists for a very long time outnumbered revolutionaries.
Charlie
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| « Last Edit: Nov 23rd, 2004, 4:23pm by Charlie » |
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tommyD
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #12 on: Nov 23rd, 2004, 6:24am » |
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Must be H.L. Mencken Day...friend just sent me this:
Mencken's Creed
I believe that religion, generally speaking, has been a curse to mankind - that its modest and greatly overestimated services on the ethical side have been more than overcome by the damage it has done to clear and honest thinking.
I believe that no discovery of fact, however trivial, can be wholly useless to the race, and that no trumpeting of falsehood, however virtuous in intent, can be anything but vicious.
I believe that all government is evil, in that all government must necessarily make war upon liberty.
I believe that the evidence for immortality is no better than the evidence of witches, and deserves no more respect.
I believe in the complete freedom of thought and speech...
I believe in the capacity of man to conquer his world, and to find out what it is made of, and how it is run.
I believe in the reality of progress.
I - But the whole thing, after all, may be put very simply. I believe that it is better to tell the truth than to lie. I believe that it is better to be free than to be a slave. And I believe that it is better to know than be ignorant.
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Bob P
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #13 on: Nov 23rd, 2004, 9:36am » |
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I sure like this Thursday when we celebrate the custom started by the Pilgrims. Stopping to thank God for all of His blessings.
It's good to live in a country founded on religious beliefs. And even better to live in one that still embraces those beliefs.
Who do you give thanks to on Thanksgiving?
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| « Last Edit: Nov 23rd, 2004, 9:45am by Bob P » |
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ExplodingEyeBall
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #14 on: Nov 23rd, 2004, 9:41am » |
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on Nov 22nd, 2004, 7:11pm, nani wrote:
Dubya aside...has the Christian right hijacked the Rebublican party though? |
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I hope so.
This country was founded by Christian men based on Christian beliefs.
I think it's time for Christians to take it back.
BTW: Don't bring up the constitutional seperation of Church and State unless you can show exactly where it is in the constitution.
Fire at will. I'm ready for it.
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| « Last Edit: Nov 23rd, 2004, 9:41am by ExplodingEyeBall » |
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john_d
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on Nov 23rd, 2004, 6:24am, tommyD wrote:Must be H.L. Mencken Day...friend just sent me this:
Mencken's Creed
I believe that religion, generally speaking, has been a curse to mankind - that its modest and greatly overestimated services on the ethical side have been more than overcome by the damage it has done to clear and honest thinking.
I believe that no discovery of fact, however trivial, can be wholly useless to the race, and that no trumpeting of falsehood, however virtuous in intent, can be anything but vicious.
I believe that all government is evil, in that all government must necessarily make war upon liberty.
I believe that the evidence for immortality is no better than the evidence of witches, and deserves no more respect.
I believe in the complete freedom of thought and speech...
I believe in the capacity of man to conquer his world, and to find out what it is made of, and how it is run.
I believe in the reality of progress.
I - But the whole thing, after all, may be put very simply. I believe that it is better to tell the truth than to lie. I believe that it is better to be free than to be a slave. And I believe that it is better to know than be ignorant.
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I believe this is a bunch of bullshit opinions peppered with known truths to give it legitimacy.
I believe that whoever wrote that is trying to blame our systems and processes even though what is really wrong is that we are imperfect beings.
I believe that no matter how we change our systems and processes, that whatever results will only be both as beautiful and ugly as we are.
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don
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Quote:| It's good to live in a country founded on religious beliefs. |
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I'm sure the Native American population would love to here all about that theory.
We have only been guests in this land since the the first Pilgrim set foot on the rock and BAD guests at that.
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| « Last Edit: Nov 23rd, 2004, 9:46am by don » |
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Bob P
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #17 on: Nov 23rd, 2004, 9:56am » |
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The Pilgrims and the Native Americans were very friendly toward each other.
Unfortunately some times good things are hijacked by bad people.
Praying the peace and love of God is with all of us this holiday season.
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Mrs. Barlow, I never, and I repeat never, ever pissed in your steam iron.
"SHUT UP HUB!"
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floridian
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Charlie, your theory about the Republican's using the religious right to get elected, and then ignoring them has been true in the past, but will it change? Can the 'fundamental correctness' mob be controlled if it continues to grow? Is the US going to show those Iranians that we can be just as pious and theocratic as they are?
Quote: ... only about a third of Americans believe that Charles Darwin's theory of evolution is a scientific theory that has been well supported by the evidence, while just as many say that it is just one of many theories and has not been supported by the evidence. The rest say they don't know enough to say."
Furthermore, forty-five percent "also believe that God created human beings pretty much in their present form about 10,000 years ago. A third of Americans are biblical literalists who believe that the Bible is the actual word of God and is to be taken literally, word for word." |
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Not sure how many people still believe that the Earth is flat, or that the sun revolves around the Earth.
Alternative stickers for textbooks - some quite humorous:
http://www.swarthmore.edu/NatSci/cpurrin1/textbookdisclaimers/
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| « Last Edit: Nov 23rd, 2004, 10:02am by floridian » |
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marlin
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #19 on: Nov 23rd, 2004, 10:04am » |
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on Nov 23rd, 2004, 9:41am, ExplodingEyeBall wrote:
BTW: Don't bring up the constitutional seperation of Church and State unless you can show exactly where it is in the constitution.
Fire at will. I'm ready for it.
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That's a tired old line. You don't need to travel too far down the document. 1st Amendment?
"Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion"
on Nov 23rd, 2004, 9:41am, ExplodingEyeBall wrote:
This country was founded by Christian men based on Christian beliefs.
I think it's time for Christians to take it back.
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You forgot to say which ones. Every single time I check there's a brand new group of "Christians" with a brand spanking new set of rules. How many sets of new rules can we play by? That's partly what the seperation is about.
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Melissa
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I'm not gonna post, I'm not gonna post, I'm not gonna post, I'm not gonna post, I'm not gonna post... 
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Bob P
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #21 on: Nov 23rd, 2004, 10:10am » |
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Quote:"Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion"
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That being said, why do they make laws banning prayer in school? Why do they order the 10 Commandments removed from public buildings? Seems to be a violation of that ammendment.
Actually, we all realize that amendment gives us freedom of religion, it doesn't say there shall be no connection between church and state.
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| « Last Edit: Nov 23rd, 2004, 10:11am by Bob P » |
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Mrs. Barlow, I never, and I repeat never, ever pissed in your steam iron.
"SHUT UP HUB!"
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ExplodingEyeBall
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #22 on: Nov 23rd, 2004, 10:20am » |
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on Nov 23rd, 2004, 10:04am, marlin wrote:
That's a tired old line. You don't need to travel too far down the document. 1st Amendment?
"Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion"
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OK.. You found the part where we are promised not have any particular religion be forced on us by the government.
I still fail to see anything pertaining to a 'wall of seperation between Church and State'. It isn't there.
There never was a law saying we HAD to have the 10 commandments any where but try to post them anywhere and remind people that there are actually some real God given laws to live by and they go nuts making laws to remove them.
Edited to add:
Rules? That's pretty simple. 10 easy rules to live by. The one list that causes God-less people to cringe nation wide.
The 10 commandments. They haven't change in my life time or yours.
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| « Last Edit: Nov 23rd, 2004, 10:23am by ExplodingEyeBall » |
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Jeepgun
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Moral high ground? In politics? LMMFAO!! There are plenty of mountains, valleys, and lots of high ground, if you've ever seen a topographical map of the ocean floor. 
Politicians claiming to be moral is like a prostitute wearing a wedding dress.
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| « Last Edit: Nov 23rd, 2004, 10:42am by Jeepgun » |
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ExplodingEyeBall
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Re: Moral high ground
« Reply #24 on: Nov 23rd, 2004, 10:39am » |
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on Nov 23rd, 2004, 10:09am, Melissa wrote:| I'm not gonna post, I'm not gonna post, I'm not gonna post, I'm not gonna post, I'm not gonna post... |
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Come on Mel...
If you are tough enough to fight CH, you're tough enough to join in here.
Stand up for what you believe in.
That's what makes all of us special here. We believe what we believe but we all love each other in spite of our differences in opinion, although I may make some enemies today. 
Pat
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