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Topic: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD (Read 671 times) |
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PittsburghJoe
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A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« on: Mar 27th, 2004, 7:23am » |
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I've been reading a lot of threads here, and I've seen a lot of people describing different psych conditions that seem to coexist with CH. I've dealt with bouts of depression throughout my life, like most people have. It wasn't until last year that I was dignosed as having ADD - quite a revelation for being 38 years old!
Anyhow, in reading up on the disorder, I've noticed some things that are common and have been noted among the community of clusterheads here, so I'm just speculating as to any correlation. ADD is often accompanied by other conditions, depression and varying levels of bipolar disorder being two of them (along with various learning disabilities in some cases). Often these conditions arise from feelings of low self esteem, panic, disorganization, and other emotional states stemming from the effect of the ADD mind. Another common factor among people with ADD is a serious streak of creativity, since the general mental disorganization forces people with ADD to see the world in a different way than others, and forcing creative solutions to common problems. This creativity, combined with a more intuitive problem-solving style, is one of the unexpected bonuses of having ADD.
To get to the point, has anyone found any correlation between ADD and CH? I know ADD has a tendency to be over-diagnosed, particularly in children, but it has only been in recent years that the condition has been recognized and studied in adults. It used to be assumed that kids just grew out of ADD, but is it now recognized that this is not the case.
Any thoughts?
Joe
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Tiannia
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #1 on: Mar 27th, 2004, 12:34pm » |
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Have never had issues with ADD or ADHD. Unless you take into account my Topomax side effect of being seriously dizy and have to attention span.
-Tia
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Lizzie2
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #2 on: Mar 27th, 2004, 1:46pm » |
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I have it, but I don't believe it is in any way related. Got diagnosed in the recent years as well...I'm 23.
One thing to watch out for, that I never really thought of before....methylphenidate has the ability to cause some rather nasty headaches itself. If headaches have become more frequent or worse since starting methylphenidate (or any of the brand names), the drug could cause this do a degree. I'm not talking clusterhead pain, but the drug can cause headaches.
Lizzie
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snyder
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #3 on: Mar 27th, 2004, 7:26pm » |
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Joe,
I am a teacher of a few years and as a result know a bit about ADD. I am an artist, have a degree in painting, so I know a tad about creative minds as well. I don’t think the characteristics you describe tell anything more than that you may be suffering from a severe case of individuality. I think that’s a good thing. The profile you lay out fits me too and I think I am a great guy ... with all modesty of course.
Bill
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PittsburghJoe
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #4 on: Mar 27th, 2004, 10:25pm » |
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Bill,
I was just generalizing about ADD traits. Trust me, there's been a LOT of reasons for my being diagnosed with ADD. Distractability, underachievement, procrastination (more than your average procrastinator), thrill-seeking, hyperfocus, etc. I'd love to think I'm just highly individualistic, but unfortunately the signs all point to ADD.
Joe
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Kevin_M
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #5 on: Mar 27th, 2004, 11:08pm » |
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Joe,
I saw a child shrink when I was about five, before ADHD, but that was because of the whole neighborhood's suggestion. Got caught behind the furnace and in the garage with the girl across the street.
Doc diagnosed tension in the family which kid's pick up on easily. I also had a nervous blinking habit due to it. She suggested I pursue my creative talents for some reason. Gave me a notebook and writing pencils to see my drawings. Creativity helps deal with it hopefully more constructively. No art ability, but family tension environment showed up. She was right about that.
Kevin M
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| « Last Edit: Mar 27th, 2004, 11:10pm by Kevin_M » |
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jonny
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #6 on: Mar 28th, 2004, 12:04am » |
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Important Facts About ADHD
? ADHD was voted into existence by the American Psychiatric Association.
? There is no objective test to identify ADHD.
? Experts from across the U.S. at a recent NIH conference failed to provide any scientific evidence to validate ADHD.
? It's a known fact that allergies affect the ability to think and learn.
? Schools, using Child Protective Services and the courts, are forcing parents to drug their children.
? Some students are not prepared for learning in a structured classroom situation.
? Children can learn how to learn to succeed in school.
? Side-effects of drugs used for ADHD include cardiac arrhythmias and psychosis.
? According to a DEA Report: "Ritalin is structurally and pharmacologically similar to amphetamines and cocaine and has the same dependency profile. Ritalin produces amphetamine and cocaine-like reinforcing effects including increased rate of euphoria and drug liking. Treatment with Ritalin in childhood predisposes takers to cocaine's reinforcing effects."
? Basic physiology and research support the fact that sugar can have a negative affect on children's behavior, learning and attention.
? Nutritional deficiencies can cause attention and behavior symptoms.
? There are many health and learning problems that cause ADHD symptoms, many of which can be dealt with at home.
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Alan
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #7 on: Mar 28th, 2004, 12:43am » |
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Damn Jonny,
That's a whole lotta shit you got listed there.....
I've read some of the ADD/ADHD criteria before, and I kinda view it like reading your horoscope. I think any given person can fit into enough categories to be considered for it.
Of course there really are cases where it is valid, but agree that it's just WAY too mis-diagnosed.
Alan
p.s. just what the hell was my horoscope today anyways......
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magman
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #8 on: Mar 28th, 2004, 7:37am » |
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Quote:Damn Jonny,
That's a whole lotta shit you got listed there..... |
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I agree Jonny.....about time somebody said it.
IMHO…instead of trying to find psychosomatic or medical reasons for learning problems, more people should just look to the parents and the home environment.
...the Mag man
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ave
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #9 on: Mar 28th, 2004, 7:55am » |
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And it is usually the parents (or others in the home environment) who demand that doc comes across with that little pill that will clear it all up.
As long as parents are too busy with themselves to start caring for their kids this stupid drugging will go on.
's Why people should think longer about having a family!
Let them get a robodog else.
Sorry. feel strongly 'bout this.
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magman
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #10 on: Mar 28th, 2004, 9:08am » |
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on Mar 27th, 2004, 10:25pm, PittsburghJoe wrote:
Distractability, underachievement, procrastination (more than your average procrastinator), thrill-seeking, hyperfocus, etc. I'd love to think I'm just highly individualistic, but unfortunately the signs all point to ADD.
Joe |
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Well Joe, if all of this points to ADD, then I got it big time... 
underachievement - when not interested
procrastination - yea, but then highly driven at crunch time
thrill-seeking - nothing like getting the adrenaline pumpin
I do think of myself as highly individualistic. I can follow the crowd IF I feel strongly about the topic at hand. But have no problem seeking my own direction and when I feel it is right and I am passionate about the need to act.
I think it is almost ironic that in a land proclaiming freedoms for all…..the minute an individual takes a ‘new and different approach’ their ‘capacity’ comes into question. This is especially true when something is very creative and/or highly-imaginative.
Can one imagine the outcome if Edison, Belle, Franklin, Ford, and the other great visionary minds were students or young adults today?  
Just my 2.5 cents for the day.
Peace,
-Mag man
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snyder
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #11 on: Mar 28th, 2004, 9:32am » |
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I think that -Mag man has things right on the mark. In today's USA it is seen as very abnormal to be different. To be an individual, a free thinker, an aetheist, gay, a skeptic, to simply be sloppy or appear disorganized, to dislike fast or prepackaged food, to be a democrat or heaven forbid an independent, to prefer to engage in conversation about ideas rather than things, to be tolerant of race or people with long hair, to be a man and have long hair, to be a man that cries, etc., .... well to not wear a blue suit and smile all the time means that something must be amiss. Anyone who appears to function outside of the box must need pills or intense counselinng.
I think a lot of the kids, and adults, that are labeled ADD, or ADHD. more likely than not need the encouragement that comes from acceptance and need help focusing their energies in ways that they themselves will find productive and satisfying. We need to broaden the guidelines of measurement being careful to not handicap the creative minds of this country out of ignorance and the need for some abstract level of social compliance.
As my once favorite critic of mine used to say before he lost his mind, "Thats my opinion but I may be wrong."
Bill
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PittsburghJoe
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #12 on: Mar 28th, 2004, 9:51am » |
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Just for the record:
1. My parents were fine. In fact, they refused medication for me for some problems with hyperactivity I had when I was a kid. No need for anyone to speculate on my childhood here, particularly on the evidence of a couple of posts.
2. I'm well aware that many parents look for the "magic bullet" to overcome problems with discipline or motivation. This was not the case with me.
3. I'm not going to go into the scientific aspects of the disorder here. I've done a good bit of reading on both sides of the issue, and have an open mind that in many ways the jury is still out on a good number of psychiatric conditions. Psychiatry and psychology are relatively young sciences, and just how the brain works is not well understood as of yet. Many currently recognized conditions are only able to be diagnosed via taking a history and observing a person's thought processes, rather than by standardized testing procedures.
4. I'm not going to debate whether the disorder actually exists or not, and I don't use it as an excuse or way of playing the victim. Instead, I use the available literature as a means of helping to organize my own thoughts and explore different ways of approaching life to get a better handle on things.
5. Finally, I'm not on ritalin, amphetamine or any other medication. I tried using the medications available (including Straterra, a non-stimulant medication... let's not even go into the side effects of THAT stuff on an adult male!), but I prefer to use a more behavioristic approach to my therapy.
Anyhow, enough out of me. I think I'll know better than to divulge much more about myself around here, other than what is specifially related to cluster headaches. Not a matter of not being able to take the heat, more a matter of sticking to the topic at hand and letting the people who actually know me make their judgments on more complete evidence.
Joe
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| « Last Edit: Mar 28th, 2004, 9:53am by PittsburghJoe » |
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Nothing worth having comes without some kind of fight. Gotta kick at the darkness till it bleeds daylight. - Bruce Cockburn, "Lovers in a Dangerous Time"
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snyder
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #13 on: Mar 28th, 2004, 9:59am » |
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Joe,
Please don't feel attacked for disscussing whatever you think may relate to CH for you here. That is what this place is for, I think.
I thought your topic was a good one and have spent a lot of "head time" with it since you posted it. Don't be discouraged if some of the responses don't fit yet ... they may in time.
Bill
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PittsburghJoe
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #14 on: Mar 28th, 2004, 10:24am » |
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Hey Bill,
Not feeling attacked really, the Beast did that 3 times for me last night, so I know what an attack is.
Just being more cautious with what I reveal is all. I'm gregarious by nature and sometimes overstep in that direction. I need to learn to take a longer "getting to know each other" period before I get too detailed about anything with people. One of life's little lessons, I think.
Joe
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Nothing worth having comes without some kind of fight. Gotta kick at the darkness till it bleeds daylight. - Bruce Cockburn, "Lovers in a Dangerous Time"
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magman
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #15 on: Mar 28th, 2004, 10:32am » |
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Joe,
I have to agree with Bill.
And please pardon my writing style.....I may have started out incorrectly......my point was on individuality and the change in social acceptance of style.
I also speak in a somewhat generic style and try never to relate my posts to the 'specifics' of another clusterbud.
If I offended you in anyway...it was not my intent and offer my apology.
Peace Bro,
-dan
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PittsburghJoe
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #16 on: Mar 28th, 2004, 10:38am » |
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No offense taken Dan, and believe me, I'm as individualistic as they come. I may be a bit touchy due to 3 attack last night and not a lot of sleep. I didn't mean to come across that way, it's just tough to gauge how I sound right now, with some serious sleep deprivation going on over the last couple weeks. Give me time to see my neuro and get new meds going and I'll probably be a bit more clear headed to approach some interaction on this and other topics.
Peace back to ya,
Joe
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Nothing worth having comes without some kind of fight. Gotta kick at the darkness till it bleeds daylight. - Bruce Cockburn, "Lovers in a Dangerous Time"
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snyder
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #17 on: Mar 28th, 2004, 10:39am » |
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Joe,
The most important thing I oftenn forget here on the board is that we are all being attacked by our heads at various times and this is the real background for many of the responses. I felt pressured the first few times I posted here until it was pointed to me and since then I try to keep it in mind. I am keenly aware of how the CHs and meds affect my thinking and realize fully well that it is a certainty in varying degrees for everybody else.
I have no doubt that your diagnosis of ADD is real. I do believe that this condition is diagnosed way too often and money is the catalist for that rather than a focus on the patients. If it gets you help and relief in any way for your CH attacks it is well worth your efforts at persuing it.
On a lighter note, I sure do miss Pittsburgh. I love the place.
Bill
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kindness2others
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #18 on: Mar 30th, 2004, 10:08pm » |
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Hi PittJoe,
I think there is a correlation between the ADD and CH's, considering the biochemistry involved. CH's have shown to have a pretty high comorbidity rate with many other psychiatric conditions, whether we are willing to acknowledge them or not.
Harvard recently recognized some similarities between the two and did a study on using Ritalin to treat clusters. Check out this website for more info:
http://neuro-www.mgh.harvard.edu/forum/ClusterHeadacheF/8.6.987.43AMRita lintoTreatClus
You've asked a very intriguing question and have inspired me to discover more about this possible connection. Thanks!
Take care,
Kindness
_____________________________________________
P.S.
Dear Jonny...
You totally have the right to express that you feel ADD is not a real psychiatric condition; HOWEVER,
I think you need to verify your sources before you post inaccurate information. A great place to start would be the website for the National Institute of Mental Health, a division of the NIH. They are currently funding a study of the efficacy of a multimodal treatment plan for ADD, a disorder which they recognize.
www.nimh.nih.gov
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Kevin_M
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Re: A different Psych topic - ADD/ADHD
« Reply #19 on: Mar 30th, 2004, 10:41pm » |
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on Mar 27th, 2004, 7:23am, PittsburghJoe wrote:I've been reading a lot of threads here, and I've seen a lot of people describing different psych conditions that seem to coexist with CH.
I know ADD has a tendency to be over-diagnosed,
Any thoughts? Joe |
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When I was in A. A. there were different psych conditions which people had.
When I was in N. A. there were different pysch
conditions people had.
I am sure in gamblers anonymous there were different psych conditions which people had along with that also.
These conditions thought associated with CH can be among any one we work with too. They are not any reason for cause. The turmoil CH brings to one's life can upset anyone's balance, yes and lead to a need to be treated for other things. But if one had these other things prior to CH, they will have these other things whether they develop CH or not.
I think I was most insane prior to A. A. and N. A. Seems things change though.
Good books have been written about the thoughts of it being over prescribed, with reasons and repurcussions.
Good detective work found that when the leading group in CA as advocates of the need of ritalin for ADD and ADHD were lobbying for ritalin to become a class C drug, or whatever loosens it's restrictions, it was found that the group had accepted a rather LARGE donation from a company which makes ritalin.
Kevin M
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