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Topic: Religion and CH?? (Read 834 times) |
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Turts
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Religion and CH??
« on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 8:20am » |
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Before I start this post, it in no means is meant to cause any disrepect to any readers. It is a genuine question.
I come from a country where religion does not play as strong a part in the community and culture as it seems to in the US (where it seems most clusterheads seem to post from.) Here it is a family preference and upbringing rather than a community culture.
I see many genuine blessings and prayers being offered to others, and this has made me pose the question.
How many sufferers and supports have found religion since experiencing this illness?
I ask because I am experiencing my THIRD cycle since April, and this has me asking the questions of why am I here, What is my purpose in life.
And these answers only seem to be answered by religion.
Again, this post means no disrespect to individuals or groups, it is a genuine enquiry.
Thanking you in advance for your posts
Turts
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Carl_D
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Hmm...
Actually, I was a 'christian' for a long time. Went to church all the time. After becoming chronic, I began questioning my faith. About three years ago, I started questioning the existence of a true god.
In my own personal perspective conclusion, I came to consider this:
A true loving, caring, merciful god would not afflict 'his people' with sickness, disease and agonizing pain. It is argued that this imperfection came into the world by sin, and sin came in by the devil; a being in which 'god' created. If god was perfect and just, this being would never had been created.
If you have six plants, and you know one is poisonous, are you gonna put it in your garden?
Thus, god would then be imperfect, and so our account of him has to be untrue.
Sorry if this offends anyone, but I simply cannot believe in a god who would damn a world to hell based on the choice to blindly believe or not. To believe in that means I would have to believe alot of good people will spend eternity in agony just for believing something else.
I respect other peoples beliefs, and if they choose to believe in a god, that is fine.
I believe in energies, because they are real. I believe there is an unseen realm. I believe some christian philosiphies as well as bhuddist and wiccan.
I do try to live by the golden rule; to treat others as I would have them treat me.
Okay, enough about that.
Peace,
Carl D
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Hirvimaki
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #2 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 12:13pm » |
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Turts,
This could well be a slippery slope, so I will tread carefully.
I am a religious person. By that I mean I have a comfortable belief in and faith in God. I was raised Catholic, but no longer define myself by (what I consider to be) that limiting and confining standard. I have gone through many phases of belief and disbelief in God and all things spiritual.
The effect that CH has had on my beliefs has been very minimal, other than to strengthen my faith. I know there are people who say that God could not exist because of things such as CH, or that a God who allows such a thing to occur is an uncaring God. To this I actually have very little to say (OK, I really could say quite a lot, but this is not the proper forum for it). Spirituality is a very personal thing. For some, having that faith can be the extra strength they need to cope with and live with adversity. For others, this is not the case.
My suggestion to you would be this: If you find yourself searching for something, LOOK. If you can find comfort and strength within a religion - be it Christianity, Buddhism, Islam, Wicca, et hoc genus omne - then it is certainly worth your time. If you find that it does not offer you anything, then you can leave it be. I don't believe in proselytizing and will not tell you I am right and others are wrong. But I will say my beliefs are right for me, and that is what matters. Look for yourself.
And good luck!
Hirvimaki
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Virginia
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #3 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 12:28pm » |
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This is a pretty sensitive subject since most people on this board have strong feelings on the subject one way or another.
I don't want to get into an argument with anyone on the subject, I only know what I believe.
I was raised as a Catholic but am no longer. I define myself as a born again Christian now. I believe that God is the only One who gets me through everyday. Everything that i have right now is a blessing from God. I can't explain why we have diseases like Clusters, I won't know that answer for a long time to come. I do know that when I started to become chronic I had a huge battle with God. I turned away from him for awhile. But then I realized I needed him more than ever. I KNOW that He exists, I see everytime He answers one of my prayers.
Virginia
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ave
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #4 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 12:29pm » |
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Yes, slippery. What moves me spiritually I could never explain to you. And I would not either.
I believe in doing as I am done by within reason and, as much as I can, doing to others as I would like to be done by.
There is one thing I do not believe in; organised religion.
Gives scope to humanities worst instincts.
But my take on life has not changed since I found clusters, if that is what you mean.
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fubar
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #5 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 12:47pm » |
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I beleive in Barry Bonds.
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FrankF
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #6 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 1:24pm » |
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I think of God often during an attack. "Please God make it stop "... "God you're a bastard for making me have these"...
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vig
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #7 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 1:30pm » |
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I can tell these last 8 years 'awoke' something new inside me that I call a spiritual or emotional life, but there's no correlation between that and religion. Maybe that's what a personal religion is.
I was born and raised Catholic, but any ties to them and respect for what's going on there is lost.
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| « Last Edit: Oct 3rd, 2003, 2:38pm by vig » |
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RevDeFord
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #8 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 1:56pm » |
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Turts,
I want very much to reply in full to your question, but I am at work, and thus it is hard to put all my thoughts together. I will try to do so this weekend.
I became a Christian well after my cluster headaches started, and they did not have any bearing on my decision to follow Christ.
I will try and write more this weekend.
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I don' know why it hurts, but I pray it will stop.
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kissmyglass
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #9 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 1:56pm » |
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I'm as Non relioious as they come.
To each his own as far as I'm concerned.
Kev
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KingOfPain
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #10 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 2:00pm » |
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Interesting.
Of 8 replies (including mine) so far.....
50% Catholic (born, raised, etc...)
I was born & raised Catholic also.
Hmmmmmmm.
Just found this interesting, that's all.
KingOfPain
Modified: At the time I was typing my reply,
it was 8 replies at 50%.
KOP
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| « Last Edit: Oct 3rd, 2003, 2:02pm by KingOfPain » |
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Margi
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #11 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 2:09pm » |
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So, KOP, are you saying that Catholicism causes clusters? 
Also interesting to note is that the folks who did say they were born and raised Catholic, no longer practice. (All, except you, KOP - you didn't mention if you still do).
(with apologies to all the practicing Catholics in the audience).
Margi (who was raised Protestant but is now just good ol' grass roots non-denominational Christian)
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SFChris
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Jeez (sorry for the pun), but I am so proud of this family. A religious post with about 12 replys and not one person trying to convert, bully or push their own beliefs on another! It is very refreshing that their hasn't been any flaming or dogma (from any point of view).
All I can add is "Go Giants" (rock-on Fubar, my brother)
Chris
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Donna
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #13 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 2:49pm » |
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Also ex-Catholic (excommunicated by the church when divorced in 1972). Didn't care to persue.
Born-again Christian in 1976. Church of God, home base in Anderson, Indiana.
Believe pain and suffering brought on by devil trying to test and destroy ones' faith in Christ.
Wouldn't have had the strength to survive without my faith in God........Death of child, suicide of nephew and murder of his son, etc.
Clusters never caused a thought about Gods existance.
Judging is not my privilege.
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RevDeFord
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #14 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 3:49pm » |
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It's all that wine you catholics been a'sippin' at the Holy Communion......that'll getcha everytime ;D
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I don' know why it hurts, but I pray it will stop.
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Charlie
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #15 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 3:49pm » |
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Actually, CH didn't affect my feelings for religion. I was brought up in a family that didn't much care about this stuff. Swedes, you know......
Don't get me wrong, I'm not one who gets all hot and bothered by religious displays and the like. A waste of energy to do so. Do your thing and some of it is quite beautiful.
What we call western civilization is pretty successful because we rarely pay official attention to our "mullahs." Works pretty well so far.
Charlie
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| « Last Edit: Oct 3rd, 2003, 3:52pm by Charlie » |
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tsayswhy
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #16 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 4:13pm » |
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married dutch so christian reform here but the church was alittle to demanding" very strong religion" to many rules for me, beleive in god but doing our pray's at home for now
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OneEyeBlind
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #17 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 4:16pm » |
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Born and raised Catholic as was the rest of my family. Most of us have never given up on religion, just given up on some types of organized religion.
With a true illness though, be it unstoppable clusters or cancer, I think that some of us probably go back to the roots of what we were taught. That there is a life after this which will be better. That's what makes us hold on. That's what makes us able to accept the things that life deals us.
I for one am grateful to all the people who pray on this board. I have recieved tons of prayers when in need.
If something or someone is calling your name .... answer. And see what they are trying to tell you
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Tiannia
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #18 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 5:14pm » |
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Yes it is very refreshing to have a post (not regarding to this Message board but all that I have every seen) that does not have anyone being pushy of thier beliefs.
What I believe is a BASIC TRUTH in this life. This life is not without a lot of pain. There are many times that everyone will question "Why?" and "How could you?" I believe that whatever gives you the strength, support and comfort to get from this day to the next is what is right for you. There is NO Religion that is right or wrong.
For me, I am wiccan (pagan), even tho I was raised non denominational (sp?) Christian, hell I even taught Sunday shcool for 7 years. There is a lot of pain that I have delt with in this life from having rhumidoid (sp?)arthrits from the age of 18, degenerative disks in my lower back and now CH's. Carl D I totally understand where you are coming from.
When I first entered college and started studying counseling and started working with the mentally ill and children, I started questioning my beliefs. I could not beive that a kind and loving GOD would put someone in the one chance that they have on this earth into a life that would be filled with pain. How could HE have a child born into a house where that child would be beaten every day until they died and only given that one chance to experience the wonders that Life has to offer?
So in searching for my answers I learned about and began to see that I was Wiccan. That within the belief that this is not the only life that we will have, I can accept the pain that we all have to feel as it allows us to learn form the experience. That when we leave this life that we can take what we have learned and be able to assist people in our next life who are still learning.
It still does not mean that I like it or that there will not be time that I will question again, but this is what has allowed me to deal with the pain that I have had and that I KNOW will come again. There have been many times that I have cried out in pain and asked why, but the answer for me is always so that you can help.
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eyes_afire
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #19 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 5:27pm » |
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I'm gonna take the easy way out and say:
I agree totally with Ave 
Ave, it was great meeting you at the convention.
Pain is assured. And it sucks. Regardless of how many bad diseases are out there, pain still sucks. Woe unto me if I ever reach the day that pain is good. That would be a massive perversion of values. There is NOTHING GOOD about CH.
--- Steve
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| « Last Edit: Oct 3rd, 2003, 5:27pm by eyes_afire » |
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Mark C
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #20 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 6:02pm » |
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There is obviously both good and evil in this world, the rest is up to mankinds interpretation, and has been since the beginning of time. The basic sprituial principals of all things remain constant, honesty is honesty, compassion, understanding, patience all apply no matter who, where or what you claim to be.....bottom line is we are all in the same boat! CH or not.....and we are not supposed to understand everything, then there would be no mystery of life....
Earthling,
Mark
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Ree
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #21 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 6:12pm » |
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Hi~~ I dont have clusters but support someone that does. I am extremely religious. I am still a practicing Catholic. Dave is a practicing Catholic also...
I believe there are many many roads to God, Love, Mother Earth, Powers that Be, Alah, YaWe, Buda ,Jesus or whatever you call the God you love. I believe He is one and the same. I believe that with or without an organized religion, that being a good person and loving as best we can is MOST important in life. I do believe there are rewards for the gifts we share here on Earth... but also that God (my God the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit) is a very forgiving God... and that we are all entitled to a life in Heaven or the Afterlife someday... I do believe that. I have had a near death experience. I also believe in Heaven because I have seen miracles here on Earth in the faces of my children at birth. I have felt the magic of love here, and know that life is just too wonderful to end when it ends here on Earth. I truly believe that too.
I also believe in evil and there is so much evil rampant in our society... and in all of the world. I believe that evil is out to destroy all of the churches of the world. The Catholic Church has been brought down in these past years and I believe that it will happen in other churches too. I believe that is why God (Jesus, fill in your name) has sent out Angels, that in recent years were so popular to spread good will to everyone in the world.
This is what I believe... some think it sounds like the "Tooth Fairy Story" but it brings me comfort. There are times when my cage gets rattled. There are times when I question my faith. Then I make a visit to our Adoration Chapel at the local parish and I sit with the Eucharist...(the Body and Blood of Jesus Christ) and I feel the warmth in the room. I feel the love of the people also sitting there that believe in HIM too. A stranger walks in and smiles and I feel like we have a special secret. And how could I not believe in that great young man that lived and died so that we could love and be free. I think its a great thing to believe in.
I see alot of God's work being done here everyday and even those of you that say you don't believe in a God... If you believe in Love... well then your in the same place as me... God is Love simple as that... love to you all Ree
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Roxy
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #22 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 6:14pm » |
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on Oct 3rd, 2003, 12:29pm, ave wrote:Yes, slippery. What moves me spiritually I could never explain to you. And I would not either.
I believe in doing as I am done by within reason and, as much as I can, doing to others as I would like to be done by.
There is one thing I do not believe in; organised religion.
Gives scope to humanities worst instincts.
But my take on life has not changed since I found clusters, if that is what you mean.
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ave, I agree totally. You said it much more succinctly and nicer than I would have.
I'm just always thankful that I don't have something worse than ch's.... 
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Ree
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #23 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 6:17pm » |
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I love this thread~~ and would love to hear more about other peoples beliefs... whatever they are or aren't we all have each other and thats what counts... love ree again...
and Ave that is very well said I am just longer winded than you... LOL
ps hi rox
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ckelly181
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Re: Religion and CH??
« Reply #24 on: Oct 3rd, 2003, 6:31pm » |
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Wow - too weird...I'm a former Catholic also. The correlation is uncanny! ((Incense???))
I'm a Christian, used to attend the Assembly of God church. Now I'm a non-church going Christian - for various reasons. My CH had no bearing on any religious/spiritual decisions I've made.
Chris
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